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Post by interval99 on Jan 24, 2022 16:19:19 GMT
Some good news at least. Theatres and freelancers doing more to protect audiences and staff than the Government: Total PR bluff we saw all the impact of theatres saying wear masks and show passes back last year and then not a single check or comment as you walked in and they crammed us into packed bar areas while waiting for the auditorium to open. LW theatres had the full warning on their site to do a lateral flow test and then did no check at all even for the pass.
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Post by zahidf on Jan 24, 2022 18:17:45 GMT
Some good news at least. Theatres and freelancers doing more to protect audiences and staff than the Government: Things going well enough so that restrictions are being being removed is good news... Be interested in the audience agreement to this now its not a legal requirement
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Post by sfsusan on Jan 24, 2022 19:24:39 GMT
then not a single check or comment as you walked in... While I agree that the crowded lobbies of some theaters were just stupid given the rules/guidelines, every single London theater I went to requested and inspected vaccination proof (and Cabaret definitely checked for negative test results). I still wish theaters offered COVID-aware performances for those people willing to pay more to have more distancing.
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Post by interval99 on Jan 24, 2022 22:08:05 GMT
Atg sent out a questionnaire over the weekend on options for theatre and one question covered all options for entry from showing lateral flow result to just walk in so guess we will see what the people say if atg keep their current procedures. Atg theatres are the only ones I have had to show the covid pass.
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Post by theatreian on Jan 24, 2022 22:16:33 GMT
Yes I had to show the covid pass last week when I saw Bat out of Hell at ATG Alex in Birmingham. I have had reminders from The Shaftsbury and Apollo Victora about showing it this weekend.
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Post by maggiem on Jan 25, 2022 14:08:30 GMT
I went to the Lowry in November 21 for "Dial M for Murder" and Blackpool Opera House for "Hairspray in December. No LFT text/emails asked for nor proof of vaccination either. I was very surprised. Still have my Covid vaccination pass letter, and I'm not getting rid, just in case!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2022 14:58:04 GMT
They were inspecting Covid passes at Phantom a few weeks ago, but I'd gone to the matinee of Heathers earlier that day and all they inspected was my ticket. I remember reading somewhere from The Other Palace that because it's a smaller seated venue, Covid passes weren't required, but masks were.
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Post by zahidf on Jan 28, 2022 16:23:59 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 28, 2022 17:23:24 GMT
Surely it would be just safer if theatres had a no mask/no exemptions = no entry policy on tickets sold going forward.
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Post by The Matthew on Jan 29, 2022 9:31:34 GMT
Nearly everybody in Sainsbury's and Waitrose this morning had a mask on, though one had it below his nose because apparently some people leave their brains in neutral.
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Post by NeilVHughes on Jan 29, 2022 14:22:27 GMT
On the extremely busy train to Bristol this morning didn’t see anyone not wearing a mask.
Not what I was expecting, people seem to be naturally continuing with mask wearing or in the noise of all the partying the message that masks are no longer mandatory only advisory hasn’t registered.
Sitting in the Bristol Old Vic and masks seem to be being worn by everyone.
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Post by longinthetooth on Jan 29, 2022 15:28:15 GMT
Earlier this month my Covid pass was checked at both the Palladium and the Sondheim. A bit strange at the Sondheim - they checked the pass, then handed me a piece of paper with a tick on it, which I then had to hand in to another member of staff further along the line!
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Post by basi1faw1ty on Jan 30, 2022 20:41:14 GMT
Very much 50/50 for customers masking up inside my local ASDA yesterday. Nearly all the staff were maskless.
I'm not judging, I'm just pointing it out.
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Post by theatreian on Jan 30, 2022 23:34:30 GMT
Mixed mask wearing this weekend in London.Not been since Feb 2020. &Juliet very good, Wicked poor and Taboo also poor.Covid passes checked at all three shows.Mostly good on tubes and buses.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2022 15:37:10 GMT
Now backtracking on mandatory vaccinations for NHS frontline staff. What about those in the care sector who lost their jobs over it.
