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Post by cezbear on Oct 15, 2021 9:02:29 GMT
I don't really get the point in filming the bows, once you've seen it once nothing really changes (I suppose unless it's a special occasion like someone's first show which is always quite sweet to see the cast celebrate). But it's probably a bit unfair to single out Cinderella on this one - Six quite literally tells the audience to get their phones out and film the end bit.
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Post by lolalou on Oct 15, 2021 12:35:40 GMT
I don't really get the point in filming the bows, once you've seen it once nothing really changes (I suppose unless it's a special occasion like someone's first show which is always quite sweet to see the cast celebrate). But it's probably a bit unfair to single out Cinderella on this one - Six quite literally tells the audience to get their phones out and film the end bit. If you read my post I did said it was the whole west end allowing bow footage. Six probs started the trend and now it’s everywhere. Cinderella herself (not the just official Cinderella page) reposts her own bows every single day which I just find odd.
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Post by cezbear on Oct 15, 2021 12:46:56 GMT
I don't really get the point in filming the bows, once you've seen it once nothing really changes (I suppose unless it's a special occasion like someone's first show which is always quite sweet to see the cast celebrate). But it's probably a bit unfair to single out Cinderella on this one - Six quite literally tells the audience to get their phones out and film the end bit. If you read my post I did said it was the whole west end allowing bow footage. Six probs started the trend and now it’s everywhere. Cinderella herself (not the just official Cinderella page) reposts her own bows every single day which I just find odd. I did read that, I just meant posting on the Cinderella thread seemed like singling one show out. But I agree on CHF posting the same bows all the time, it is a bit odd. Or at least I don't get the point of doing it so much, I'm sure there must be one and I just don't get influencers.
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Post by lolalou on Oct 15, 2021 12:54:03 GMT
If you read my post I did said it was the whole west end allowing bow footage. Six probs started the trend and now it’s everywhere. Cinderella herself (not the just official Cinderella page) reposts her own bows every single day which I just find odd. I did read that, I just meant posting on the Cinderella thread seemed like singling one show out. But I agree on CHF posting the same bows all the time, it is a bit odd. Or at least I don't get the point of doing it so much, I'm sure there must be one and I just don't get influencers. I think it was because I just noticed her in particular doing it over and over. self promotion/narcissism/influencer - such a fine line Bow footage seems to flood my timeline from loads of musicals it’s not just Cinderella.
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Post by Oliver on Oct 15, 2021 16:31:22 GMT
I went again last night thanks to a lottery win (i.e. the opportunity to buy a £25 seat). This ended up being in the centre of the 4th row Circle, which I think is a £95 seat most of the time. Plenty of gaps in the Circle and a few in the Stalls but this did mean I could move across and get a free seat either side, which was nice. The view is clear for the most part (not perfect when the stage rotates and you can't see the Cinderella entrance). There was a bored kid in the row behind who kept tapping the chair (not many children in thankfully as this really isn't a show aimed at them). I personally wouldn't sit there again as you are just too far away from the stage. All the leads were on and sang well. Carrie, in particular, I think has really settled into the role. This was apparently a cut show based on West End Understudies as I presume they were short of female ensemble, although I didn't spot anything obvious that was different. I suspect this will last for the Christmas season but I don't know for how much longer. I've no immediate desire to go again, but I may perhaps if some Stalls lottery tickets or other offers appear. Much though I love the musical, especially the music, I would have been astonished if it had been a hit. A dark and perhaps more faithful version of Cinderella would likely have been a more promising bet from a purely commercial standpoint. However, I love the light and shade of this piece and its uniqueness. It would be interesting to me to know how ALW would have guessed this might perform at the Box Office. I have a hard time believing he would expect it to be anything more than a moderate success at best, even if he hoped for more. Quality is not the determining factor here unfortunately as it very often isn't. He surely couldn't have expected Stephen Ward (very much inferior to this but that's beside the point) to be a commercial success? I guess we will never know.
