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Post by stagebyte on Nov 5, 2021 1:45:18 GMT
I was gonna say it’s almost history repeating itself with the Sunset fiasco, that started with Andy inviting the NY times over to review it in London (after he said he wouldn’t) and then throwing a tantrum and blaming Patti and everyone besides himself when they didn’t like the show. I hope Carrie sues him and gets her own swimming pool out of it LOL Weirdly she didn’t play Cinderella on the night they were in. It was the alternate. Odd for such an important review. They liked Georgina. |
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Post by inthenose on Nov 5, 2021 2:39:02 GMT
I've heard it from two different sources, and if you connect the dots with what Baz tweeted... I've also heard something similar happened from a very trusted source who would know particularly in this case |
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Post by chernjam on Nov 5, 2021 2:46:58 GMT
Just to clear up some confusion: the NY Times reviewed the show back in August and gave it a good notice: www.nytimes.com/2021/08/19/theater/andrew-lloyd-webber-cinderella.html Not sure about the claim ALW invited the NY Times to Sunset's World Premiere. At the time I remember reading that Frank Rich (who was deemed the Butcher of Broadway for his reviews being able to kill a show) had basically gotten a ticket and just went citing the "global interest" in the show. The NY Post review (which was recently) actually sounded a bit more critical than the NY Times to me, but was far from scathing. If I had to guess - and that's all it is - but the Phantom re-opening in NY was pretty well received and ALW had to have been on high about that and somewhat miffed that the West End production was altered as much as it was (musicians, production itself) He made a veiled reference to the size of the orchestra saying something along the lines of "this is the size it should be." I wonder if some of the cost-saving moves they made to Cinderella, as well as the additional financial hits he took to bring it to the West End (reduced audience, postponing the opening/closing to quarantine, etc) coupled with a lot of people taking days off for a show that's only open about 3 months now just set him off. People are ready to rush to the defense of Actors "Actors aren't machines" - well neither are composers. Maybe they all need to take a breath recognize their humanity and the mutual need to respect what others are going through (as well as remember we don't always know the struggles another person is dealing with). |
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Post by LaLuPone on Nov 5, 2021 2:51:27 GMT
chernjam the claim that ALW invited the NY Times to Sunset Boulevard in London (after promising he wouldn’t) is in the Sunset Boulevard section of Patti LuPone’s autobiography. And I’d take her word over Andy’s any day. Remember how much sh*t this man has talked in just the last few months “you’ll have to arrest me if you want to stop me opening Cinderella” etc. 🙄
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Post by Theatre Fan on Nov 5, 2021 4:19:42 GMT
From Baz - Andrew Lloyd Webber is revamping his Cinderella musical after the production was savaged by the new ‘Butcher of Broadway’, New York Post theatre critic Johnny Oleksinski. Critics here gave Cinderella mostly 4-5 star reviews; though not all were raves. But Lloyd Webber was so incensed by what ran in the Post — Oleksinski called it ‘joyless’ and said 30 minutes needed to be cut for it to have any chance of transferring to NY — that he took it out on the cast, berating them down the phone from his Mallorca holiday home. The call was broadcast over loudspeakers while the actors were sitting on stage, preparing to perform at the Gillian Lynne Theatre last Friday evening. Cont - www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-10167861/BAZ-BAMIGBOYE-Cinders-got-little-hot-collar.html |
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Post by karloscar on Nov 5, 2021 4:33:58 GMT
The cast can only work with the material they're given. Get your head down and do the necessary edits and rewrites SurAndrew! ( And don't forget most Americans won't get the feeble attempts at humour anyway.)
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 5:30:44 GMT
This is classic alw, he does this kind of thing with every show of his that isn't a hit. Everyone gets blamed except him.
Its not right, but also people shouldn't be surprised either.
I think this is the kind of review cinderella would have got more of across all press if it opened in normal times. He got a pass and support for opening after covid.
If it does make it to NYC I imagine a new creative team and cast will be in place.
One good thing is alw may finally drop Laurence O'connor as a director and chf's ego may get a bit of a knock.
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Post by inthenose on Nov 5, 2021 5:55:57 GMT
From Baz - Andrew Lloyd Webber is revamping his Cinderella musical after the production was savaged by the new ‘Butcher of Broadway’, New York Post theatre critic Johnny Oleksinski. Critics here gave Cinderella mostly 4-5 star reviews; though not all were raves. But Lloyd Webber was so incensed by what ran in the Post — Oleksinski called it ‘joyless’ and said 30 minutes needed to be cut for it to have any chance of transferring to NY — that he took it out on the cast, berating them down the phone from his Mallorca holiday home. The call was broadcast over loudspeakers while the actors were sitting on stage, preparing to perform at the Gillian Lynne Theatre last Friday evening. Cont - www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-10167861/BAZ-BAMIGBOYE-Cinders-got-little-hot-collar.html ? Any thoughts? |
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Post by forevercolours on Nov 5, 2021 6:19:08 GMT
If this is app true, I find it disgusting that ALW is taking this out in the cast. The performances they give are one of the things that is always praised in reviews of the show, whether people enjoyed it or not. I personally really disliked the show but I thought everyone on stage performed well, given the weak material. If anyone is to blame, it’s the creatives for creating a lacklustre show. The performers are the saving grace.
