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Post by forevercolours on Mar 18, 2022 6:06:39 GMT
I saw Courtney just a couple weeks ago at the most recent Roles We’ll Never Play and she sang a song from Hunchback and she was incredible. I had seen her in Six and ETAJ in the past but I had never heard her sing like that before. What we’re not gonna do is judge her based on one performance. She’s going to smash it as all. You don’t have to be a fan of the show to be able to celebrate the diversity it is bringing us which most other shows seem to be incapable of doing. The representation within LB shows us that it can be done so other productions really have no excuse at this point.
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Post by christya on Mar 18, 2022 9:17:31 GMT
What we’re not gonna do is judge her based on one performance. ‘We’? You don’t speak for me, and you don’t get to instruct me what to do, either. If I want to judge a professional performer based on a performance of theirs which was decidedly sub standard, I will do so. Nobody is saying she can’t improve, or that she hasn’t given other good performances. But that one is not great, and I’m not going to pretend I didn’t notice that. |
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Post by forevercolours on Mar 18, 2022 9:32:46 GMT
What we’re not gonna do is judge her based on one performance. ‘We’? You don’t speak for me, and you don’t get to instruct me what to do, either. If I want to judge a professional performer based on a performance of theirs which was decidedly sub standard, I will do so. Nobody is saying she can’t improve, or that she hasn’t given other good performances. But that one is not great, and I’m not going to pretend I didn’t notice that. Wow, someone took that comment very personally for no good reason. ‘Professionals’ in all industries have bad days all the time and I didn’t realise that people would consider it controversial to be kind and not judge their career based on that one performance. It’s fair to judge the performance but not the performer. |
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Post by Figaro on Mar 18, 2022 10:07:51 GMT
Fun fact - I moved into Bailey’s apartment when she moved out and it took a month and three plumbers to fully remove her Blonde hair from the drains. Who is Bailey? |
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Post by christya on Mar 18, 2022 11:01:20 GMT
Wow, someone took that comment very personally for no good reason. ‘Professionals’ in all industries have bad days all the time and I didn’t realise that people would consider it controversial to be kind and not judge their career based on that one performance. It’s fair to judge the performance but not the performer. You tried to speak for other people: "What we're not gonna do". You want to argue that it's not 'fair' to judge someone based on the evidence available, fine, that's your choice. But you can't say what 'we' are going to do, whether you consider it 'kind' or not. People get to think for themselves. I'm not discussing this any further with you. |
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Post by Paddy on Mar 18, 2022 11:21:01 GMT
Wow, someone took that comment very personally for no good reason. ‘Professionals’ in all industries have bad days all the time and I didn’t realise that people would consider it controversial to be kind and not judge their career based on that one performance. It’s fair to judge the performance but not the performer. You tried to speak for other people: "What we're not gonna do". You want to argue that it's not 'fair' to judge someone based on the evidence available, fine, that's your choice. But you can't say what 'we' are going to do, whether you consider it 'kind' or not. People get to think for themselves. I'm not discussing this any further with you. It’s a modern colloquialism, basically another way of someone saying “yeah I really don’t think we should say/do this”. It is in no way speaking for someone else, so your reaction was a touch unnecessary |
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Post by christya on Mar 18, 2022 11:32:25 GMT
I'll continue to assume people mean what they actually say, thanks. This seems like an unnecessary diversion, so I won't be replying to anything further on the topic.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 11:50:15 GMT
Non-traditional casting is fine. Sometimes though, a character is written as a specific physical "type". And the plot of the play/musical/movie/whatever hinges on them being that specific type, so casting against it just... well it doesn't entirely work without a significant rewrite. If you were doing Hairspray for example, you wouldn't have a skinny Tracy Turnblad because that would subvert the entire point of the character. I'm not trying to offend anyone, I'm just trying to see how modern-day casting works when it opposes one of the main points of a story. (please don't cancel me) Interesting casting choice Courtney seems to have a good comic presence and she is a curvier girl could we see a CHF as Elle for example? As regards Hairspray there is nothing to say Tracy couldn't be played with padding as Enda was - Brian Conley is a lot smaller than say Mark Benton and Michael Ball who played role. I think colour blind and age blind casting can work but there has to be consistency in the story you wouldn't have a random black kid as a Von Trap in Sound of Music or one of the Temptations as a white guy in Motown musical. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 11:51:44 GMT
