|
Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2021 10:24:28 GMT
Think we should remember the statement from Curve whilst discussing the conclusion of this: "we do not condone any negativity Seyi Omooba has been subjected to and we respectfully ask anyone in support of this ruling to be kind and respectful in acknowledging this victory for Curve and Celie"
|
|
2,266 posts
|
Post by theatreian on Feb 17, 2021 10:29:48 GMT
Yes a very gracious statement from The Curve. So glad this case had this result.
|
|
721 posts
|
Post by hulmeman on Feb 17, 2021 10:51:10 GMT
Had she done her homework, as she should have done, before audition, she would have known the possible interpretation and discussed that with the creative team before auditioning.
I also notice that her father Ade Omoba is a co-founder of Christian Concern, an organisation which backed her tribunal case. Andrea Williams is the group's chief executive, and often pipes up with anti-gay cases.
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Feb 17, 2021 11:02:29 GMT
I sincerely hope we shall never hear from this person again.
She has essentially killed her own career in the performing arts and so we need never bother with her again.
As the case progressed, it was clear that each time she and her representative spoke in the tribunal, they lessened their chance of success.
It shows that if you want to win in a complicated area of employment law, you need to engage a lawyer not a dodgy mate of your father.
Today is a day to celebrate.
|
|
805 posts
|
Post by duncan on Feb 17, 2021 11:41:38 GMT
Is it normal to accept a part without actually reading the script?
I mean surely actors read the script to make sure they aren't going to be required to do something they are not comfortable with - nudity, being covered in blood at every performance, singing, excessive make-up, working at height etc etc.
|
|
4,799 posts
|
Post by The Matthew on Feb 17, 2021 12:28:50 GMT
Is it normal to accept a part without actually reading the script? Truly dedicated actors perform without reading the script. How can you truly get inside the performance unless you perceive it as the character would perceive it, with no forewarning?
(That's totally the reason why I've only performed on stage exactly once in my life, and nothing at all to do with the fact that I could fail to be the most talented person in a one-person show.)
|
|
4,038 posts
|
Post by kathryn on Feb 17, 2021 12:35:09 GMT
In all seriousness it is true that some actors don’t want to go into rehearsal having done too much script work as they want to discover it as part of their process. But presumably they have some way of researching parts that allows them to still know what it is they are getting into and can audition for their part meaningfully.
Or they accept that not reading it beforehand means that they will be surprised by it and have to be flexible enough psychologically to deal with that.
|
|
4,038 posts
|
Post by kathryn on Feb 17, 2021 12:40:48 GMT
I loved the reason that although she was in a concert version of THE COLOR PURPLE before, she "popped out" during the "intimate" section so didn't realise what was going on.So she wasn't around for any of the rehearsals, dress rehearsals, band calls or performance?! Heh. I have noticed that if judges can decide a case by taking all of the testimony at face value and drawing conclusions from it they will do so, even in cases where one wonders if the testimony is credible. I end up reading far too many judgements directly because of my interest in press regulation - you absolutely cannot trust the press to accurately report on cases where they have lost, so you have to trawl through the judgement to find out what really happened.
|
|
4,159 posts
|
Post by HereForTheatre on Feb 17, 2021 12:45:31 GMT
The best way to move on from this and support Curve is by buying a ticket to watch The Color Purple stream, featuring a full cast who are committed to playing their parts correctly and spreading a positive message. It is also, btw, outstanding. I watched it last night.
I urge everyone to watch and support this show and theatre.
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Feb 17, 2021 14:44:54 GMT
There is no witch hunt
This person made those statements. And has not changed their mind or shown any willingness to grow.
Anyone is entitled to hold those opinions but those opinions once openly expressed are not worthy of protection under employment law.
A way out with full pay was offered and declined.
Legal action was started and someone without legal training was appointed their representative in the tribunal.
This person made claims that have been completely rejected.