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Post by fiyerorocher on Oct 16, 2021 23:51:20 GMT
doesn't sound good... anyone there tonight and know what happened?
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Post by christya on Oct 17, 2021 10:21:27 GMT
Some morons somewhere at the back of the stalls seemed to think it was time for audience participation. Yelling “Marry her!” during a quiet conversation at the end, etc. It wasn’t constant but still annoying as hell.
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Post by steve10086 on Oct 17, 2021 10:29:24 GMT
Some morons somewhere at the back of the stalls seemed to think it was time for audience participation. Yelling “Marry her!” during a quiet conversation at the end, etc. It wasn’t constant but still annoying as hell. But isn’t theatre supposed to “inclusive” and “non-elitist” these days? Seems that way if you look on Twitter! If you don’t agree with people doing whatever the hell they like then you’re “gatekeeping”. How dare you be annoyed that someone else was expressing themselves?
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Post by christya on Oct 17, 2021 10:37:49 GMT
Stuff that. If people can’t behave, out they must go.
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Post by mkb on Oct 17, 2021 10:52:11 GMT
Stuff that. If people can’t behave, out they must go. Hoorah to that! But... I was at a cinema screening of the Dominion's An American in Paris (having already seen it live) where there was an audience member with behavioural difficulties that meant that they made very loud noises every couple of minutes. I decided to leave and take a refund, as I knew it would spoil it for me.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2021 12:00:24 GMT
I think there is a very big difference between someone with a dsability and some pleb who hasnt got the attention span to sit quiet for an hour.
The whole 'elitist, gate keeping' nonsense on Twitter is infuriating. If you come to the theatre, then behave accordingly. If you cant do that, stay at home or wait for panto.
People wouldbt behave like that in someone else's house, so don't behave like that in our house.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2021 12:13:01 GMT
While I agree, the people on stage probably aren't the best equipped to know what the situation is with an audience member. Let the FOH staff deal with it.
And with show called cinderella and its confused marketing there is also probably an element of confused audience members too knowing what it is and the type of show they're at.
Also don't film, but I'll happily reshare every single video of me bowing sends another confused message. As soon as cameras were acceptable in the auditorium the lines got blurred
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Post by lolalou on Oct 17, 2021 12:24:09 GMT
While I agree, the people on stage probably aren't the best equipped to know what the situation is with an audience member. Let the FOH staff deal with it. And with show called cinderella and its confused marketing there is also probably an element of confused audience members too knowing what it is and the type of show they're at. Also don't film, but I'll happily reshare every single video of me bowing sends another confused message. As soon as cameras were acceptable in the auditorium the lines got blurred This. Also just let the theatre staff deal with it? What’s with this show and the leads telling folk off every other day? The publicity/storyline is like panto so I can see the confusion there. However care should be taken with calling out audience members. How does Ivano know this particular person didn’t have a learning disability of some kind. Tourette’s? He wouldn’t. So actors just let front of house deal with it. It’s not your job to control the audience. Also ‘don’t film’ I’ve discussed this further up. Once the west end allowed bows to be filmed, then plastered them all over social media then it’s inevitable some theatre goers will get confused. They make NO announcement at the start of shows anymore so either bring back the announcement or accept folk are going to film or take photos. Not everyone is a regular or knows the etiquette. It is an elitist attitude to think they would automatically know in an age where everything is shared on SM. Time for the actual theatre to take responsibility and sort this out. Bringing back the pre show announcement would be a start. Most people can follow simple instructions. Those that don’t can be dealt with accordingly. All this bleating on social media by actors over this kind of thing ruins the magic for me Ivano. I want to remember you as the prince not some passive aggressive moaner
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Post by mkb on Oct 17, 2021 12:53:54 GMT
... Once the west end allowed bows to be filmed... Has that actually happened then? I know people do it, but I didn't know it was now officially sanctioned. It doesn't seem long ago that I was watching Imelda Staunton at Gypsy's curtain call fiercely telling off a fanboy in the front row for doing precisely that. I thought they still had arcane rules about the set being copyright and no capturing of it being allowed.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 17, 2021 13:04:10 GMT
I think the power of social media to advertise the show by people taking pics of the front curtain and the bows has kicked concerns about copyright well into touch. So now the rubicon has been crossed we’re on the slippery slope to complete anarchy.
