1,933 posts
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Post by LaLuPone on Sept 18, 2021 1:16:59 GMT
My comparison was of course extreme and I’ll even agree “dramatic” but I was just trying to show @stuckattheback how dumb their viewpoint that breaking rules is always wrong was. As others posters have said, many rules and laws are unfair and need to be challenged, and to simply want to have the right to dress in the same way as one’s peers, whatever their gender, is not “attention seeking” in any way!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2021 6:29:37 GMT
I haven’t seen the movie yet but I presume that Richard E Grant’s performance is much more nuanced and genuine than Corden’s horrific display. Oh yes don’t get me wrong Richard E Grant is a great actor and is great in the film but a lot of the conversation around James Corden was “gay parts should be played by gay actors” and now it seems like nobody cares anymore. Personally I never cared about gay actors playing gay roles, for me some of the best and most relatable and authentic performances have been by straight actors. The only time I have an issue is when a gay character is being played for laughs or stereotypes, like James cordon did and gay actors do that just as much as straight too tbh. |
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19,788 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Sept 18, 2021 9:40:00 GMT
I thought replacing the Legend of Loco Chanel song with that very poignant montage of Loco’s history was an inspired decision for the film. I was disappointed with He’s My Boy though, repeatedly cutting away from Margaret to show Jamie’s reaction to his father’s rejection took away the impact of the song for me.
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311 posts
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Post by olliebean on Sept 18, 2021 10:10:50 GMT
Lefties are very much "their way or no way" and the world just doesn't work that way, thankfully. Less of the generalisation, if you don't mind. This attitude is by no means either endemic or exclusive to the left wing. |
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Post by alece10 on Sept 18, 2021 11:22:17 GMT
I'm going to watch the film tonight on Amazon but just been listening to the film score but so far prefer the cast recording.
Couple of nice tracks added at the end though especially When The Time Comes.
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Post by eggemann on Sept 18, 2021 19:11:20 GMT
Watched the film, it’s versions of the songs work very well in the movie itself but when listening on Spotify they don’t all hold up to the cast recording. I also much prefer the new song for Loco Chanelle. The orginal wouldn’t have translated as well to film and it also applies a much weightier history to drag and gay culture that the film needed.
I am still baffled that the West End run is on “pause” in a week or so after the movie. I would have thought it would have been the best time to have shows going as people get to know the movie.
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Post by eggemann on Sept 18, 2021 19:23:58 GMT
Can someone explain to me why it’s ok for Richard E Grant to play a gay character but when James Corden did it it caused unbelievable outrage?? I think it’s a mixture of there being a larger worldwide (and American) buzz for The Prom, I remember most of the outrage I saw being from Americans on Tiktok. And also the fact that (in my opinion) James Corden played a cartoon character based on what he thinks a gay man is and Richard plays a far more believable and respectful portrayal. |
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19,788 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Sept 18, 2021 19:27:37 GMT
I think it was because some people have decided to spend an unhealthy amount of their time hating on James Corden.
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328 posts
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Post by barrowside on Sept 18, 2021 19:34:02 GMT
I liked Richard E. Grant's performance particularly the weariness. I thought it very respectful and believable also. I think it's very dangerous to push for all gay characters to be played by gay actors. It can pay major dividends as the cast of It's a Sin proved but equally Aidan Gillen and Craig Kelly were magnificent in Queer as Folk despite not being gay in real life. I worry it could mean gay actors not getting to play heterosexual characters in the future. Where would that leave a talent like Andrew Scott's?