They are the architect of their own misfortunes and must now reap what they have sown. They have made themselves unemployable in the career for which they trained. That is all down to their own actions.
|
|
3,760 posts
|
Post by anthony40 on Feb 17, 2021 15:14:05 GMT
Hopefully this matter will be closed and all that are involved can move on.
|
|
4,593 posts
|
Post by Someone in a tree on Feb 17, 2021 15:37:07 GMT
Without sounding like a witch hunter, I hope they're not any artists like her out there.
I suspect not in acting but wonder about about other domains in the performing arts
|
|
3,760 posts
|
Post by anthony40 on Feb 17, 2021 15:39:00 GMT
Without sounding like a witch hunter, I hope they're not any artists like her out there. I suspect not in acting but wonder about about other domains in the performing arts " Good fortune witch hunters!"- Sorry, couldn't resist.
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Feb 17, 2021 16:01:29 GMT
Without sounding like a witch hunter, I hope they're not any artists like her out there. I suspect not in acting but wonder about about other domains in the performing arts There are plenty who hold certain religious views but they keep their personal beliefs in the private realm. And there are plenty who choose their projects so not as to put themselves in conflict with their chosen beliefs. They probably fully understand that how they have chosen to live their lives does not offer them any special rights.
|
|
4,631 posts
|
Post by Phantom of London on Feb 17, 2021 17:51:56 GMT
Amen
|
|
18,806 posts
|
Post by BurlyBeaR on Feb 17, 2021 18:55:52 GMT
Remember, if that Facebook post hadn’t turned up she’d be in that production singing right now and no one would be any wiser. I don’t believe she would have turned it down when she came to realise she was playing a lesbian.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 19:06:46 GMT
'We' have become 'them' at breakneck speed...
|
|
|
Post by sph on Feb 17, 2021 19:42:56 GMT
Remember, if that Facebook post hadn’t turned up she’d be in that production singing right now and no one would be any wiser. I don’t believe she would have turned it down when she came to realise she was playing a lesbian. Yes I thought the same thing too. Although all of this "I had no idea she was a lesbian and wouldn't have played it if she was" doesn't ring true really. I think she was most likely just trying to save face and ended up totally upsetting the apple cart. I'm not sure how I feel about people doing deep-dives into social media histories to find things actors might have said years ago though. This girl dropped herself in it by responding so badly, but another actor who perhaps said something similar years ago and has since had a rethink might have suffered a similar fate without the possibility of explaining how they'd changed. I don't know, everyone has a past, and no one's is perfect, but people change too. I'm not sure anyone would like to be judged on things they said or did ten years ago. Or twenty.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 19:55:08 GMT
I think she'd have actually been given a script, read it, found out she couldn't possible play the role, told the company, they'd have replaced her and none of this nonsense would've occurred.
But then logic doesn't usually work in the face of emotional frenzy.
|
|
4,038 posts
|
Post by kathryn on Feb 17, 2021 19:58:48 GMT
That’s not what she says would have happened, though. She says she would have reinterpreted the role and only have quit in rehearsals when it became clear that wasn’t what the director wanted.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 20:05:51 GMT
That’s not what she says would have happened, though. She says she would have reinterpreted the role and only have quit in rehearsals when it became clear that wasn’t what the director wanted. Where did she say this?
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 20:45:49 GMT
Remember, if that Facebook post hadn’t turned up she’d be in that production singing right now and no one would be any wiser. I don’t believe she would have turned it down when she came to realise she was playing a lesbian. I'm not sure how I feel about people doing deep-dives into social media histories to find things actors might have said years ago though. This girl dropped herself in it by responding so badly, but another actor who perhaps said something similar years ago and has since had a rethink might have suffered a similar fate without the possibility of explaining how they'd changed. I don't know, everyone has a past, and no one's is perfect, but people change too. I'm not sure anyone would like to be judged on things they said or did ten years ago. Or twenty. I would like to know if the post was still there or if he had taken a screen shot of it from the time it was posted and saved it. In the interview posted a couple of pages back she says didn't even know where the post had come from. Either way it takes a special kind of person to sit on something like that for so long waiting for the other person to have a moment of joy in their lives so they can jump out and get their 'gotcha' moment. I wonder how he'd have felt if on the day he got his role in Hamilton someone had done the same to him. EDIT: The post had been removed and it was a screenshot. This is what Whoopi Goldberg said about Celie... “Not really about feminism, or lesbianism, despite the fact that Celie finds out about love and tenderness from another woman….It has nothing to do with lesbianism. It has to do with, her eyes are opened, now she understands.”