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Post by danb on Nov 5, 2021 6:37:57 GMT
Totally this. The cast perform what they’ve been given with gusto, and how they’ve been asked to give it with full commitment despite the cringeworthiness of some of it.
If this story is true, he should be thoroughly ashamed of himself. This is the traditional cycle for most of his bigger shows and it just goes to show how out of touch he is. A few minutes reading the internet could’ve told him all of it months ago.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 7:08:30 GMT
This is classic alw, he does this kind of thing with every show of his that isn't a hit. Everyone gets blamed except him. Yes, but he usually waits until the next production opens before saying how much the previous one sucked.
The show has an immensely talented cast but they can only work with the tools they're given, no matter how important one particular tool thinks he is.
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Post by max on Nov 5, 2021 7:12:26 GMT
This is classic alw, he does this kind of thing with every show of his that isn't a hit. Everyone gets blamed except him. Its not right, but also people shouldn't be surprised either. I think this is the kind of review cinderella would have got more of across all press if it opened in normal times. He got a pass and support for opening after covid. If it does make it to NYC I imagine a new creative team and cast will be in place. One good thing is alw may finally drop Laurence O'connor as a director and chf's ego may get a bit of a knock. Most of us are assuming that this event (the phone call to cast) did happen as reported. While the NY Post review was mainly encouraging, but saw flaws in the creative team - apart from the score - most comments disagree with both the substance and style of anyone speaking to a cast in this way, which must have felt so personal. As does your comment Mark84, about CHF - you criticise ALW but then a few lines below come out with that gleeful kick. |
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Post by ceebee on Nov 5, 2021 8:04:16 GMT
Let's face it, they focused on the wrong stuff. The gay "twist", the sexualisation of a community, the marginalisation of Cinderella, instead of being brave and trusting their instincts. "Sea Witch" needs to be shoe-horned in, Adam Lambert hired, and the second half should be a headbanging rock fest instead of lots of drippy ballad reprises. They lost their bottle when they dropped the Sea Witch and created a vacuum for the plot to roll around aimlessly. Typical Laurence Connor direction - some heavy punctuation littered with padding.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Nov 5, 2021 8:11:59 GMT
The creatives all seemed incredibly smug. Emerald Fennel seemed to think she’d written the wittiest thing in MT history, with “lots of gratuitous swearing ho ho ho”.
Pride comes before a fall.
i remember Gillian Lynne recounting that on the first night of Cats they we’re all in the bar sh*tting themselves waiting for the interval reaction because they thought they’d got a Turkey on their hands. Bit more of that attitude needed maybe.
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Post by danb on Nov 5, 2021 8:16:35 GMT
Humility? No chance 😂
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2021 8:28:29 GMT
This is classic alw, he does this kind of thing with every show of his that isn't a hit. Everyone gets blamed except him. Its not right, but also people shouldn't be surprised either. I think this is the kind of review cinderella would have got more of across all press if it opened in normal times. He got a pass and support for opening after covid. If it does make it to NYC I imagine a new creative team and cast will be in place. One good thing is alw may finally drop Laurence O'connor as a director and chf's ego may get a bit of a knock. Most of us are assuming that this event (the phone call to cast) did happen as reported. While the NY Post review was mainly encouraging, but saw flaws in the creative team - apart from the score - most comments disagree with both the substance and style of anyone speaking to a cast in this way, which must have felt so personal. As does your comment Mark84, about CHF - you criticise ALW but then a few lines below come out with that gleeful kick. Because I believe in karma and while I don't think the cast deserve it at all, poor behaviour and attitude goes beyond alw and sometimes its nice to see what goes around comes around. Regardless, alw is focusing his frustration at the wrong people, and he himself needs to take the blame more than anyone else. He is very much the captain of the ship, he signed off on everything and steered the direction the creatives took. He isn't just some small-time composer. Also him taking that attitude is not going to help staff moral to put on a good show. The article wasn't even that bad, this now just draws more attention to it. But maybe cinderella in the headlines is what he wants. The changes are going in on the gala night after all. |
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Post by Someone in a tree on Nov 5, 2021 8:34:30 GMT
The creator blaming the cast for his artistic choices from the luxury of his Mallorca holiday home.