Fun fact - I moved into Bailey’s apartment when she moved out and it took a month and three plumbers to fully remove her Blonde hair from the drains. Who is Bailey? A golden retriever? |
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Post by sph on Mar 18, 2022 13:43:48 GMT
Non-traditional casting is fine. Sometimes though, a character is written as a specific physical "type". And the plot of the play/musical/movie/whatever hinges on them being that specific type, so casting against it just... well it doesn't entirely work without a significant rewrite. If you were doing Hairspray for example, you wouldn't have a skinny Tracy Turnblad because that would subvert the entire point of the character. I'm not trying to offend anyone, I'm just trying to see how modern-day casting works when it opposes one of the main points of a story. (please don't cancel me) Interesting casting choice Courtney seems to have a good comic presence and she is a curvier girl could we see a CHF as Elle for example? As regards Hairspray there is nothing to say Tracy couldn't be played with padding as Enda was - Brian Conley is a lot smaller than say Mark Benton and Michael Ball who played role. I think colour blind and age blind casting can work but there has to be consistency in the story you wouldn't have a random black kid as a Von Trap in Sound of Music or one of the Temptations as a white guy in Motown musical. Yes, but the padding would give the actress a physical transformation into that "type". Actors who are cast against type in the past have changed and transformed to fit the character. They wouldn't just say "Ok Tracy is now skinny." A blonde wig on the other hand, isn't really enough to transform Bowman into the personification of a subculture Elle is supposed to represent. Colour blind casting would be ok in one of the Von Trapp kids in my opinion because it wouldn't be important to the story, so having one of the kids be a person of colour would just require a small amount of suspension of disbelief from the audience - fine. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Mar 18, 2022 13:53:37 GMT
Given how hard it is for plus size performers to find lead roles, it would feel wrong to me to cast a slim Tracy and then put on padding. Is that not pretty much the costuming equivalent of seeking to change someone's ethnicity by use of make up?
I know the demands of the role have meant that some Tracys needed some padding towards the end of their run by dint of having lost weight through months of energetic performances. But in essence, Tracy's size is integral to the piece and so the casting should absolutely reflect that.
Edna is different as it is a far broader character in terms of how she can be presented. Larger than Wilbur is important but there will always be some padding necessary to transform the performer into a woman.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 13:54:24 GMT
Interesting casting choice Courtney seems to have a good comic presence and she is a curvier girl could we see a CHF as Elle for example? As regards Hairspray there is nothing to say Tracy couldn't be played with padding as Enda was - Brian Conley is a lot smaller than say Mark Benton and Michael Ball who played role. I think colour blind and age blind casting can work but there has to be consistency in the story you wouldn't have a random black kid as a Von Trap in Sound of Music or one of the Temptations as a white guy in Motown musical. Yes, but the padding would give the actress a physical transformation into that "type". Actors who are cast against type in the past have changed and transformed to fit the character. They wouldn't just say "Ok Tracy is now skinny." Colour blind casting would be ok in one of the Von Trapp kids in my opinion because it wouldn't be important to the story, so having one of the kids be a person of colour would just require a small amount of suspension of disbelief from the audience - fine. Good points Sph - the Sound of Music and Motown casting options were to be taken tongue in cheek. Elle is supposed to be 18 but Sheridan was nearer 30 when she played her. Lucie Jones and Sheridan were totally different builds when playing the part. I can actually buy Courtney in that role think of Carlton from Fresh Prince with a daughter. Plus if Courtney gets her curves into the bunny outfit I'd applaud her. |
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Post by sph on Mar 18, 2022 14:03:16 GMT
Given how hard it is for plus size performers to find lead roles, it would feel wrong to me to cast a slim Tracy and then put on padding. Is that not pretty much the costuming equivalent of seeking to change someone's ethnicity by use of make up? I know the demands of the role have meant that some Tracys needed some padding towards the end of their run by dint of having lost weight through months of energetic performances. But in essence, Tracy's size is integral to the piece and so the casting should absolutely reflect that. Edna is different as it is a far broader character in terms of how she can be presented. Larger than Wilbur is important but there will always be some padding necessary to transform the performer into a woman. Yes, of course, my point was that the actress would have to wear padding in order for the character/story to work. I think it's far better and more appropriate to cast a plus-size actress. |
