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Post by juicy_but_terribly_drab on Aug 25, 2022 23:52:21 GMT
deadline.com/2022/08/lin-manuel-miranda-new-york-new-york-musical-john-kander-1235099489/Sorry, I couldn't pass up that title. There've been rumours of this for a few months but now I guess it's official (though then it was supposedly going into the St. James so I assume that's now dependent on whether Into the Woods keeps up its momentum). I had always planned to watch the film because I had always planned to watch all of Scorsese's filmography, but this news finally gave me the push to do so and let me just say it was certainly something else! I went in expecting something completely different, something much more traditional, and in a way I guess I got that since all the elements are there, just presented through a much harsher lens. While I don't think the film worked over all, I am somewhat disappointed that it seems from the article they are doing away with everything but the setting and songs. To me the film was an interesting critique of many classic musicals and it almost worked so this stage adaptation could have been the chance to finally get it right. De Niro's Jimmy Doyle is unlikeable, domineering, and emotionally abusive but ultimately that's not unlike a lot of classic musical protagonists. I'm thinking Curly from Oklahoma, Jerry from An American in Paris (I've only seen the stage show so I can't speak to the film but it's still an adaptation of a classic musical so obviously trying to emulate that style). He's the cocky guy who manages to charm and get the girl but put into the real world and taken to the extreme. Usually these more unsavoury characteristics are masked by the light mood and all the gloss and fun production numbers of classic musical comedies, but here the characters stand in stark contrast to all this artifice, serving instead to emphasise how terrible the protagonist really is and the toxicity of his relationship with Liza's Francine Evans. It makes for a tough watch that never quite coheres, and at nearly 3 hours long it becomes almost unbearable towards the end, but thankfully Liza is there with her magnetic performance and far more sympathetic character to carry you through to a brilliant finale. Despite these flaws I think there's something more to be mined from this story and, while completely understandable because it would be a truly herculean task, it's a shame that instead of making a go of it they're seemingly starting over from scratch. Nevertheless, I'm still excited by the prospect of a new Kander & Ebb show. I didn't think we'd ever get a new score by them for obvious reasons so it's a nice surprise that there'll be one last show from these 2 masters. What form do we think it will take - was this an unfinished project that LMM is stepping in to bring across the finish line, or will it just be repurposed songs from their back catalogue with a few new ones that Kander and LMM have written to fill out the show? Also, I didn't intend this post to mostly be a long-winded analysis of the movie - it must have gotten to me more than I realized - but I'd love to hear anyone else's thoughts on it while we wait for more updates on the stage adaptation.
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Post by karloscar on Aug 26, 2022 16:09:25 GMT
There are quite a few standards in the film not written by Kander and Ebb like Honeysuckle Rose. I wonder if they'll be retained or dumped for new material. I presume the leading man will get most of the new material because de Niro barely sings a note. It sounds intriguing, but if they don't keep the Happy Endings sequence intact I'll be complaining!
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Post by juicy_but_terribly_drab on Aug 26, 2022 16:41:28 GMT
There are quite a few standards in the film not written by Kander and Ebb like Honeysuckle Rose. I wonder if they'll be retained or dumped for new material. I presume the leading man will get most of the new material because de Niro barely sings a note. It sounds intriguing, but if they don't keep the Happy Endings sequence intact I'll be complaining! Yes I wondered about that too, the way they're talking about it, it sounds like it's not going to retain the standards and it'll just be Kander & Ebb/LMM songs. Of course the title theme will be in there but I totally agree that Happy Endings should be retained as well, that sequence was when the film won me back after I found the middle to be a bit of a slog. |
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Post by sukhavati on Aug 27, 2022 7:30:58 GMT
I vaguely remember reading something to the effect that Scorsese wanted to make an old-fashioned studio film that was obviously shot on the traditional backlot and soundstage. You do get that look, but then veer into marriage from hell territory. I did love the musical numbers. Gene Kelly had the kind of charisma that made his American in Paris character Jerry tolerable. De Niro was De Niro, and pushy-creepy before the character went into full on physical abuse. Still everything from the club scenes and Liza's finale of the title song were wonderful. I loved the look of Happy Endings, very golden age Hollywood trad, but there was something about it that didn't sit right with me. Oh well - taste is subjective. I'm actually kind of excited about the score and hearing it live, although I do wonder what they'll do with the book. I suppose it's a waiting game for now. I do have the film's original soundtrack somewhere on vinyl - I'm going to have to dig it out and give it another listen - thank goodness my husband kept the turntable.
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Post by Mark on Apr 4, 2023 18:33:03 GMT
This turned out to be a bit of a disappointment for me. Had nothing on the greatly superior Some Like it Hot across the road.
There's no real wow moments or oomph, the score mostly disappoints and the book is clunky. It looks gorgeous but I don't really see this one taking off.