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5,903 posts
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Post by mrbarnaby on Sept 18, 2021 20:18:04 GMT
Can someone explain to me why it’s ok for Richard E Grant to play a gay character but when James Corden did it it caused unbelievable outrage?? I think it’s a mixture of there being a larger worldwide (and American) buzz for The Prom, I remember most of the outrage I saw being from Americans on Tiktok. And also the fact that (in my opinion) James Corden played a cartoon character based on what he thinks a gay man is and Richard plays a far more believable and respectful portrayal. Also James Corden is absolutely loathsome. Richard E Grant is not. I’m Not a fan of his normally, but he was probably the best thing about this movie. Very moving and a very committed performance |
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Post by inthenose on Sept 18, 2021 20:26:58 GMT
I hated the show (left at the interval) so I won't be watching the film - but Richard E Grant is a terrific and very underrated actor. He is one of those guys who gets a lot of stick and teasing, but is consistently good and, whilst occasionally a little samey, elevates whatever he does. Not a "fashionable" name to like, but I always enjoy him.
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2,422 posts
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 18, 2021 23:28:33 GMT
I watched the film this afternoon, and as much as I enjoyed the show (I've seen it twice), I think the film is better. The musical sequences are done brilliantly and work better than they do on the stage, with the ones involving flashbacks having more weight behind them, and the new song for Loco Chanelle is miles better than the stage one. I also thought Max and Lauren were both great, along with an inspired cameo for John McCrea as young Loco. Apparently Layton Williams is in it as well but I didn't spot him. Overall a big success for me.
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19,788 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Sept 19, 2021 8:02:02 GMT
I think it’s a mixture of there being a larger worldwide (and American) buzz for The Prom, I remember most of the outrage I saw being from Americans on Tiktok. And also the fact that (in my opinion) James Corden played a cartoon character based on what he thinks a gay man is and Richard plays a far more believable and respectful portrayal. Also James Corden is absolutely loathsome. Richard E Grant is not. I’m Not a fan of his normally, but he was probably the best thing about this movie. Very moving and a very committed performance You might loathe him, that doesn’t make him loathsome. Lots of people think he’s ok, and even actually *shock* like him! |
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Post by jacob on Sept 19, 2021 10:03:03 GMT
potential unpopular opinion, but ‘This Was Me’ from the film wasn’t great..
I understood the message and emotion needed, and John’s cameo was nice, but the song itself sounds like Youtube background music.. feeling a little out of place :/ (maybe I’m just not a fan of The Feeling)
Still not having Miss Hedge maybe apologise or understand her own hatred as she lets Jamie into the prom at the end was meh, since the two seem to get along slightly at the beginning. Will finally get to see the show again next month after going in 2017, happy to report after that too
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2,422 posts
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 19, 2021 11:27:43 GMT
I think 'This Was Me' is anthemic, I loved it as soon as I heard it and for me that song and scene were one of the highlights of the film.
I agree that the character of Miss Hedge still needs work, it's unclear how she really feels. Her first scene with the class shows that she doesn't hate Jamie, she's no harsher towards him than anyone else, but they should clarify where her strong stance on the prom dress code is coming from, or if it's just from a 'rules is rules' viewpoint. Jamie does turn into a bit of a cocky pillock for the middle third of the film so it may just be an reaction to his challenging of her authority. She does have a few lines of 'ruining the prom for everyone else' but her motivations are still vague, I think it could be written better. Her allowance for Jamie to attend at the end feels more like a gesture to keep the peace with the other students, although the line about 'nice shoes Miss/you too' followed by a smile does imply that she doesn't have any real hatred or prejudice towards him.
