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Post by Latecomer on Dec 9, 2019 11:05:52 GMT
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 9, 2019 11:07:40 GMT
Arlene foster states Johnson can't be trusted.
Eek. I'm agreeing her. What an earth is wrong with me?
If she got bunged a few more millions would she agree?
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Post by londonpostie on Dec 9, 2019 11:50:58 GMT
tbf, i think most of the electorate, inc. his former wives, got there earlier. It seems Dom Cummings' latest production 'Get Brexit done' (the follow up to the big hit 'Take back control') is doing quite well.
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Post by londonpostie on Dec 9, 2019 12:11:01 GMT
My daughter lives in Uxbridge constituency and her and husband have each so far put in more than 50 hours knocking on doors (and both work full time). Even if Labour do not win this election it has created a network of young highly motivated activists for a different way to do politics. Both my young adults have never done any campaigning in the past. This is what gives me hope. One problem from the Blair years is that they carpet bombed the left, which has left a gaping generational hole. Even at constitiuency level it was hard to get left candidates on the ballot. Corbyn himslef couldn't get - was it 15 members of Parliament - to sign his papers requesting to be included in the Leadership ballot.
What I found remarkable after Corbyn's election, and in the subsequent two campaigns, is the huge investment Momentum has put into training activists, and in every conceivable skill - from the traditional door knocking and board running, to pop up's of all types to chairing meetings and committee's.
From there they turn out on the streets and when before there would be 6 or 8 local die-hards, there are now huge numbers targetting specific areas in key seats.
The people running my constituency party now are all under 35 and they are all professional in their approach. The pace of transition has been somewhat extraordinary - you're also left wondering where on earth they all came from ..
The left has come from needing sympathy votes from MPs in order to get a left candidate on the Leadership ballot to this is 4 years.
Maybe at this election but certainly the next we will see the best coming through into Parliament to fill the void created by Blair.
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Post by Latecomer on Dec 9, 2019 12:25:06 GMT
My daughter lives in Uxbridge constituency and her and husband have each so far put in more than 50 hours knocking on doors (and both work full time). Even if Labour do not win this election it has created a network of young highly motivated activists for a different way to do politics. Both my young adults have never done any campaigning in the past. This is what gives me hope. One problem from the Blair years is that they carpet bombed the left, which has left a gaping generational hole. Even at constitiuency level it was hard to get left candidates on the ballot. Corbyn himslef couldn't get - was it 15 members of Parliament - to sign his papers requesting to be included in the Leadership ballot.
What I found remarkable after Corbyn's election, and in the subsequent two campaigns, is the huge investment Momentum has put into training activists, and in every conceivable skill - from the traditional door knocking and board running, to pop up's of all types to chairing meetings and committee's.
From there they turn out on the streets and when before there would be 6 or 8 local die-hards, there are now huge numbers targetting specific areas in key seats.
The people running my constituency party now are all under 35 and they are all professional in their approach. The pace of transition has been somewhat extraordinary - you're also left wondering where on earth they all came from ..
Maybe at this election but certainly the next we will see the best coming through into Parliament to fill the void created by Blair.
Yes, couldn’t agree more. I was her age under Blair but never considered joining a political party, let alone being active. I think social media make it easier. It was very apparent during the 2017 election that the coverage of main stream media was poor (they showed hardly any of the huge outdoor rallies where people were spontaneously flocking to see Jeremy Corbyn) and the young now do not watch BBC news or read newspapers....they have developed their own media. Crowdfunding makes legal challenges possible, people like The Secret Barrister inform (so much so that Boris Johnson stole his analysis by copy and paste) and there is a whole different slant to the news. Even if Labour lose this election we will win the arguments in the long term as Labour have the brightest and the best supporting them You only have to look at the shambles of Government (a NI secretary who didn’t realise people voted down sectarian lines? A Brexit secretary who hadn’t read the Good Friday Agreement? Or realised how much of trade was done through Dover? )
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Post by londonpostie on Dec 9, 2019 14:40:05 GMT
From this morning. To continue a theme in this thread, I suspect he speaks here not as a Conservative but as a Leaver.
In fact I'm slowly emerging from the other side of this now; having given up the license fee and tv, I am contemplating breaking the law as an act of civil disobedience - the current system is utterly infuriating and unsustainable, made so by BBC partiality:
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Post by Latecomer on Dec 9, 2019 20:29:20 GMT
BBC story is dead cat, thrown out there to distract from Johnson stealing journalist’s phone during an interview...like the bully he is.
They then followed up with another dead cat where Tories fed Laura Kuenssberg a false story that she tweeted out....all lies but claimed a Labour “activist” punched Hancock’s aide.....there was a video of it. Made Kuenssberg and Peston for that matter look like the gullible fools they are....
