641 posts
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Post by AddisonMizner on Feb 18, 2023 12:05:03 GMT
Do we think that there will be a new cast recording released? I have been reading that there are quite a few changes from the London production.
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 18, 2023 12:29:43 GMT
Not sure where to begin. The show has changed in quite a few different places. Most scenes in act one are different in at least one way or another, with dialogue/lyric changes and “Unbreakable” now replaced with a new song. Act two has less changes and cuts but it still has quite a few. Only a few songs, “I Know You”, “Hunk’s Song”/“Man’s Man”, “Marry For Love” are the same (at least I remember thinking so in the moment). I will say that this is a show I never hated, unliked so many who write about it online and I still don’t. It’s not on par with ALW’s best shows in any way but I enjoy the camp of it all and just allow myself to have fun. I don’t pay all that money WANTING to have a bad time.
A couple things changed for Broadway that need to be fixed though are Linedy’s makeup/appearance pre transformation and then that grey wig they put her in. Carrie at least (to me) had a “Rebel” vibe to her look whereas Linedy just looks beautiful in clothes that aren’t the same as the others in town and that’s not enough of a contrast. The town competition storyline has been cut so the statue is now just there to honor Charming and instead of being spray painted there’s some sort of wrapping around it that’s spray painted with the words “Beauty Is Our Doody” and that’s…ridiculous. Just take the paper or whatever it is off, you don’t need to sing an entire song about finding Cinderella and tying her to a tree over…that.
It’s still early here and I’m not fully awake but happy to answer any questions people have.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 18, 2023 12:49:55 GMT
Not sure where to begin. The show has changed in quite a few different places. Most scenes in act one are different in at least one way or another, with dialogue/lyric changes and “Unbreakable” now replaced with a new song. Act two has less changes and cuts but it still has quite a few. Only a few songs, “I Know You”, “Hunk’s Song”/“Man’s Man”, “Marry For Love” are the same (at least I remember thinking so in the moment). I will say that this is a show I never hated, unliked so many who write about it online and I still don’t. It’s not on par with ALW’s best shows in any way but I enjoy the camp of it all and just allow myself to have fun. I don’t pay all that money WANTING to have a bad time. A couple things changed for Broadway that need to be fixed though are Linedy’s makeup/appearance pre transformation and then that grey wig they put her in. Carrie at least (to me) had a “Rebel” vibe to her look whereas Linedy just looks beautiful in clothes that aren’t the same as the others in town and that’s not enough of a contrast. The town competition storyline has been cut so the statue is now just there to honor Charming and instead of being spray painted there’s some sort of wrapping around it that’s spray painted with the words “Beauty Is Our Doody” and that’s…ridiculous. Just take the paper or whatever it is off, you don’t need to sing an entire song about finding Cinderella and tying her to a tree over…that. It’s still early here and I’m not fully awake but happy to answer any questions people have. Thank you for reporting back. Do you think they have improved the show? Is it better, worse or about the same?
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 18, 2023 13:06:40 GMT
Is the show better? This is what I can’t figure out and thought a lot about last night. It’s the same show but with “a glow up”. The structure is exactly the same almost beat for beat and the changes are just within that. Besides the town competition, no other storyline plots have changed at all. So better? In some ways, probably. But they still haven’t figured out how to make her a “bad” Cinderella. And that’s a problem.
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Post by fiyerorocher on Feb 18, 2023 14:24:56 GMT
Have they patched up any of the plot holes? Most significantly the history between the queen and the stepmother.
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 18, 2023 14:57:33 GMT
Nope. Haven’t touched that. Strangely they cut a line that shears made me laugh at the end when Stepmother says “I Know You” and the Wueen says “no one cares”, they cut that “no one cares”.
The thing that was clunkiest to me always was the Godmother. Now Cinderella goes to the shop and she the Godmother appears there’s new dialogue about shoes and then Cinderella says something like “I get it you’re the Godmother so we can skip all this introduction stuff” which I actually kind of liked.
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 18, 2023 15:15:13 GMT
Another thing they kept (which I find odd) is when she Sebastian calls her a “nob” which I think maybe 1 out of a thousand Americans would understand. Each time I saw it in London, that line got a response but dead silence last night.
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623 posts
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Post by chernjam on Feb 18, 2023 20:00:06 GMT
Hey matt - thanks for the report. As opposed to some on BW who seem trying to out-snark one another and talking about things that have nothing to do with the show, appreciate your sharing. Especially since they seem hell-bent to drive the thing in the ground while pretending to lavish praise on the actors. Story and score wise from the reviews I remember reading last year, the critics were pretty supportive and I won't go so far as ALW to say they were "raves" they were mixed to positive. I'm curious what your thoughts are about the lead. The pre-releases of the pop versions of I know I have a heart didn't really do anything for me, but I don't suspect that version is meant for 49 year old guy I thought the clips of her singing "Bad Cinderella" from the dress rehearsal was okay as a preview. How'd she do with the bigger songs and overall?
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 18, 2023 20:45:50 GMT
My pleasure. My thoughts on Linedy are…she needs some more time to settle into the role and really find her Cinderella. She sounds better in person than on those recordings they released though, so if I were her I’d be pretty angry that they did that.
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287 posts
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Post by singingbird on Feb 18, 2023 23:29:32 GMT
My pleasure. My thoughts on Linedy are…she needs some more time to settle into the role and really find her Cinderella. She sounds better in person than on those recordings they released though, so if I were her I’d be pretty angry that they did that. Thank you for such thoughtful posts! It doesn't sound like the show has had the overhaul so many of us think it needs...