Carrie repeatedly posting clips of herself being applauded don't help.
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Post by fiyerorocher on Oct 17, 2021 13:17:15 GMT
I think people are way overstating the impact of the filming of bows in this thread. How is it not completely and entirely obvious that you DO NOT take out your phone and start taking photos and videos in the middle of a theatre performance? It's never been acceptable in the cinema, and it's not acceptable in the theatre either. Everyone can see you and they all think you're an ass. There are usually multiple signs and announcements telling you not to do it. It's so blatantly not allowed and snippets of the bows on social media are not going to have any impact on that. The people recording would have done it anyway - they know what they're doing isn't allowed but think they're the exception to the rule. And good god if you don't like what someone is posting on social media, just stop following them on social media. No one is forcing you under duress to watch someone's instagram stories.
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Post by Oliver on Oct 17, 2021 14:00:34 GMT
While I agree, the people on stage probably aren't the best equipped to know what the situation is with an audience member. Let the FOH staff deal with it. And with show called cinderella and its confused marketing there is also probably an element of confused audience members too knowing what it is and the type of show they're at. Also don't film, but I'll happily reshare every single video of me bowing sends another confused message. As soon as cameras were acceptable in the auditorium the lines got blurred This. Also just let the theatre staff deal with it? What’s with this show and the leads telling folk off every other day? The publicity/storyline is like panto so I can see the confusion there. However care should be taken with calling out audience members. How does Ivano know this particular person didn’t have a learning disability of some kind. Tourette’s? He wouldn’t. So actors just let front of house deal with it. It’s not your job to control the audience. Also ‘don’t film’ I’ve discussed this further up. Once the west end allowed bows to be filmed, then plastered them all over social media then it’s inevitable some theatre goers will get confused. They make NO announcement at the start of shows anymore so either bring back the announcement or accept folk are going to film or take photos. Not everyone is a regular or knows the etiquette. It is an elitist attitude to think they would automatically know in an age where everything is shared on SM. Time for the actual theatre to take responsibility and sort this out. Bringing back the pre show announcement would be a start. Most people can follow simple instructions. Those that don’t can be dealt with accordingly. All this bleating on social media by actors over this kind of thing ruins the magic for me Ivano. I want to remember you as the prince not some passive aggressive moaner I find that argument questionable. Surely if you have a disability which entails you shouting out in a theatre you shouldn't go? What should the theatre management do in such a situation? Go over, ask them to be quiet, told by them or someone on their behalf that they have a disability, "okay as you were". If I had a disability that caused me to involuntarily shout out in public, one thing I would avoid is theatres. It's not a necessity like education, transport etc., or a place where noise in public doesn't matter, such as a restaurant, for example, where it would be perfectly reasonable and correct to expect other diners to accept something of that nature. People do need to work around their problems and manage them to some extent. It seems to me that Ivano had good reason to complain about this situation.
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Post by karloscar on Oct 17, 2021 14:15:46 GMT
doesn't sound good... anyone there tonight and know what happened? If you have successfully captured and held an audience's attention they're less likely to shout out at inappropriate times. Maybe he should look to himself before criticizing the people paying his wages....