Look at pictures of the Bristol Corbyn rally (thousands). Look at the number of canvassers who turned up at Putney tonight (hundreds)
It’s a mystery....
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Post by lynette on Dec 9, 2019 20:43:52 GMT
I’ve been around for a few GEs but I can’t recall another so toxic, so unpleasant and full of deceit. Of course i wasn’t there back in the day when they used to roll up and buy the voters a beer but it isn't far off, is it?
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Post by NeilVHughes on Dec 9, 2019 21:24:26 GMT
Such a clusterf*ck of a day for Johnson, the fact that he flew instead of taking his bus for an hours drive is overlooked.
The Conservatives are as contemptuous of green issues as they are of our health and well-being, with the thousands turning out for Corbyn and the continued support for the Conservatives in the polls I can only assume we are a nation suffering from Stockholm Syndrome.
Looking back at the momentous 1945 election here are some of the policies introduced
- National Health Service Act - National Insurance Act (Unemployment benefits, Pensions) Unemployment Allowance tripled Welfare services for the elderly, disabled, poor children and those with mental health issues Pensions increased to their highest levels Sick leave - Family Allowances Act - New Towns Acts 1,000,000 new homes built - Transport Act - Education Act providing free education for all until 15 - Married Women’s Act removing restrictions on women owning property - Criminal Justice Act improving probation services - Shops Act providing protections for shop workers - Legal Aid and Advice Act
Attlee was similarly derided as Corbyn but went on to introduce a visionary socialist agenda that set up what we now take for granted as core British values, we rebuilt Britain in 1945 we can do it now again.
When we choose to be radical that is when Britain becomes Great.
As for the cost, can we really afford not to, especially when we consider the Conservatives almost doubled the national debt (from £9.7b to £1.8t) whilst starving public services and increasing poverty. The question that we should be asking is where did this money go as it definitely didn’t improve the life of the many, only the few who have prospered at our expense. What Labour is proposing is the balancing of this obscene lack of investment over the last 10 years and rebuilding the foundations of the welfare state which have been eroded over the last 30 years.
Sometimes you have to be brave and build the country we deserve and in reality we all believed we lived in, what we all need to do is begin to build that country so that the children of that young child will never have to go through the ignominy that he had to that night.
We would not expect to live in a mansion on the cheap but we all expect to live in a functioning society on the cheap.
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Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Dec 9, 2019 23:07:09 GMT
I’ve been around for a few GEs but I can’t recall another so toxic, so unpleasant and full of deceit. Of course i wasn’t there back in the day when they used to roll up and buy the voters a beer but it isn't far off, is it? 1924, culminating in the Zinoviev Letter. Before any of our times, though.
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Post by londonpostie on Dec 10, 2019 0:30:58 GMT
already posted
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Post by poster J on Dec 10, 2019 8:17:02 GMT
Arlene foster states Johnson can't be trusted. Eek. I'm agreeing her. What an earth is wrong with me? If she got bunged a few more millions would she agree? Problem with that is that anyone sensible in NI knows that Arlene Foster can't be trusted either, so her views mean even less. Sadly I can't see the DUP losing many of their seats (though many people I know are trying very hard to make that happen!), and they are easily malleable by the Tories making the right promises, whether they can be kept or not.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2019 13:03:59 GMT
From this morning. To continue a theme in this thread, I suspect he speaks here not as a Conservative but as a Leaver.
In fact I'm slowly emerging from the other side of this now; having given up the license fee and tv, I am contemplating breaking the law as an act of civil disobedience - the current system is utterly infuriating and unsustainable, made so by BBC partiality: I always said this could be a huge working class vote winner and don't see why we should pay so much to pay a lot of privileged lefties - you Gary Lineker and greedy women - you Carrie Gracie!
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Post by londonpostie on Dec 10, 2019 18:05:29 GMT
urgh, opps
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 10, 2019 19:05:24 GMT
Jonathan Ashworth though. Lol. With shadow cabinet members like that, who needs enemies Jeremy?
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Post by Latecomer on Dec 10, 2019 21:35:28 GMT
Try not to get distracted. it’s all incredibly simple really. Do we want to be a country of “I” and “me” or “us” and “we”. Do we want our society to care for the hopeless and vulnerable or just leave them to die if they are feckless and lazy? Do we want to be kind?
And don’t give me that “we can’t afford it” bu*****t. I just don’t believe you. Not if the alternative is putting up HUGE trade obstacles with our nearest trading partner that will decimate our industries and risk peace in Northern Island.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2019 22:14:51 GMT
Yes, absolutely the last thing we need right now is voters getting distracted by the fact a potential PM is also a potential security hazard! ;-)
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Post by anthony40 on Dec 10, 2019 22:19:38 GMT
Bois Johnson does Love Actually
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 10, 2019 22:53:40 GMT
The Sun which is part of an organisation that hacks a dead child’s mobile phone.
