5,811 posts
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Post by mrbarnaby on Aug 25, 2023 22:47:44 GMT
That Time Out review is awful, awful woke virtue signalling parody of someone who wants to appear intelligent but is widely misinformed. And the problem is that these claims go unscrutinised and even probably resonate to some naieve readers. But it's bordering on slander of the creatives, and I think it's a bit gross that the creatives' gender is being twisted to make them seem unable to tell this story. The Time Out review is more appropriate as a reddit comment or forum post than a professional critical review that should be taken seriously. Feels so unfair not just to the creatives, but to potential audience members who now might turn away from the show and miss out on a great piece of art and ideas that are certainly not as 'problematic' as the person claims them to be. It is definitely a flawed review but I also think this is a wildly inaccurate use of the word woke 😂 I agree. Accusing it of being a whole review baffles me
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Post by inthewings on Aug 26, 2023 0:42:14 GMT
Well I had a pretty fair idea going in that I was going to hate this and I did, every single second of it. As I am not one for pissing on peoples parades I won't list everything I loathed about it and I'm glad everyone who has been waiting to see it for years is finally getting to see it and is loving it. But yeah this was just not for me and it will forever be sitting in my Room 101 alongside Falsettos, Caroline or Change and Fun House for eternity. Indulge us?
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Aug 26, 2023 2:14:48 GMT
Well I had a pretty fair idea going in that I was going to hate this and I did, every single second of it. As I am not one for pissing on peoples parades I won't list everything I loathed about it and I'm glad everyone who has been waiting to see it for years is finally getting to see it and is loving it. But yeah this was just not for me and it will forever be sitting in my Room 101 alongside Falsettos, Caroline or Change and Fun House for eternity. Your opinion isn't pissing on anyone else's parade. I'd love to know what you hated about it. It makes a change from me hating a show that everyone else loves lol
I agree with you on Caroline or Change though!
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Aug 26, 2023 2:21:17 GMT
Who exactly is taking medical advice from a musical? There's no cure for stupid. In the show, there is a neon sign for Dr Fine. Is there one for Dr Madden? I can't remember seeing it. ’m also wary of why two male writers felt they wanted a female protagonist Because a female voice is far more exciting to listen to in a musical. End of.
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Post by toomasj on Aug 26, 2023 2:23:00 GMT
Who exactly is taking medical advice from a musical? There's no cure for stupid. In the show, there is a neon sign for Dr Fine. Is there one for Dr Madden? I can't remember seeing it. ’m also wary of why two male writers felt they wanted a female protagonist Because a female voice is far more exciting to listen to in a musical. End of.Divisive nonsense.
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Post by intoanewlife on Aug 26, 2023 2:38:03 GMT
Well I had a pretty fair idea going in that I was going to hate this and I did, every single second of it. As I am not one for pissing on peoples parades I won't list everything I loathed about it and I'm glad everyone who has been waiting to see it for years is finally getting to see it and is loving it. But yeah this was just not for me and it will forever be sitting in my Room 101 alongside Falsettos, Caroline or Change and Fun House for eternity. Indulge us? I really shouldn't as I absolutely hated it, therefore I have literally nothing good to say about it as a show and I don't really wish to argue with those who love it because we all like different things. My main problem with it, as someone who went in TOTALLY blind to it, is that I just don't think in 'musical' form they can really do this kind of story, characters or subject matter the proper justice they deserve. I would say exactly the same for the other 3 shows I listed as well. The fact it is 99% sung through did not help either IMO. So while I give it (and the other shows) kudos for trying to do something different, these kinds of extremely serious stories just do not work as musicals for me, as they are somewhat cursed with the 'burst into song' structure of musical theatre (or in this case, never bloody stop singing) which for me under sells the serious nature of the subject matter. As a well written/acted play I think it probably would've absolutely crushed me. As a musical with a VERY generic score (once those cock rock Bon Jovi B-sides started in Act 1 my eyes and ears glazed over and I was out!) and banal, cringey, overly simplistic lyrics that had me accurately predicting what the next line was going to be despite never hearing a single note from it before tonight...I just found the whole thing hollow and manipulative. I did think Jamie was excellent and his character was the only one that was somewhat fully realized, well written and that I felt a single shred of empathy for. Carrie has a nice enough voice, but the character was so underwritten I felt absolutely nothing for her. She was little more than a series of cliched events triggering the other characters actions and emotions, instead of being a fully formed person. People who suffer from mental illness still have their own distinct personalities and are real people, all I got from Dianna was 'I am this disease' and nothing more. Therefore I couldn't connect with her on any level other than to think 'naaaaw, poor luv', whereas Dan almost broke my heart on several occasions. I would however put that down to Jamie's portrayal more than what is written on the page. I actually kind of get what the Timeout reviewer is saying, although instead of just pointing out the actual problem, he tries to get all clever about it and ends up looking like a dick. The female characters are just not well written and their actions are so predictable and cliched that I just didn't find them believable. If I wasn't with my partner, I would've definitely left at intermission and cried the whole way home. Not for the heartbreaking fates of the shows characters, but for throwing 120 quid down the toilet. In short, I hated it. But once again I am glad that the people who love it finally get the chance to see and enjoy it!