I am pro vaccine and it does annoy me people who won't have it and then take up NHS resources due to the consequences of it. But then people do have the right of choice and I vary been wanted rules enforced and then broken.
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Post by christya on Feb 2, 2022 13:40:24 GMT
I'm annoyed about them backtracking on this. If I or my family have to go into hospital, I don't want an unvaccinated nurse anywhere near us. I'm sick of hearing about choice - what about the choice of already sick patients to not be exposed to someone who didn't bother with the vaccine? Will we be able to refuse to see these people, or are we supposed to just cross our fingers?
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Post by Mark on Feb 2, 2022 14:18:37 GMT
I'm annoyed about them backtracking on this. If I or my family have to go into hospital, I don't want an unvaccinated nurse anywhere near us. I'm sick of hearing about choice - what about the choice of already sick patients to not be exposed to someone who didn't bother with the vaccine? Will we be able to refuse to see these people, or are we supposed to just cross our fingers? I guess the question is - would you rather have an unvaccinated nurse or no nurse at all. Because that is the situation you could be in.
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Post by southstreet on Feb 2, 2022 14:23:33 GMT
Hi Chrysta, genuine question, so this is not me being confrontational, I am just wondering why you wouldn't want to be treated by a nurse who isn't vaccinated? Is it principle or is it because you are worried about getting infected?
I am totally pro-vaccine, think everyone should get themselves vaccinated and back in the OG and Alpha days of Covid, I was already slightly wary of mandating vaccines for NHS and Care staff, because I believe people should have a choice, but in that case I was willing to see the greater good for patients safety. But since Delta and especially Omicron, I don't think the mandate is justified, as the vaccination does fairly little to stop infection now and is mainly something that stops the illness becoming severe if you are infected.
I am triple-vaxxed and currently on day 9 of my Covid infection (which funnily enough, I caught at the theatre) and I have several friends who are also boosted and also currently have Covid. So I personally don't think the vaccination status of a nurse matters, what matters is if they are testing regularly and are Covid free when they are treating patients.
There is obviously the flip side of the likelihood of unvaccinated nurses developing more severe symptoms and potentially being a burden on the NHS if they need treatment, but that is the same for any unvaccinated person, regardless of their profession. So I would like everyone to get vaccinated, but personally, don't feel comfortable forcing people to.
As I said, this isn't me trying to be confrontational, I am just interested in other points of view. :-)
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Post by poster J on Feb 2, 2022 14:30:29 GMT
Personally I wouldn't want to be treated by unvaccinated medical personnel because I think they are huge hypocrites.
They want people to be careful to reduce the spread of Covid so that the healthcare system can try to get back to some sort of normality, yet they won't take a simple action to be part of that themselves. I see it as a form of dereliction from their codes of ethics that are effectively based on the hippocratic oath.
For example, the modern version of the oath includes the following:
"I will respect the hard-won scientific gains of those physicians in whose steps I walk"
"I will apply, for the benefit of the sick, all measures [that] are required"
"I will prevent disease whenever I can, for prevention is preferable to cure."
Medical personnel who refuse the vaccine without a valid medical exemption are in my view acting against all of the above. They can have freedom of choice, but that goes hand in hand with facing the consequences of their choice, which they don't seem to want to do.
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Post by southstreet on Feb 2, 2022 14:49:16 GMT
Fair enough, I get that. Though these days the vaccine no longer prevents disease or has much impact on the spread, it just decreases the potential severity, so not sure how much the last two points still fit with it. I appreciate your reasoning though, I personally would also prefer to be treated by a nurse whose morals I agree with (non-racist, non-homophobic, non-Tory, etc) but I don't think it's something I have much of a choice over. In a lot of cases I choose to no longer buy products or services from people that I don't agree with on certain fundamental levels. But when it comes to healthcare that is difficult as we don't get to choose our nurses. As long as I don't get subjected to anti-vax or racist rhetoric, etc by nurses and they test and are safe and trained to treat me, then that is what I'll have to take I guess.