As I said on another thread and me being a commuter who under the age of 40 reads a newspaper anymore? There circulation is in terminal decline, they’re not significant anymore.
Anyway Boris does look like Scrooge, who incidentally said ‘humbug’ at the murder of Jo Cox, however he doesn’t get cathectic conversion and remains humbug especially if you are one who is vulnerable and/or sick.
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Post by Latecomer on Dec 10, 2019 23:33:38 GMT
Yes, absolutely the last thing we need right now is voters getting distracted by the fact a potential PM is also a potential security hazard! ;-) Do you mean Boris Johnson? Who takes Russian money and slipped his minders to party at that house with the Russian? And who refused to publish the report into Russia? And has Cummings as an advisor who has hid splippery hands all over the Vote Leave stuff? And stirs up hate of the Far Right with his comments about immigration? Get a grip.
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Post by sparky5000 on Dec 11, 2019 11:22:25 GMT
If the Conservatives win this election then Labour has no one to blame but itself! This should have been a landslide for them! People can argue that the Conservatives have moved too far to the right, but Labour has moved too far to the left also, which is unpalatable to a lot of people, especially by allowing someone as inept as Corbyn to be their leader. The majority of this country are centralists in their politics (and there’s nothing wrong with that), but have no one to represent them so it’s a case of having to choose the least offensive of 2 awful candidates in Johnson and Corbyn. I’ve never been more depressed by the state of this country 😩 I’m unenthusiastically voting for the Lib Dems 😆😐
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Post by Rukaya on Dec 11, 2019 12:09:56 GMT
Wow
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2019 12:41:35 GMT
If the Conservatives win this election then Labour has no one to blame but itself! This should have been a landslide for them! People can argue that the Conservatives have moved too far to the right, but Labour has moved too far to the left also, which is unpalatable to a lot of people, especially by allowing someone as inept as Corbyn to be their leader. The majority of this country are centralists in their politics (and there’s nothing wrong with that), but have no one to represent them so it’s a case of having to choose the least offensive of 2 awful candidates in Johnson and Corbyn. I’ve never been more depressed by the state of this country 😩 I’m unenthusiastically voting for the Lib Dems 😆😐 The fact that the Lib Dems have gone down in the polls against a couple of leaders as divisive as Boris and JC says a lot about them. Whilst I'm not a Jo Swinson fan, I would have thought that as a successful woman under 40 she would have been an ideal alternative to woo the younger and remain voters as they would never vote for Boris and JC could be seen as too old and not someone they'd support.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2019 12:45:19 GMT
The odds on the Tories getting a majority and their projected seat numbers have gone down slightly and they are predicted at around 340 seats whilst Labour are up to 222 seats in ballpark predictions. If we take a reasonable margin or error then the Tories seem likely to at least get the 320 odd seats they would need to have some sort of majority when we discount the Speaker, his deputies and the Irish Republicans who don't take their seats.
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Post by intoanewlife on Dec 11, 2019 12:53:08 GMT
If the Conservatives win this election then Labour has no one to blame but itself! This should have been a landslide for them! People can argue that the Conservatives have moved too far to the right, but Labour has moved too far to the left also, which is unpalatable to a lot of people, especially by allowing someone as inept as Corbyn to be their leader. The majority of this country are centralists in their politics (and there’s nothing wrong with that), but have no one to represent them so it’s a case of having to choose the least offensive of 2 awful candidates in Johnson and Corbyn. I’ve never been more depressed by the state of this country 😩 I’m unenthusiastically voting for the Lib Dems 😆😐 I don't really understand this way of thinking at all. We all know that at least 50% of what these people tout at election time will never happen, ie most of the frankly stupid special interest stuff Labour has been touting and even if they do who cares as they affect so few people anyways. Their main policies however are for the general betterment of society and will never happen under the Tories. A vote for the Lib Dems is utterly pointless, you may as well vote for the Tories. If the Tories win there are going to be some very very dark times ahead for a hell of a lot of people. The fact no one seems to have noticed what has happened in the US over the past 3 years is very frightening to me, because that is exactly where we are heading. Frankly we are already part way there.
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Post by vdcni on Dec 11, 2019 13:29:21 GMT
Depends on the constituency whether it is worth voting Lib Dem.
I would normally vote Labour and despite Corbyn would still vote Labour if I lived in the right constituency. However mine is a Tory/Lib Dem marginal where a vote for Labour is pointless, I did it in 2015 and saw a Conservative MP get elected so it's got to be Lib Dem for me.
