724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 16, 2020 8:11:23 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 16, 2020 8:11:23 GMT
I think it will be harder for the goverment to get a trade deal with the EU now a further UK/EU rift has appeared over China.
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4,156 posts
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Post by kathryn on Jul 16, 2020 8:56:14 GMT
You have given all the benefits to leaving the EU. The UK now controls it borders, has greater say on it's economy and that does include the ability to be able to trade with other countries. Which Brexiteers (and this government) will hope to fill much of the gap in the economy with. We could even become a great Socialist state now which I am not sure we could whilst under membership of the EU. At the end of the day, the UK right wants make the decisions rather than the European right. So, there are no benefits, then. Not if you actually understand the practical realities of geopolitics. I mean, right there you go from saying we could become a Socialist state and then say the UK right wants to make all the decisions! Political theory is all very well, but political reality always wins out. The UK isn't going to become a Great Socialist State with the UK right in power. The UK isn't going to get improved trade deals outside of the EU because we've reduced our bargaining power and influence by leaving it - as well as proving ourselves to be unreliable negotiating partners who renege on our obligations and agreements to score short-term political points for a domestic audience. No-one in their right mind will be cutting us any slack or doing us any favours in trade deals. The sad thing is that this was all predictable - was actually predicted! - but a large proportion of the electorate bought into the fantasy of sunlit uplands and '£350m extra a week for the NHS'.
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Brexit
Jul 16, 2020 9:13:38 GMT
Post by londonpostie on Jul 16, 2020 9:13:38 GMT
Oh no!
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 16, 2020 9:44:50 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 16, 2020 9:44:50 GMT
I think next up will be ECHR withdrawal - the perfect wedge issue to divide everyone again.
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 12:08:41 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 20, 2020 12:08:41 GMT
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 12:16:57 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2020 12:16:57 GMT
Are all peerages now considered political? Sir Ian Botham as a peer politically is stupid. But if it's a reward for for sporting and charity exploits it's totally deserved. For a ong time peerages were given as a reward for service to the country. Now they seem totally political. Is this why there have never been more actor peerages - I think 6 are listed on wiki but half of them were probably political. Lord Olivier's was likely only one for services to drama. Lord Attenborough had a good acting career and an elite directing one but his peerage was as much for his immense charity work and also he was a fine chairman of Channel 4. Lord Miles I never understood how he got one.
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4,156 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 13:38:13 GMT
Post by kathryn on Jul 20, 2020 13:38:13 GMT
Peerages have become political by default, ever since Andrew Lloyd Webber was convinced to fly back to the Uk to vote on a House of Lords bill the government of the day were worried they would lose.
He regrets doing it now, I am sure - he accepted it as an apolitical honour - but ever since the implication of offering and accepting a peerage has been clear.
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 14:09:20 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2020 14:09:20 GMT
Peerages have become political by default, ever since Andrew Lloyd Webber was convinced to fly back to the Uk to vote on a House of Lords bill the government of the day were worried they would lose. He regrets doing it now, I am sure - he accepted it as an apolitical honour - but ever since the implication of offering and accepting a peerage has been clear. ALW had been knighted circa 1992 so a peerage was probably due. It was only years later I realised it was likely political as much as his contribution to music. Someone like Benjamin Britten's peerage was clearly for his contribution to music. BB had been made a Companion of Honour and Order of Merit previously but had apparently turned down knighthood and peerages before hand.
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 14:39:50 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2020 14:39:50 GMT
I, for one, find it somewhat disconcerting that a politician is turning to a bloke with a heavy wooden bat and saying "Thanks for your help".
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 14:50:39 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 20, 2020 14:50:39 GMT
I think we going to get a no deal.
And with China and it's allies off the picture the main trade deal is going to be the USA.
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2,339 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 17:15:15 GMT
Post by theglenbucklaird on Jul 20, 2020 17:15:15 GMT
I think we going to get a no deal.
And with China and it's allies off the picture the main trade deal is going to be the USA.
Was getting no deal from the day dodgy Dom Cummings won
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 17:39:40 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 20, 2020 17:39:40 GMT
I think we going to get a no deal.
And with China and it's allies off the picture the main trade deal is going to be the USA.
Was getting no deal from the day dodgy Dom Cummings won A lot of the red wall brexit voters still think they will notice the amount of immigrants in their area reducing - not sure it will happen.
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1,863 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 18:42:41 GMT
Post by NeilVHughes on Jul 20, 2020 18:42:41 GMT
No-Deal is primarily focused on the EU, truth is as this Tweet demonstrates we need to negotiate and agree FTA’s with every trading nation over the next 5 months.
At the moment it looks like we not only leave the EU but we leave behind all our trading partners if not agreed by year end and any time spent on WTO terms will negate any benefits in the short term and any business lost is unlikely to be regained as changing suppliers is a long and complex process which many of our trading partners have started to ensure continuity of supply without tariffs and import complexities.