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3,349 posts
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Post by Dr Tom on Sept 19, 2021 12:12:19 GMT
I agree that the character of Miss Hedge still needs work, I haven't seen the film yet (and don't intend to until the London staging closes/pauses next week), but from my experience working in education I think the Miss Hedge portrayal accurately captures how much your hands are tied in these situations. Most teachers are incredibly supportive of their pupils and they'll do what they can to help them, especially those who are struggling, suffering at home, even disruptive. If you've ever see the "Educating..." series of Channel 4, you'll see teachers trying everything they can to avoid traditional punishments, even putting opportunities in place for pupils who you might considerer not too be deserving of them. At the same time, teachers are incredibly tied down by school rules, upper management decisions, national policy, school Governors and the views of parents. Parents can very easily make it impossible for teachers to stay working in a particular school. And teachers themselves have their own pressures. It is far from an easy job. You see this briefly in the stage show when Miss Hedge's romantic life is presented. Now, the Miss Hedge character isn't very realistic, in that it's highly unlikely the same person will be teaching careers, running the exam scheduling and also holding a leadership role to meet with parents. But those are presumably necessary economies within a stage production. From my own experience (in higher education), I couldn't count the number of times I've been forced to present rules and regulations that are policies that I don't personally agree with. But that is part-and-parcel of the job and the correct way to change things isn't usually just to ignore things. Teachers have even less freedom that I do. School uniform rules should be inclusive of gender diversity. At the same time, pupils shouldn't be looking for a loophole to allow them to ignore the rules (or, in Jamie's case, to wear make up to school). This is one of my favourite shows. I'm glad Jamie is able to wear the dress to the prom in the show and I'm glad the real life Jamie is having some success with his life. There's been a lot of positive change across the sector in recent years to recognise the importance of individuality. But there are also still non-secular schools out there and schools where different genders are not allowed to integrate. The way Miss Hedge takes a stand against the system at the end of the show is an important moment, showing her risking her own career to do what is right. |
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 19, 2021 13:31:14 GMT
I agree that the character of Miss Hedge still needs work, I haven't seen the film yet (and don't intend to until the London staging closes/pauses next week), but from my experience working in education I think the Miss Hedge portrayal accurately captures how much your hands are tied in these situations. Most teachers are incredibly supportive of their pupils and they'll do what they can to help them, especially those who are struggling, suffering at home, even disruptive. If you've ever see the "Educating..." series of Channel 4, you'll see teachers trying everything they can to avoid traditional punishments, even putting opportunities in place for pupils who you might considerer not too be deserving of them. At the same time, teachers are incredibly tied down by school rules, upper management decisions, national policy, school Governors and the views of parents. Parents can very easily make it impossible for teachers to stay working in a particular school. And teachers themselves have their own pressures. It is far from an easy job. You see this briefly in the stage show when Miss Hedge's romantic life is presented. Now, the Miss Hedge character isn't very realistic, in that it's highly unlikely the same person will be teaching careers, running the exam scheduling and also holding a leadership role to meet with parents. But those are presumably necessary economies within a stage production. From my own experience (in higher education), I couldn't count the number of times I've been forced to present rules and regulations that are policies that I don't personally agree with. But that is part-and-parcel of the job and the correct way to change things isn't usually just to ignore things. Teachers have even less freedom that I do. School uniform rules should be inclusive of gender diversity. At the same time, pupils shouldn't be looking for a loophole to allow them to ignore the rules (or, in Jamie's case, to wear make up to school). This is one of my favourite shows. I'm glad Jamie is able to wear the dress to the prom in the show and I'm glad the real life Jamie is having some success with his life. There's been a lot of positive change across the sector in recent years to recognise the importance of individuality. But there are also still non-secular schools out there and schools where different genders are not allowed to integrate. The way Miss Hedge takes a stand against the system at the end of the show is an important moment, showing her risking her own career to do what is right. Great post, thank you. I think in the film it just felt a little bit like she just gave in to appease the other students, maybe it was just the way it was played. But it's a lovely moment if interpreted as a supportive action from Miss Hedge, and therefore a victory and acceptance for Jamie. |
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Post by anthony40 on Sept 19, 2021 13:32:43 GMT
I have not seen the show live. I have (pirated DVD) of the live screening to cinema but I went and saw the film on Friday night and I LOVED it.
I don't like drag (it's an opinion- don't all hate me) but despite this, the way the film has been made just blew me away.
The sheer energy of the young cast. So great to see such diversity on screen. Such slick choreography and such confidence for such a young cast with such confidence.
As great as Mx Harwood was a Jamie, and he really is, for me the stand out performance was from Lauren Patel as Jamie's best friend Pritti. Although a supporting role, she was just sensational. Overtime she was on screen, i couldn't keep my eyes off her!