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Post by christya on Feb 2, 2022 15:35:30 GMT
I don’t want to be treated by an unvaccinated nurse for many reasons, but the main one is that if they don’t care enough about protecting their patients to get vaccinated, I don’t trust them. I don’t want them near me, and in most situations I absolutely would prefer no nurse at all. If there’s a shortage, then at least if I need a non-urgent procedure, it might be delayed but I know when it happens that I’ll be under the care of someone who takes their responsibility to patients seriously. Without a mandate, I have no idea whether the person supposedly helping me has bothered to take a basic, free measure in order to ensure (as far as is possible) that I’m not infected by them.
Unvaccinated people aren’t welcome in my home, I certainly don’t want them near me if I’m already ill.
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Post by sfsusan on Feb 2, 2022 16:03:53 GMT
the vaccination does fairly little to stop infection now and is mainly something that stops the illness becoming severe if you are infected. I'm not sure that's entirely correct... the vaccination does stop the spread of infection because those who are vaccinated tend to have milder cases (less virus present in the host's system) and tend to be contagious for shorter periods of time (the virus drops below the level needed for transmission within a few days). "Public health benefits of vaccination may have been underestimated, as COVID-19 vaccines not only protect against acquisition of infection, but also appear to protect against transmission of infection." From www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-28199-7"For previous variants, the World Health Organisation said symptoms could begin to develop anywhere between two days and two weeks after infection. "However, the incubation period for Omicron is believed to be much shorter – between three and five days. "It is believed people are at their most infectious one to two days before the onset of symptoms, and during the two to three days afterwards." From inews.co.uk/news/health/covid-contagious-when-most-how-long-symptoms-last-omicron-incubation-period-explained-1386600(I apologize for the sneaky video that auto-starts...)
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Post by The Matthew on Feb 2, 2022 16:07:27 GMT
I guess the question is - would you rather have an unvaccinated nurse or no nurse at all. Because that is the situation you could be in. Would you rather have a drunk nurse or no nurse at all?
I can't think of any other situation where society tries to set up professional standards but then some of the staff affected don't want to follow them so we go "OK, we just won't have standards". People are acting at though refusing to be vaccinated is a reasonable position to hold. It isn't. It's not remotely reasonable, and I don't want to be treated by a scientifically illiterate nurse who thinks that social media is a better source of medical information than epidemiology.
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Post by theatreian on Feb 2, 2022 16:22:57 GMT
I quite agree. How anyone who works for the NHS can think they are in the right for not being vaccinated is beyond me.
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Post by southstreet on Feb 2, 2022 17:08:06 GMT
the vaccination does fairly little to stop infection now and is mainly something that stops the illness becoming severe if you are infected. I'm not sure that's entirely correct... the vaccination does stop the spread of infection because those who are vaccinated tend to have milder cases (less virus present in the host's system) and tend to be contagious for shorter periods of time (the virus drops below the level needed for transmission within a few days). I am not saying it doesn't do anything but you're still infectious when you have it, even if you're vaccinated and people will be (or should be) isolating until they test negative again, so an unvaccinated nurse wouldn't be back at work until they are no longer infectious. Anyway, I am in no way advocating against people getting vaccinated, I am all for it for all the reasons mentioned, but I just don't think people should be forced to, not since it doesn't stop people from getting infected themselves or infecting others, that is all. I am however all for people being mandated to wear masks in crowded indoor settings when levels of infections are high, because that is a much bigger problem in terms of infecting people than someone's vaccination status.
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Post by TallPaul on Feb 2, 2022 18:08:20 GMT
My mother was discharged from hospital just this morning, after a three and a bit week stay. So on her behalf, I'd like to add my two penneth, direct from the real world.
She couldn't give a tinker's cuss if those caring for her were vaccinated or not. Respectfully, the stakes are somewhat higher for her than the vast majority of TB members.
She's from the wartime generation, you see. Nothing fazes them.