If we leave the EU without a Deal it will also be worse than the much touted Australian Deal as Australia have a “mutual recognition agreement” which has been set up to facilitate trade in industrial products by reducing technical barriers which we won’t have.
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 18:54:28 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 20, 2020 18:54:28 GMT
No-Deal is primarily focused on the EU, truth is as this Tweet demonstrates we need to negotiate and agree FTA’s with every trading nation over the next 5 months. At the moment it looks like we not only leave the EU but we leave behind all our trading partners if not agreed by year end and any time spent on WTO terms will negate any benefits in the short term and any business lost is unlikely to be regained as changing suppliers is a long and complex process which many of our trading partners have started to ensure continuity of supply without tariffs and import complexities. If we leave the EU without a Deal it will also be worse than the much touted Australian Deal as Australia have a “mutual recognition agreement” which has been set up to facilitate trade in industrial products by reducing technical barriers which we won’t have. And not just the EU. 3.6% of British goods go to China but that is going to get reduced or even eliminated in the coming months.
It's a two prong problem as the higher education sector is being reduced with the goverment hoping to increase the % 18-21 year olds working in manfacturing while equally manfacturing output might be being reducee.
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 20, 2020 20:51:19 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 20, 2020 20:51:19 GMT
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1,970 posts
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 12:02:52 GMT
Post by sf on Jul 21, 2020 12:02:52 GMT
...and while it's perhaps not as explosive as some people were hoping for, it's still a damning indictment of the last several Tory governments. The revelation that Russian interference into the 2016 referendum was not investigated is breathtaking - all the more so given that the report does tell us there's evidence Russia undertook influence campaigns in the 2014 Scottish referendum.
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 12:40:53 GMT
sf likes this
Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2020 12:40:53 GMT
Oh, it is as explosive. Worse in fact.
It would have been awful if the government had found evidence and delayed its publication but, incredibly, they managed to plumb even greater depths. They could not even be bothered to look. That is criminal, literally criminal, all those involved in this are traitors - no more, no less. Was this deliberate ignorance? The evidence seems to be pointing in that direction. They have sold this country down the river.
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1,970 posts
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 12:52:25 GMT
Post by sf on Jul 21, 2020 12:52:25 GMT
Well... not as explosive in the sense that people were looking for direct evidence of Russian interference in the referendum process.
I agree the fact they didn't look is worse - far worse - but the bare facts of the report give the right-wing press and people like Farage an easy way to spin it. They can claim - they are claiming - that the report shows no evidence of interference, and plenty of people are credulous enough to take that claim at face value. If the report showed clear evidence of Russian interference, there'd perhaps be less wiggle-room for people to spin it.
There is no excuse - at all - for it not having been made available prior to last year's election, although Jeremy Corbyn was such a staggeringly incompetent leader of the opposition that Labour may not have gained much capital from it.
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2,339 posts
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 12:54:27 GMT
Post by theglenbucklaird on Jul 21, 2020 12:54:27 GMT
Well... not as explosive in the sense that people were looking for direct evidence of Russian interference in the referendum process. I agree the fact they didn't look is worse - far worse - but the bare facts of the report give the right-wing press and people like Farage an easy way to spin it. They can claim - they are claiming - that the report shows no evidence of interference, and plenty of people are credulous enough to take that claim at face value. If the report showed clear evidence of Russian interference, there'd perhaps be less wiggle-room for people to spin it. Yeah my friend who works for an airline said Arron Banks cancelled his one way flight yesterday
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 14:01:10 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 21, 2020 14:01:10 GMT
Universities are going to be wrecked by Brexit - reduction in RU students coinciding with Cornovirus and likely banning of Chinese Students
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 21, 2020 15:41:21 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 21, 2020 15:41:21 GMT
Universities are going to be wrecked by Brexit - reduction in RU students coinciding with Cornovirus and likely banning of Chinese Students ~ EU not RU.
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 22, 2020 9:43:52 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 22, 2020 9:43:52 GMT
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2020 14:47:28 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 23, 2020 14:47:28 GMT
I think the government might well use the fact Ireland quarantines Brits to justify possible risks to the Border - they will play dirty to make sure everything is blamed on the EU.
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2020 15:16:40 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 15:16:40 GMT
Deadlines annoy me. In many cases the deadline is set by agreement between a group of people and it could be changed at any time by those same people coming to a new agreement, but somehow once the deadline has been called into existence it takes on a dreadful reality of its own and nobody dare question it. The deadline must be adhered to no matter how much it costs, even if it would cost literally nothing to change it.
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724 posts
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2020 20:12:34 GMT
Post by basdfg on Jul 23, 2020 20:12:34 GMT
Also remember Labour are not going to whole heartly oppose no deal due to the political risks of being seen to be too pro European and no chance of the government having to change course if it's what they decide
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