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Post by lolalou on Mar 18, 2022 14:13:51 GMT
Non-traditional casting is fine. Sometimes though, a character is written as a specific physical "type". And the plot of the play/musical/movie/whatever hinges on them being that specific type, so casting against it just... well it doesn't entirely work without a significant rewrite. If you were doing Hairspray for example, you wouldn't have a skinny Tracy Turnblad because that would subvert the entire point of the character. I'm not trying to offend anyone, I'm just trying to see how modern-day casting works when it opposes one of the main points of a story. (please don't cancel me) Interesting casting choice Courtney seems to have a good comic presence and she is a curvier girl could we see a CHF as Elle for example? As regards Hairspray there is nothing to say Tracy couldn't be played with padding as Enda was - Brian Conley is a lot smaller than say Mark Benton and Michael Ball who played role. I think colour blind and age blind casting can work but there has to be consistency in the story you wouldn't have a random black kid as a Von Trap in Sound of Music or one of the Temptations as a white guy in Motown musical. Curvy is fine but you need a funny bone and I don’t see CHF as a comedic actress. She would be a hard no from me for Elle. Courtney seems bubbly and fun, if she can keep up with the vocal demands then why not. |
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Post by forevercolours on Mar 18, 2022 14:18:54 GMT
Yes, but the padding would give the actress a physical transformation into that "type". Actors who are cast against type in the past have changed and transformed to fit the character. They wouldn't just say "Ok Tracy is now skinny." Colour blind casting would be ok in one of the Von Trapp kids in my opinion because it wouldn't be important to the story, so having one of the kids be a person of colour would just require a small amount of suspension of disbelief from the audience - fine. Good points Sph - the Sound of Music and Motown casting options were to be taken tongue in cheek. Elle is supposed to be 18 but Sheridan was nearer 30 when she played her. Lucie Jones and Sheridan were totally different builds when playing the part. I can actually buy Courtney in that role think of Carlton from Fresh Prince with a daughter. Plus if Courtney gets her curves into the bunny outfit I'd applaud her. Elle isn’t 18. Harvard Law is a grad school and she was already in college doing ‘fashion merchandising.’ She’d be 22/23 ish in the musical. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 16:01:09 GMT
Curvy is fine but you need a funny bone and I don’t see CHF as a comedic actress. She would be a hard no from me for Elle. Courtney seems bubbly and fun, if she can keep up with the vocal demands then why not. Courtney certainly seems as if she would be good at comedy and to look at her you'd think "she'd be fun on a night out" in a positive way. CHF is an interesting one, I hadn't thought of her in terms of the comedy side. But from her social media stuff she seems very relateable. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2022 16:09:59 GMT
Elle isn’t 18. Harvard Law is a grad school and she was already in college doing ‘fashion merchandising.’ She’d be 22/23 ish in the musical. Thanks for advising I just think as Harvard as one of the Ivy League Universities. Also Elle studying for Law to get in was skipped over a bit in the film as she did a Pop Video type admissions entry so that would have thrown me. When the film came I can remember people thinking the character was 18/19 and Reece was already a mum then but looked younger than 24/25 she was when it was made. |
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Post by Figaro on Mar 18, 2022 20:24:22 GMT
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Post by princeton on Mar 18, 2022 20:43:28 GMT
I think it's Bailey Hanks - the winner of MTV's The Search for Elle Woods, who took over from Laura Bell Bundy in the Broadway production (and in fairness she was referenced in the previous tweet to MattNYC's - though she has zero profile here in the UK).
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on Mar 19, 2022 14:24:06 GMT
WHAT. A. CAST. Groundbreaking - a plus size and woman of colour playing Elle Woods. About bloody time. I think Legally Blonde is quite dated and looking forward to whatever Lucy Moss conjures up direction wise.
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Post by fiyero on Mar 19, 2022 23:32:36 GMT
I’m keen to see this but have a packed diary. I can do a matinee. As much as I love the atmosphere getting dark brings I feel this is a bright show!
I’ve heard of people fainting in the heat! (Must have gone the day summer happened). Would high or low numbers give more chance of shade or is it all in sun at that time of day?
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Post by keekio2 on Apr 1, 2022 13:46:36 GMT
So they arent having a dog play bruiser…. This will be interesting
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on Apr 1, 2022 17:48:55 GMT
So they arent having a dog play bruiser…. This will be interesting Oh?!?! *googles* |
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Post by sophie92 on Apr 1, 2022 18:23:55 GMT
For reference:
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Post by LaLuPone on Apr 1, 2022 18:31:10 GMT
Are you sure the Bruiser bit’s not an April Fool?
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