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Post by steve10086 on Nov 5, 2021 8:36:57 GMT
Let's face it, they focused on the wrong stuff. The gay "twist", the sexualisation of a community, the marginalisation of Cinderella, instead of being brave and trusting their instincts. "Sea Witch" needs to be shoe-horned in, Adam Lambert hired, and the second half should be a headbanging rock fest instead of lots of drippy ballad reprises. They lost their bottle when they dropped the Sea Witch and created a vacuum for the plot to roll around aimlessly. Typical Laurence Connor direction - some heavy punctuation littered with padding. I’m confused. Cinderella’s biggest fan has now jumped ship? |
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Post by steve10086 on Nov 5, 2021 8:42:45 GMT
Or maybe it's just a fun show that is right for the current climate. The usual suspects can be found in this thread and the Phantom thread carping about ALW and quality of shows. Yet the critics and many others disagree. That's life. This annoyed me at the time, but even more so given the post I quoted directly above this one! Hypocrite. |
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Post by Someone in a tree on Nov 5, 2021 8:43:18 GMT
Let's face it, they focused on the wrong stuff. The gay "twist", the sexualisation of a community, the marginalisation of Cinderella, instead of being brave and trusting their instincts. "Sea Witch" needs to be shoe-horned in, Adam Lambert hired, and the second half should be a headbanging rock fest instead of lots of drippy ballad reprises. They lost their bottle when they dropped the Sea Witch and created a vacuum for the plot to roll around aimlessly. Typical Laurence Connor direction - some heavy punctuation littered with padding. I’m confused. Cinderella’s biggest fan has now jumped ship? I was thinking the same but thought I was just high on new ABBA tracks |
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Post by stuart on Nov 5, 2021 8:53:57 GMT
Looks like Carrie’s latest Vlog is from Saturday and nothing seems too out of the ordinary?
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Post by cezbear on Nov 5, 2021 9:05:57 GMT
Most of us are assuming that this event (the phone call to cast) did happen as reported. While the NY Post review was mainly encouraging, but saw flaws in the creative team - apart from the score - most comments disagree with both the substance and style of anyone speaking to a cast in this way, which must have felt so personal. As does your comment Mark84, about CHF - you criticise ALW but then a few lines below come out with that gleeful kick. Because I believe in karma and while I don't think the cast deserve it at all, poor behaviour and attitude goes beyond alw and sometimes its nice to see what goes around comes around. Regardless, alw is focusing his frustration at the wrong people, and he himself needs to take the blame more than anyone else. He is very much the captain of the ship, he signed off on everything and steered the direction the creatives took. He isn't just some small-time composer. Also him taking that attitude is not going to help staff moral to put on a good show. The article wasn't even that bad, this now just draws more attention to it. But maybe cinderella in the headlines is what he wants. The changes are going in on the gala night after all.Are they? |
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Post by scarpia on Nov 5, 2021 9:25:57 GMT
Let's face it, they focused on the wrong stuff. The gay "twist", the sexualisation of a community, the marginalisation of Cinderella, instead of being brave and trusting their instincts. "Sea Witch" needs to be shoe-horned in, Adam Lambert hired, and the second half should be a headbanging rock fest instead of lots of drippy ballad reprises. They lost their bottle when they dropped the Sea Witch and created a vacuum for the plot to roll around aimlessly. Typical Laurence Connor direction - some heavy punctuation littered with padding. Or maybe you're just carping and want to the show fail.  |
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Post by scarpia on Nov 5, 2021 9:36:11 GMT
I don't need to have independent verification of Baz's report as what he describes is pure, undiluted ALW. He's done it virtually all of his shows from and including Sunset onwards. I don't think the cast are that good but they're really the least of the show's problems. There is a salvageable show in there somewhere, but to make it work it needs a lot of rewrites and a brand new director. Too late (or should I say 'far too late'?) for the latter in London but not too late for Broadway...
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Post by steve10086 on Nov 5, 2021 9:36:13 GMT
Let's face it, they focused on the wrong stuff. The gay "twist", the sexualisation of a community, the marginalisation of Cinderella, instead of being brave and trusting their instincts. "Sea Witch" needs to be shoe-horned in, Adam Lambert hired, and the second half should be a headbanging rock fest instead of lots of drippy ballad reprises. They lost their bottle when they dropped the Sea Witch and created a vacuum for the plot to roll around aimlessly. Typical Laurence Connor direction - some heavy punctuation littered with padding. Or maybe you're just carping and want to the show fail. Yeah, why criticise a fun show that is right for the current climate? |
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