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Post by apubleed on Aug 26, 2023 8:23:00 GMT
I think the fact that you seem to hate next to normal, fun home and Caroline, or change - whereas I consider these productions in London (Donmar, Young Vic, Hampstead/Broadway) to be among my greatest theatre experiences ever - probably does reflect differences in taste haha. Genuinely sorry you can't seem to find much value in this material because I cannot even begin to describe the emotional roller coaster each three of these shows takes me on.
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19,670 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Aug 26, 2023 8:36:09 GMT
You both love the polarising A Strange Loop so your tastes can’t be that far apart!
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Post by apubleed on Aug 26, 2023 8:55:49 GMT
Also, I caught the show again last night (after the first preview). I think it's in even better shape. Jamie's vocals have definitely improved - and even though he might still be the weakest vocally - I think his Dan IS devastating and standing out a little more for me than other Dans have now, which is hard to do if you're Herbie, if you're Buddy and not Sally/Phyllis etc. I would hope he remains with the show and any future mountings for fear they might throw out the balance of the whole show because it's working so well now. The sound has improved but they were having some mic issues still, which was a bit annoying especially when they were happening in emotional moments. Cassie Levy - well, having seen both Alice Ripley and Marin Mazzie I think she might be doing the best "I Miss the Mountains" and "How Could I Ever Forget" out of the three. Cassie's acting feels next level in terms of complexity (as does the Gabe and Natalie) in a way that I don't think has really been seen in this show before. I couldn't rave about this show and production more highly. I can't wait to see it again. It's experiences like this that remind me why I dedicate too much of my time and money on this hobby.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2023 11:49:07 GMT
Some shows just don't click or connect with a person quickly enough and you're left outside the story and the production instead of being pulled into its narrative, tone, style, and presentation. I can totally understand why Next To Normal might be that show for some people.
When this has happened to me, I find my inner critic becoming more present and what's not working for me in the show rises to the foreground. It takes a lot then for the show to regain my interest.
It's like looking for a house or apartment and shortly after entering a possibility you find one or two things wrong. That becomes the more dominant narrative that the rest of the visit now has to compete with.
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Post by robsonlm on Aug 26, 2023 13:28:14 GMT
Technical problem, they are delaying the start of todays matinee performance.
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Post by intoanewlife on Aug 26, 2023 13:28:55 GMT
Some shows just don't click or connect with a person quickly enough and you're left outside the story and the production instead of being pulled into its narrative, tone, style, and presentation. I can totally understand why Next To Normal might be that show for some people. When this has happened to me, I find my inner critic becoming more present and what's not working for me in the show rises to the foreground. It takes a lot then for the show to regain my interest. It's like looking for a house or apartment and shortly after entering a possibility you find one or two things wrong. That becomes the more dominant narrative that the rest of the visit now has to compete with. 100% correct, you just explained my situation perfectly. I thought that overnight my opinions may have changed on it a little, but in fact the more I think about it, the more I hate it lol
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Post by colelarson on Aug 26, 2023 13:31:44 GMT
Currently at Today's Matinee but we are delayed due to a "technical hitch". No news yet when we will start!
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Post by Mr Wallacio on Aug 26, 2023 13:40:36 GMT
Currently at Today's Matinee but we are delayed due to a "technical hitch". No news yet when we will start! Nervy times. My first ever show delay. Hopefully just a delay and not a cancellation, especially as I won't be able to come to another performance if it is cancelled.
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529 posts
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Post by jampot on Aug 26, 2023 13:46:16 GMT
Here too..had a ticket for the 1st night that was cancelled...!
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Post by colelarson on Aug 26, 2023 14:06:14 GMT
Matinee show cancelled just announced and I have booked accommodation thanks to the train strikes best go see a show tonight instead!
They better put an extra shown on for us lot today as the run is a sell out!!!!
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352 posts
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Post by Scswp on Aug 26, 2023 14:28:37 GMT
Matinee show cancelled just announced and I have booked accommodation thanks to the train strikes best go see a show tonight instead! They better put an extra shown on for us lot today as the run is a sell out!!!! Oh no! I’m so sorry for the audience, especially on this particularly difficult day with limited/no train services to some areas. It must be difficult for the cast too. I wonder what the technical difficulty is?
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Post by robsonlm on Aug 26, 2023 14:30:55 GMT
Matinee show cancelled just announced and I have booked accommodation thanks to the train strikes best go see a show tonight instead! They better put an extra shown on for us lot today as the run is a sell out!!!! Oh no! I’m so sorry for the audience, especially on this particularly difficult day with limited/no train services to some areas. It must be difficult for the cast too. I wonder what the technical difficulty is? They said it was a problem with the sound system.