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Post by sfsusan on Feb 2, 2022 18:08:21 GMT
I just don't think people should be forced to, not since it doesn't stop people from getting infected themselves or infecting others, that is all. Seat belts don't stop people from getting killed in auto accidents (although they massively reduce the likelihood), yet we accept that those are mandated. No law is 100% effective, yet we still make and enforce them. Some reduction in harm is better than no reduction in harm.
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Post by southstreet on Feb 2, 2022 19:35:40 GMT
I just don't think people should be forced to, not since it doesn't stop people from getting infected themselves or infecting others, that is all. Seat belts don't stop people from getting killed in auto accidents (although they massively reduce the likelihood), yet we accept that those are mandated. No law is 100% effective, yet we still make and enforce them. Some reduction in harm is better than no reduction in harm. I always use the seatbelt analogy with regards to masks and I think that is comparable. This is a vaccination, which I personally think is different as it’s more invasive than an external application of a mask or seatbelt. The role of Covid vaccines has changed a lot since Delta and even more so since Omicron. We originally thought the vaccines would stop us getting Covid and with the OG or Alpha versions that probably was the case for the majority of people. But it no longer stops infection and whilst it reduces how long you’re infectious for, you will still be infectious. I mean, where do we draw the line? Do we force nurses and care workers to take vitamins so that it’s less likely they will get a bad cold or the flu and pass that on to their patients? Anyway, I respect your opinion on this and if we didn’t have Delta and Omicron and the vaccine would actually stop infection and infectiousness, I would probably (very reluctantly) side with the mandate. But with the variants we’re dealing with now, I personally don’t agree with it anymore.
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Post by Dawnstar on Feb 2, 2022 20:49:24 GMT
Very sad to see 534 deaths reported today & worrying to read of this sub-variant that might be even more infectious than the original omicron. With every variant more infectious than the last, it feels like eventually everyone in the world will have covid all at once & continuously!
As for medical personnel being unvaccinated, I would find it very difficult to trust the medical judgement of a doctor or nurse caring for me if I knew they were unvaccinated.
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Post by Roxie on Feb 2, 2022 22:19:37 GMT
Very sad to see 534 deaths reported today & worrying to read of this sub-variant that might be even more infectious than the original omicron. With every variant more infectious than the last, it feels like eventually everyone in the world will have covid all at once & continuously! As for medical personnel being unvaccinated, I would find it very difficult to trust the medical judgement of a doctor or nurse caring for me if I knew they were unvaccinated. Regarding the 534 deaths yesterday that figure was cumulative I can’t remember exactly what it was but it wasn’t the actual deaths yesterday. If you’re on Twitter a couple of accounts I’d recommend are covid fact check and coronavirus good news! The scenario you’re worrying about is statistically impossible! It might feel like everyone’s got covid at the same time but they haven’t. People recover and then others get ill etc. I know People who’ve had it 2 or 3 times and been fine and some people (myself and my parents) have never had it! And it’s not like we stay at home or do much mitigation other than mask wearing and have our jabs! I think covid is mutating to become a milder but more infectious virus, which is what nearly every virus does. Viruses exist to replicate and spread and they can’t do that effectively if they’re too deadly so they evolve so they can spread rapidly and make the host (us) not ill enough to die or be confined cos then how does it spread easily? with regards to medical staff, a lot of medical staff Don’t want the vaccine. They’re not anti vaxx it’s a personal choice. I’ve got a doctor friend who is not having the vaccine because he thinks he doesn’t need it and he is concerned there’s no long term safety data and about the incidences of heart inflammation . If anything, I respect the choice of medics not to get vaccinated more so because they will have made an educated decision rather than listening to Facebook memes! We can’t force vaccines on people via coercion it’s unethical. Finally Dawnstar, I’ve noticed from your other posts that you are very anxious about covid still, and I understand. I have anxiety and I was an absolute MESS at the start of the pandemic but I came through the other side with help and I’m feeling pretty chill now tbh. I’ve kinda done a 180 in that now I feel like life has to go on and we have to make the most of it! That’s me though, we’re all different! If you are suffering anxiety to the point it’s ruining your life, there is help available. I urge you to go to your GP if you’re struggling, and my DMs are always open if u wanna chat
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