A nice turn out from Samuel Bottomley as Dean Paxton.
It was also nice to see how the staged production has been adapted for screen, with Shobna Gulati as Ray carrying over her role.
Having never seem the original BBC documentary, it was great to see snippets of it as the credits roles.
I don't know what I was exception, but it's a musical so I'm there but I wan't anticipating this being that good!
Well done to all involved!
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Post by FairyGodmother on Sept 19, 2021 13:57:14 GMT
I don't know I thought her motivation was quite clear — the prom is designed to celebrate all the students and having Jamie turn up in a dress means that that's suddenly going to become the focus — not that it didn't anyway!
Changing the rules at the beginning of the year to say that girls and boys can wear either uniform (and by extension, either dress code to the prom) and him wearing a skirt, then wearing a dress to the prom would be a lot more manageable and not build into such a "big thing".
Also, the way he acted in the middle of the film wouldn't exactly endear him to me — I think if anything it would send me back to my rule book!
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Post by inthenose on Sept 19, 2021 15:15:58 GMT
I didn't stay for the second Act, but does Jamie have a redeeming story arc? Just curious on people's thoughts as I found the character quite the egomaniac and very unappealing. It's a large part of why I disliked it so much. It felt I was meant to be rooting for them, but I just had immediate arrogance vibes.
Can anyone understand where I'm coming from - did did you feel the same when watching first time?
Maybe the character learns some humility as it goes on. I'm just curious.
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 19, 2021 15:22:05 GMT
I didn't stay for the second Act, but does Jamie have a redeeming story arc? Just curious on people's thoughts as I found the character quite the egomaniac and very unappealing. It's a large part of why I disliked it so much. It felt I was meant to be rooting for them, but I just had immediate arrogance vibes. Can anyone understand where I'm coming from - did did you feel the same when watching first time? Maybe the character learns some humility as it goes on. I'm just curious. Jamie's bravado is a defence, built after his dad calls him 'disgusting' at a young age, so he's never felt any self-worth. In act 2 he finds out the truth about his dad wanting to abandon him, is attacked by bullies, repairs things with his mum, and goes to the prom in a dress but as himself, not as a character, and learns self-acceptance. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Sept 19, 2021 15:22:34 GMT
I agree that the character of Miss Hedge still needs work, At the same time, teachers are incredibly tied down by school rules, upper management decisions, national policy, school Governors and the views of parents. Parents can very easily make it impossible for teachers to stay working in a particular school. And teachers themselves have their own pressures. It is far from an easy job. You see this briefly in the stage show when Miss Hedge's romantic life is presented. Something happens in the film that’s not in the stage version which suggests that this isn’t entirely the case and that Miss Hedge is being unecessarily belligerent about her stance. |
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2,422 posts
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 19, 2021 17:12:59 GMT
The documentary about the original Jamie (and his mum) is still on BBC iPlayer if anyone's interested. It's a sweet watch, and lovely to see the origins of the story.
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Post by alece10 on Sept 19, 2021 19:54:56 GMT
Just watched the film and enjoyed it but I do prefer the stage show.
Good acting especially from Sarah Lancashire who is wonderful in everything she does.
Stage to film is always difficult to do and they have done well with this but give me the stage musical any day.
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2,422 posts
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Post by robertb213 on Sept 19, 2021 21:18:13 GMT
I think both versions have their strengths.
The stage version has a better script, lines land better and are funnier, the character of Ray is more fleshed out and used far better, and you obviously get the energy in the room during the musical numbers.
Some of the visuals during the musical numbers in the film were better (Work Of Art in particular is fabulous), flashbacks give some songs more meaning, the change from Loco Chanelle's ballad to 'This Was Me' and the scenes that go with it are phenomenal (and the drag queens in the stage version just aren't funny and add nothing), and I also love that we actually get to see Mimi Me perform a number which we're deprived of in the stage version.
But I really enjoyed both versions!
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