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141 posts
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Post by blobble84 on Aug 26, 2023 14:31:16 GMT
I called the box office as wanted to know when they’d make a decision about tonight, before travelling in. They said it was an issue with sound that couldn’t be fixed in time, but that the evening is due to go ahead as planned.
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Aug 26, 2023 15:02:11 GMT
Who exactly is taking medical advice from a musical? There's no cure for stupid. In the show, there is a neon sign for Dr Fine. Is there one for Dr Madden? I can't remember seeing it. Because a female voice is far more exciting to listen to in a musical. End of.Divisive nonsense. How exactly is me preferring to hear a big female belt divisive nonsense? Why so aggressive over someone else's opinion?
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Post by intoanewlife on Aug 26, 2023 15:19:07 GMT
You both love the polarising A Strange Loop so your tastes can’t be that far apart! I think maybe if I hadn't seen Strange Loop or Preludes I may have had a different experience with this one. Both of those shows are very in-depth character studies of people going through different forms of mental illness (Usher/ C-PTSD and Sergi/depression) whereas this was totally surface level and required the audience to simply react with an 'ahhh ok...THAT happened', 'ahhh ok THAT explains it'. It doesn't really go any further than said moments triggering our own emotional reaction to 'the action' or 'the word', instead of giving any sort of understanding to how it has affected the character beyond manipulative 'kitchen sink drama' cliches. By the end of the first song in ASL, we know how Usher is feeling because of the style of the music and lyrics and the chaotic manner in which it is delivered. We know his situation while played out rather humorously, is complex and unpleasant. It is a sensory overload and therefore we know what is going on in his mind. It is twee, but informative. By the end of the first song in Preludes we know exactly how the lead character is feeling, what his minutely, hourly, daily existence is. That he is dead inside and feels absolutely nothing. It literally lulls the audience into his headspace. By the end of first song in NTN, we know the lead character likes to make sandwiches? At the end of a SL/P, like them or not, we know everything there is to know about Usher/Sergei. We know them inside and out...(in Ushers case literally (sorry)) and therefore our empathy has or hasn't been triggered for their plight. Beyond a few choice 'words' meant to trigger my emotions, I had absolutely no idea what what was wrong with this pretty blonde white lady beyond what those around her are telling me through their reactions to her. I'm sure if you've been stewing on the songs etc of this show for 15 years, your brain has done a lot of legwork in filling in the gaps in...well...everything and YOU are in fact making yourself feel a certain way because of your attachment to it, rather than the material doing it to you. But as someone going in totally blind, I was totally clueless to her plight beyond the buzzwords that ailed her. A little less time spent on the 'zippy' therapy method songs and a little more time telling me what she was actually feeling beyond missing mountains, would've helped immensely. While I know what depression feels like, I have no idea what 'bipolar' feels like and I still don't other than that maybe people suffering from it may find some relief in full-time employment at Pret-a-Manger?The sound was also pretty terrible. There was far too much bass and the drums and guitars were way too loud in the mix, which tended to drown out some of the lyrics. It just sounded so muddy and unpleasant and that was even before the We Will Rock You rejects kicked in. I also found the fact you could see the band in the most dramatic points of the show rather annoying. I found myself taken out of the show constantly watching the drummer move rather precariously between the drums and whatever else he was playing in such a tiny space. Every time he squished himself behind that drumset, I was waiting for him to knock them over the edge into the middle of the stage.
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1,442 posts
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Post by theatrefan62 on Aug 26, 2023 15:34:44 GMT
How exactly is me preferring to hear a big female belt divisive nonsense? Why so aggressive over someone else's opinion? In fairness you stated it as fact and finished with 'end of', so I'd agree it's quite a divisive statement to put two demographics up against eachother and declare one superior.
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Post by colelarson on Aug 26, 2023 15:59:16 GMT
I called the box office as wanted to know when they’d make a decision about tonight, before travelling in. They said it was an issue with sound that couldn’t be fixed in time, but that the evening is due to go ahead as planned. Good this evening is going ahead. Those that attended today should be contacted next week I was told as I left. I'm off to see Spongebob instead...I'm sure it will be just as good as I expected for Next to Normal!
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42ndBlvd
Swing
I'll be back where I was born to be
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Post by 42ndBlvd on Aug 26, 2023 16:39:33 GMT
This transfer is already signed. It’s definitely happening regardless of middling reviews. The big question is Caissie. Heard that a cast recording is in the works too...
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1,057 posts
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Post by David J on Aug 26, 2023 19:00:37 GMT
Another techicsl issue tonight. Enjoying it so far
The movable counter was proving a challenge to move for the actors. Just stopped the show to sort it out
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