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 19, 2023 1:43:41 GMT
It’s my pleasure. I compare the changes to Cinderella, herself. Totally cosmetic but they don’t change what’s underneath.
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528 posts
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Post by vabbian on Feb 20, 2023 22:40:27 GMT
A perfect Broadway show for the deaf and blind community
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Post by FairyGodmother on Feb 22, 2023 23:42:31 GMT
The Godmother character sounded really interesting in some of the early 'teaser' interviews. Almost as if she was playing with the townspeople, like a dolls house but with added cosmetic surgery. Her story never lived up to that though!
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679 posts
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Post by westendcub on Feb 23, 2023 13:43:46 GMT
How is the ball scene done on Broadway?
We got to spin around the theatre, is there a revolve on stage at the Imperial?
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Post by steve10086 on Feb 23, 2023 13:56:24 GMT
How is the ball scene done on Broadway? We got to spin around the theatre, is there a revolve on stage at the Imperial? That was the only good part of the show!
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Post by mattnyc on Feb 23, 2023 14:53:14 GMT
No. There’s no revolve and I think it looks fine like this. Cinderella now also makes her entrance from upstage instead of from the audience.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 23, 2023 15:30:14 GMT
He must have understood that this has at best a very slim chance of success on Broadway. Given that it was unsuccessful in London, it was clear that a major overhaul of the plot was needed. Why would New York audiences see it differently to London audiences? On the other hand, I don't really believe in pandering to popular opinion / tastes, so I do admire standing by your own work and saying "This is the musical I and my collaborators have written, if it fails it fails, so be it". So far, audience reactions to the Broadway previews suggest it will (and that doesn't surprise me one bit). However, an artist who bends over backwards to change music / plots just to appease audiences would strike me as lacking integrity.
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914 posts
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Post by karloscar on Feb 23, 2023 20:10:47 GMT
You can have all the integrity you like,but it won't make you any money in commercial theatre if you don't have a production people want to pay for.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 23, 2023 20:38:58 GMT
You can have all the integrity you like,but it won't make you any money in commercial theatre if you don't have a production people want to pay for. Sure, but that's kind of my point. I value artistic integrity over commercial even if I don't like what the artist has done.
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914 posts
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Post by karloscar on Feb 24, 2023 19:59:57 GMT
I could see your point if this was an innovative or unusual piece of art, and it would take some years for audiences to catch up with the artistic vision. This is a derivative and dull piece, full of boring ballads that needs a major edit on the score and a rewrite of the book to begin to be a coherent and entertaining musical. It's not pandering to the audience to fix pretty obvious problems.
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Post by steve10086 on Feb 24, 2023 20:09:13 GMT
Previously, when he worked with people who were at the top of their game (lyricists, directors, designers etc) a lot of the re-writes and quality control would have happened before a show reached the public. Now he works with Yes Men, gives the public crap, and stamps his feet and throws a tantrum when they don’t like it.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 24, 2023 23:43:34 GMT
I could see your point if this was an innovative or unusual piece of art, and it would take some years for audiences to catch up with the artistic vision. This is a derivative and dull piece, full of boring ballads that needs a major edit on the score and a rewrite of the book to begin to be a coherent and entertaining musical. It's not pandering to the audience to fix pretty obvious problems. Do you not understand my argument? Yes, it's pandering to an audience if you don't agree with the audience. Integrity is about the artist, not the work; it's about doing something that you believe in. I love the way you present your personal opinions about ALW's work as if they are objective facts. In your posts on the subject of ALW to date you have shown that you are incapable of balanced critique. You simply dislike ALW and have nothing substantive or interesting to say about his work.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 25, 2023 0:12:03 GMT
Previously, when he worked with people who were at the top of their game (lyricists, directors, designers etc) a lot of the re-writes and quality control would have happened before a show reached the public. Now he works with Yes Men, gives the public crap, and stamps his feet and throws a tantrum when they don’t like it. And assuming what you say is true about rewrites etc., that's all ALW's fault? His collaborators are entirely blameless? They can do no wrong it seems.
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Post by Oliver on Feb 25, 2023 0:19:25 GMT
Previously, when he worked with people who were at the top of their game (lyricists, directors, designers etc) a lot of the re-writes and quality control would have happened before a show reached the public. Now he works with Yes Men, gives the public crap, and stamps his feet and throws a tantrum when they don’t like it. Also, regarding the argument about "yes men", how come he worked with Hal Prince no less than three times (on Evita, Phantom and Whistle Down The Wind)? How come he asked Trevor Nunn to work with him on three productions (CATS, Sunset Boulevard, and Woman in White)? Presumably you would not consider these directors "yes men"? Musicals are a collaborative form, however, so you are going to need to work with people you can get along with creatively.
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Post by steve10086 on Feb 25, 2023 1:48:16 GMT
Previously, when he worked with people who were at the top of their game (lyricists, directors, designers etc) a lot of the re-writes and quality control would have happened before a show reached the public. Now he works with Yes Men, gives the public crap, and stamps his feet and throws a tantrum when they don’t like it. Also, regarding the argument about "yes men", how come he worked with Hal Prince no less than three times (on Evita, Phantom and Whistle Down The Wind)? How come he asked Trevor Nunn to work with him on three productions (CATS, Sunset Boulevard, and Woman in White)? Presumably you would not consider these directors "yes men"? Musicals are a collaborative form, however, so you are going to need to work with people you can get along with creatively. No, I would not consider Hal Prince or Trevor Nunn to be “yes men”. That’s my point! He used to work with good people. Now he has Laurence “I’ll direct any old $hit” Connor.
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