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Feb 17, 2021 22:07:58 GMT
I don't know why certain posters appear to be acting as apologists for this person.
What matters is that those views were expressed and were still held. How they came to be more widely noticed is not relevant.
People are capable of changing over time and this should be encouraged. But when someone doubles down on views that put them in direct conflict with their colleagues and the ethos of a workplace then it is clear they are not (at least) for now willing to change, grow or make amends.
The person who lost their tribunal case today seems to fall clearly into that category. But it is their own actions and chosen belief that created this situation and caused huge stress/expense for a theatre and company going through the most challenging time for the arts.
I will not feel any sympathy for someone who has done this to themselves. They have had plenty of time as an adult to emerge from the direct influence/control of their parent. They have to take responsibility for their own choices.
If they want to return to the world of musical theatre then the onus is on them and them alone to do the heavy lifting of educating themselves so that they can make better choices. If the right apologies are made and a clear understanding of the harm that their past actions have caused then support will be there as they continue on a more enlightened path.
Unless and until that happens, self-inflicted obscurity is all that they deserve.
|
|
4,631 posts
|
Post by Phantom of London on Feb 17, 2021 23:37:40 GMT
I'm not sure how I feel about people doing deep-dives into social media histories to find things actors might have said years ago though. This girl dropped herself in it by responding so badly, but another actor who perhaps said something similar years ago and has since had a rethink might have suffered a similar fate without the possibility of explaining how they'd changed. I don't know, everyone has a past, and no one's is perfect, but people change too. I'm not sure anyone would like to be judged on things they said or did ten years ago. Or twenty. I would like to know if the post was still there or if he had taken a screen shot of it from the time it was posted and saved it. In the interview posted a couple of pages back she says didn't even know where the post had come from. Either way it takes a special kind of person to sit on something like that for so long waiting for the other person to have a moment of joy in their lives so they can jump out and get their 'gotcha' moment. I wonder how he'd have felt if on the day he got his role in Hamilton someone had done the same to him. EDIT: The post had been removed and it was a screenshot. This is what Whoopi Goldberg said about Celie... “Not really about feminism, or lesbianism, despite the fact that Celie finds out about love and tenderness from another woman….It has nothing to do with lesbianism. It has to do with, her eyes are opened, now she understands.” I don’t believe for one moment that someone took a screenshot of a homophobic comment, saved it and held on to it - just in case the actor worked with this actor again and it just so happened not only for the person to be working with seyi, but in a role she is playing a lesbian to give the screenshot that extra gravitas, just so the actor could have a “gotcha” moment. Next you are going to try and kid me that we had a white suprematist as President of the United States. When confronted with the screenshot, she could have just apologised and say she doesn’t hold those views anymore.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 23:38:53 GMT
I don't know why certain posters fail to see the fact that there are 2 sides to every story and that your thoughts on something is not the only story worth telling. You also don't get to be right simply because you kicked and screamed the loudest and think your word is gospel (Oh the irony) no matter how many followers you gather.
You seem to think you know everything this person coulda, shoulda, woulda done and that is that. You know exactly what she did, every thought she had, without taking any sort of logic, reason and you know...reality into consideration. Everything in life is cause and effect and I am not condoning her actions or sticking up for her in anyway, I am merely trying to provide some kind of context to the situation instead of looking at everything from a purely emotionally blinkered level.