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Post by emmy on Apr 4, 2023 22:16:43 GMT
This turned out to be a bit of a disappointment for me. Had nothing on the greatly superior Some Like it Hot across the road. There's no real wow moments or oomph, the score mostly disappoints and the book is clunky. It looks gorgeous but I don't really see this one taking off. Thanks for writing this, really helpful - I’m trying to decide on a couple more shows for my NY trip, so it’s great to get some comparisons. If you happen to be seeing Camelot as well, please do report back! |
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Post by Mark on Apr 5, 2023 3:37:54 GMT
This turned out to be a bit of a disappointment for me. Had nothing on the greatly superior Some Like it Hot across the road. There's no real wow moments or oomph, the score mostly disappoints and the book is clunky. It looks gorgeous but I don't really see this one taking off. Thanks for writing this, really helpful - I’m trying to decide on a couple more shows for my NY trip, so it’s great to get some comparisons. If you happen to be seeing Camelot as well, please do report back! That was tonights show! Have made a thread  |
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Post by BVM on Apr 5, 2023 13:05:17 GMT
This turned out to be a bit of a disappointment for me. Had nothing on the greatly superior Some Like it Hot across the road. There's no real wow moments or oomph, the score mostly disappoints and the book is clunky. It looks gorgeous but I don't really see this one taking off. That is a shame; this was very much on my radar to see! Is it spectacular enough that this can carry it through into an enjoyable evening or not really? (There's precious little spectacle on Broadway currently!) Anyway, hoping for an OBC so can decided based on that. Sounds like might be better off seeing Some Like It Hot on my next trip though. |
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Post by Mark on Apr 5, 2023 13:15:04 GMT
Is it spectacular enough that this can carry it through into an enjoyable evening or not really? (There's precious little spectacle on Broadway currently!) Anyway, hoping for an OBC so can decided based on that. Sounds like might be better off seeing Some Like It Hot on my next trip though. Oh, between this and Some Like it Hot, the latter wins hands down. NYNY was enjoyable, I just didn’t find it as big and brassy as I thought it might be. |
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Post by BVM on Apr 5, 2023 13:21:34 GMT
Is it spectacular enough that this can carry it through into an enjoyable evening or not really? (There's precious little spectacle on Broadway currently!) Anyway, hoping for an OBC so can decided based on that. Sounds like might be better off seeing Some Like It Hot on my next trip though. Oh, between this and Some Like it Hot, the latter wins hands down. NYNY was enjoyable, I just didn’t find it as big and brassy as I thought it might be. Thanks - good to know! |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2023 14:19:17 GMT
You might want to cast a broader net for opinions since you'll find many people speaking to the pros and cons of each show on other sites. Further, New York, New York is still in previews so changes are likely afoot.
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Post by emmy on Apr 5, 2023 15:19:56 GMT
You might want to cast a broader net for opinions since you'll find many people speaking to the pros and cons of each show on other sites. Further, New York, New York is still in previews so changes are likely afoot. True, but while I obviously look at other sites, I’ve found in the past reports from Broadwayworld/ Twitter/ etc often don’t align with my view. I read this board a lot more anyway, so have a better idea of who I’m likely to agree with from here (hence why Mark’s reviews are helpful!), but diversity of opinion is always welcome |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2023 15:55:25 GMT
It isn't always obvious if people look to other sites for input, but glad you are and that you feel you can trust Mark's review (I often do as well). I would just suggest it is a bit premature for people to write off NYNY when work is still being done on the show.
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Post by emmy on Apr 6, 2023 18:35:09 GMT
It isn't always obvious if people look to other sites for input, but glad you are and that you feel you can trust Mark's review (I often do as well). I would just suggest it is a bit premature for people to write off NYNY when work is still being done on the show. Fair enough - dw, I’m definitely not planning a whole theatre trip on the thoughts of one person, just trying to slim down my shortlist a bit ! If you are seeing the show, pls let us know what you think! |
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Post by BVM on Apr 7, 2023 8:29:46 GMT
Am kinda hoping they will release a cast recording as that will definitely help me to decide.
From what I can tell the only song I know is New York New York. Which is iconic to be fair.
Never seen the film! (Though aren't there very few songs from that in it anyway?!)
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Post by Someone in a tree on Apr 7, 2023 8:34:03 GMT
Am kinda hoping they will release a cast recording as that will definitely help me to decide. From what I can tell the only song I know is New York New York. Which is iconic to be fair. Never seen the film! (Though aren't there very few songs from that in it anyway?!) Playbill has a list of K&E songs used and you'll then you'll be able to find them in the usual places |
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Post by mattnyc on Apr 7, 2023 13:02:33 GMT
I really, truly enjoyed this one. I’m going again in a couple weeks to see how it’s changed since early previews but, while it’s not a perfect show (few are), there’s so much to like in it.
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Post by Dr Tom on Apr 8, 2023 21:17:13 GMT
I didn't take to this one as much as I expected. The songs and dancing are all excellent (they really play up with teases for the title number), but the book and plot are both weak, and the plot never felt like it got properly resolved. Still, worth seeing.
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Post by BVM on Jul 8, 2023 10:16:11 GMT
I don’t even know what to say… I mean - it's slightly more creative than papering?! Surprised this isn't doing better - thought New Yorkers were obsessed with their city. That said I saw it when I was last there and whilst I found it enjoyable, it never really took off for me. Pleasant but unremarkable is how I found it really. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2023 3:05:48 GMT
Being obsessed with out city doesn't mean we blindly support anything with its name on it. Other than a number or two it is a weak production.
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42ndBlvd
Swing
I'll be back where I was born to be
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Post by 42ndBlvd on Jul 11, 2023 17:19:33 GMT
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Post by appoul on Jul 25, 2023 8:38:36 GMT
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Post by BVM on Jul 25, 2023 11:41:41 GMT
Oh Dear. Barely any more popular than (the iconic) Bad Cinderella. In fact minus the Tony noms would have done worse I expect 😱.
Broadway remains divided between the haves and the have nots and seems to be an even harder environment for new musicals than the West End with every show that takes off having several in the same era that don’t.
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I don’t even know what to say…