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Post by steve10086 on Oct 17, 2021 14:40:39 GMT
I think people are way overstating the impact of the filming of bows in this thread. How is it not completely and entirely obvious that you DO NOT take out your phone and start taking photos and videos in the middle of a theatre performance? It's never been acceptable in the cinema, and it's not acceptable in the theatre either. Everyone can see you and they all think you're an ass. There are usually multiple signs and announcements telling you not to do it. It's so blatantly not allowed and snippets of the bows on social media are not going to have any impact on that. The people recording would have done it anyway - they know what they're doing isn't allowed but think they're the exception to the rule. And good god if you don't like what someone is posting on social media, just stop following them on social media. No one is forcing you under duress to watch someone's instagram stories. I’ve sat in plenty of theatres where people have been filming blatantly during a performance. It might be entirely obvious to you, but it really isn’t to everyone!
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Post by Oliver on Oct 17, 2021 15:07:08 GMT
doesn't sound good... anyone there tonight and know what happened? If you have successfully captured and held an audience's attention they're less likely to shout out at inappropriate times. Maybe he should look to himself before criticizing the people paying his wages.... I don't agree with that either. There is no excuse for audience members shouting out in the middle of a performance no matter how they feel about it. The time to make their opinions known is when the show is over. Why should they assume everyone will agree with them anyway?
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 17, 2021 16:49:05 GMT
I doubt this was anything to do with actors holding the audiences attention. We all know there’s a certain type of person who gets off on their voice being heard in a crowded room. They must have very small lives if that’s how they get their thrills but there you go.
As for Ivano’s tweet. If you’re going to berate the audience do it with conviction. The opener “Just want to say quickly” is more Mavis Riley than leading man. If you’re going to do it put some welly into it love. If you’re not sure how to go about telling your audience off for their misdemeanours then there’s a walking talking encyclopaedia of it very close by 😐
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Post by karloscar on Oct 17, 2021 17:10:11 GMT
Hecklers have been around as long as theatre has existed, and are something that performers have to learn to deal with on stage. (Yes it can spoil the mood, and upset the cast and the rest of the audience, but it's never going to disappear completely). Moaning about it on Twitter afterwards is pretty pathetic, especially when it seems to have been a minor interruption, and virtually every other actor will have better horror stories than this.
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Post by max on Oct 17, 2021 17:31:48 GMT
Hecklers have been around as long as theatre has existed, and are something that performers have to learn to deal with on stage. (Yes it can spoil the mood, and upset the cast and the rest of the audience, but it's never going to disappear completely). Moaning about it on Twitter afterwards is pretty pathetic, especially when it seems to have been a minor interruption, and virtually every other actor will have better horror stories than this. He doesn't seem to be describing 'heckling', which is usually defined as 'interrupting with loud unfriendly statements or questions'. He's describing someone seeing a moment to make it all about attention on them, and spoiling a moment - often happens because someone's socially embarassed to notice/feel an emotion and so they have to puncture the moment. It's more immature than a negative comment heckle. It's this behaviour (not Ivano's) I would describe as "pretty pathetic". I don't think he's "moaning" either - his tweet is a way of saying to other audience members: sorry that moment got spoiled for you, for no good reason.
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Post by cezbear on Oct 17, 2021 17:40:35 GMT
Agree with max (WHY can't I figure out how to quote, oh well). I read the tweet as a quick note to the audience, not a telling off or a moan, just a 'just fyi, if this happens, spoils the moment a bit' comment. I don't really know why actors are getting the hard time when it's clearly terrible audience behaviour that's unacceptable. I've been in audiences for more than one show when someone's shouted out to be funny and it's the most uncomfortable experience (for me anyway) as an audience member. I'm getting sick to death of the wrong people being blamed in these situations - it's not the actors, it's not the majority of the audience who are respectful, it's idiots who are too selfish to consider others. That was a bit of a rant sorry, but as someone else referenced earlier on here, the twitter comments about elitist audiences have also got my goat and I'm mixing all my annoyance up into one here. In short: be civilised pls.
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Post by steve10086 on Oct 17, 2021 17:54:56 GMT
In short: be civilised pls. This is basically what it all boils down to! Why is this so difficult for some people? And why is everyone else expected to put up with their nonsense?
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