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Post by sparky5000 on Dec 11, 2019 13:33:52 GMT
If the Conservatives win this election then Labour has no one to blame but itself! This should have been a landslide for them! People can argue that the Conservatives have moved too far to the right, but Labour has moved too far to the left also, which is unpalatable to a lot of people, especially by allowing someone as inept as Corbyn to be their leader. The majority of this country are centralists in their politics (and there’s nothing wrong with that), but have no one to represent them so it’s a case of having to choose the least offensive of 2 awful candidates in Johnson and Corbyn. I’ve never been more depressed by the state of this country 😩 I’m unenthusiastically voting for the Lib Dems 😆😐 I don't really understand this way of thinking at all. We all know that at least 50% of what these people tout at election time will never happen, ie most of the frankly stupid special interest stuff Labour has been touting and even if they do who cares as they affect so few people anyways. Their main policies however are for the general betterment of society and will never happen under the Tories. A vote for the Lib Dems is utterly pointless, you may as well vote for the Tories. If the Tories win there are going to be some very very dark times ahead for a hell of a lot of people. The fact no one seems to have noticed what has happened in the US over the past 3 years is very frightening to me, because that is exactly where we are heading. Frankly we are already part way there. Mine’s a protest vote as much as anything because I’m in a very safe Labour seat so it wouldn’t matter who I voted for. But I personally don’t like a lot of what this present socialist Labour Party stands for. I’m not voting for the Conservatives because I don’t trust them, I can’t stand Boris, I don’t like the way they’ve embraced the trump model of populism that seeks only to divide, and I don’t like how they’ve effectively become the far right Brexit party, but that doesn’t just mean I should vote for the Labour Party by default. I find the prospect of Corbyn being in power just as frightening as Johnson.
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Post by juicy_but_terribly_drab on Dec 11, 2019 16:15:06 GMT
I don't really understand this way of thinking at all. We all know that at least 50% of what these people tout at election time will never happen, ie most of the frankly stupid special interest stuff Labour has been touting and even if they do who cares as they affect so few people anyways. Their main policies however are for the general betterment of society and will never happen under the Tories. A vote for the Lib Dems is utterly pointless, you may as well vote for the Tories. If the Tories win there are going to be some very very dark times ahead for a hell of a lot of people. The fact no one seems to have noticed what has happened in the US over the past 3 years is very frightening to me, because that is exactly where we are heading. Frankly we are already part way there. Mine’s a protest vote as much as anything because I’m in a very safe Labour seat so it wouldn’t matter who I voted for. But I personally don’t like a lot of what this present socialist Labour Party stands for. I’m not voting for the Conservatives because I don’t trust them, I can’t stand Boris, I don’t like the way they’ve embraced the trump model of populism that seeks only to divide, and I don’t like how they’ve effectively become the far right Brexit party, but that doesn’t just mean I should vote for the Labour Party by default. I find the prospect of Corbyn being in power just as frightening as Johnson. What do you think he's going to do that's so scary?
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Post by sparky5000 on Dec 11, 2019 17:25:03 GMT
Mine’s a protest vote as much as anything because I’m in a very safe Labour seat so it wouldn’t matter who I voted for. But I personally don’t like a lot of what this present socialist Labour Party stands for. I’m not voting for the Conservatives because I don’t trust them, I can’t stand Boris, I don’t like the way they’ve embraced the trump model of populism that seeks only to divide, and I don’t like how they’ve effectively become the far right Brexit party, but that doesn’t just mean I should vote for the Labour Party by default. I find the prospect of Corbyn being in power just as frightening as Johnson. What do you think he's going to do that's so scary? His views on foreign policy. The fact that he supports socialist undemocratic regimes, which claim to be for the people yet suppress them by voter suppression. I don’t trust him at all on security. And although there are pros and cons I personally don’t think that renationalisation is the way forward. And Brexit tbh - I’m so sick of it. I voted remain and still want that outcome, but if we have a Labour led government I have zero trust in them agreeing a palatable deal in the 3 months they say they will. How can they when they have never even said what sort of deal they will be seeking. So yeah, they’re my main concerns. I have just as many issues with the Conservatives which is why it’s such a depressing choice for me.
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Post by NeilVHughes on Dec 11, 2019 17:39:12 GMT
Appears tactical voting is proving to be popular, a tweet from tactical.vote earlier
Visits to tactical.vote are through the roof today and we're expecting even more tomorrow.
We've added more servers and load balancing to make sure it stays online.
Not sure of the validity of their recommendation, as always check a few and clarify for yourself before voting if you are in the fortunate position where your vote can make a difference.
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