Anyways I will bow out now and leave you to it. That fact that you think it is perfectly acceptable to destroy someone's life for saying they agree with biblical text on a social media platform 6 years ago is just absolutely horrifying to me. How you think that kind of intolerance and ignorance is any different than hers is beyond me.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 23:44:05 GMT
I would like to know if the post was still there or if he had taken a screen shot of it from the time it was posted and saved it. In the interview posted a couple of pages back she says didn't even know where the post had come from. Either way it takes a special kind of person to sit on something like that for so long waiting for the other person to have a moment of joy in their lives so they can jump out and get their 'gotcha' moment. I wonder how he'd have felt if on the day he got his role in Hamilton someone had done the same to him. EDIT: The post had been removed and it was a screenshot. This is what Whoopi Goldberg said about Celie... “Not really about feminism, or lesbianism, despite the fact that Celie finds out about love and tenderness from another woman….It has nothing to do with lesbianism. It has to do with, her eyes are opened, now she understands.” I don’t believe for one moment that someone took a screenshot of a homophobic comment, saved it and held on to it - Well that is what happened so once again it doesn't matter what people in this thread 'think' or 'believe'. Facebook post from 2014 After the cast was announced, however, on March 15, Seyi was tagged on Twitter by another West End performer, Aaron Lee Lambert , who is not known to her. With a screenshot of a Facebook post that Miss Omooba had posted four-and-half-years ago on September 18 2014.
|
|
4,458 posts
|
Post by poster J on Feb 17, 2021 23:53:00 GMT
That fact that you think it is perfectly acceptable to destroy someone's life for saying they agree with biblical text on a social media platform 6 years ago is just absolutely horrifying to me. How you think that kind of intolerance and ignorance is any different than hers is beyond me. The fact that you can't see that the only person who destroyed her life is her is beyond me. Whether or not you think it was right for the Facebook post to be re-published or not, she could have dealt with it maturely and responsibly by apologising, or even by not apologising, taking the full payment the Curve offered her and walking away. Instead she chose to drag this through the mud and bring a claim that was doomed to fail. She has no-one but herself to blame for that.
|
|
|
Post by intoanewlife on Feb 17, 2021 23:59:08 GMT
That fact that you think it is perfectly acceptable to destroy someone's life for saying they agree with biblical text on a social media platform 6 years ago is just absolutely horrifying to me. How you think that kind of intolerance and ignorance is any different than hers is beyond me. The fact that you can't see that the only person who destroyed her life is her is beyond me. Whether or not you think it was right for the Facebook post to be re-published or not, she could have dealt with it maturely and responsibly by apologising, or even by not apologising, taking the full payment the Curve offered her and walking away. Instead she chose to drag this through the mud and bring a claim that was doomed to fail. She has no-one but herself to blame for that. You don't think her Father had anything to do with it?
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Feb 17, 2021 23:59:19 GMT
I have been arguing passionately on this subject since it first came to our attention because it absolutely matters.
It distresses me that we are still having to fight religion-based homophobia.
My right to exist as a gay man is not up for debate by anyone. And certainly not by someone who is relying on ancient texts to justify their hate.
Nothing any of us have said in this forum will have the slightest impact on the future employment prospects of Seyi Omooba. We have no responsibility for her whatsoever.
She is responsible for her own actions, her own choices, her own chosen beliefs and the only one to blame for the position in which she has found herself. Not the Curve. Not the person who shared her Facebook post. And certainly not anyone on this theatre discussion forum.
We are not destroying anything. The damage to her reputation and her future employment prospects are entirely self inflicted.
|
|
|
Post by d'James on Feb 18, 2021 0:59:51 GMT
The best way to move on from this and support Curve is by buying a ticket to watch The Color Purple stream, featuring a full cast who are committed to playing their parts correctly and spreading a positive message. It is also, btw, outstanding. I watched it last night. I urge everyone to watch and support this show and theatre. Yes I would like to. If I pay, can I watch it from Spain?
|
|