42ndBlvd
Swing
I'll be back where I was born to be
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Post by 42ndBlvd on Aug 1, 2020 21:43:39 GMT
I really hope they don’t replace the whole lighting rig with full LED lighting, when I last saw it the lighting was brilliant and fit the period ( the Hannibal scenes looked gaslit) The world tour and Broadway productions are much brighter compared to London's. Its most obvious during PONR, you can barely make out the backdrop. You can still make the lighting look gaslight and LED is much cheaper and better for the environment after all. Would be a nice way for Cam to save his precious money....
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 7:43:18 GMT
I really hope they don’t replace the whole lighting rig with full LED lighting, when I last saw it the lighting was brilliant and fit the period ( the Hannibal scenes looked gaslit) The world tour and Broadway productions are much brighter compared to London's. Its most obvious during PONR, you can barely make out the backdrop. You can still make the lighting look gaslight and LED is much cheaper and better for the environment after all. Would be a nice way for Cam to save his precious money.... Thats one of the features I loved about the London production. Some of the lighting fixtures were veritably vintage, seeing them out in the auditorium added to the effect of being transported to back a century. Whilst some of the LX effects left a lot to the imagination that was part of the charm of the show. Realistically it's going to be relit in mostly LED for cost & because thats the technology currently available, although a number of fixtures still come in tungsten. A discussion for another topic, but an unknown about Brexit is what will happen in the UK with regard to the EU rules on phasing out tungsten lighting, something the lighting industry was fighting against.
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1,998 posts
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Post by distantcousin on Aug 3, 2020 14:14:33 GMT
Gosh, well this has certainly been the thread that keeps on giving over the last few days. Fortunately the RUG statement I think does clarify things a bit. I agree with @burlybear above that Cam Mac's statement didn't really add as much as the subsequent social media fall out thought. Was a bizarre place to announce this, the grammar in the actual sentence was wrong, 'permanent closure' but 'back soon' doesn't really make sense and we already knew that an extended closure was needed. Also CM's rhetoric throughout has been fairly overdramatic. So anyway, I didn't think it was the end of Phantom for good! As for what's going on between CM and ALW - I mean who knows! It's all rather speculative. I don't think this is a combined and agreed PR strategy. And I don't think they are at complete loggerheads either. Rather, somewhere in the middle. In ALW's book he talks about how when he met CM he'd really discovered his MT soulmate and how they had so much in common. But later he acknowledged that he was aware of a very bitchy side of CM that he really didn't like. And certainly it seems from various things that CM does like being in full control and really has to get his own way. His outbursts in that musical TV series (he was in Chichester I think?) were quite telling. And when Jodie Prenger won I'd Do Anything he was unbelievably rude. He really didn't get that the whole point of the thing was that the public were choosing - not him. Having said all that, I think we need to cut him some slack. From the general tone of everything he says he is clearly not in a good place. The pandemic has affected everyone in different ways, and some very deeply, with a way of life that is very different. Anxiety, depression, mood swings etc etc can affect anyone. Being rich and privileged in no way makes you immune to this. I offer that as a reason for his current behaviour rather than an excuse. ALW knows him better than anyone so I doubt is surprised by much of this, and is probably trying to restore calm from CM's outbursts. Of course, this is all purely speculative. But having followed both for a long time is my hunch. Also, CM has brought SO much to UK musical for DECADES that as a fan I am truly grateful for everything he's done. He has produced some of the most incredible musicals and brought employment to literally thousands worldwide since the 80s. He has produced the most epic UK tours ever, bringing West End quality to the regions. Cats, Phantom, Les Mis, Miss Saigon, Mary Poppins have been incredible. If he never produced a quality production again, his legacy would be insanely good. But this continues. I was caught up in the disappointment at the Les Mis changes. But the 25th version is fantastic. Ditto the original and new Miss Saigons. 99.9% of the people that saw the latest Phantom in Leicester were raving about it. So there is literally no indication that he is about to start delivering substandard products. As for the other stuff, and exactly what kind of "phantom" will return, I am sure it will be great. It desperately needed updating. This set was creaky, the mannequins for Masquerade ridiculous and don't even get me started on the lightning bolt and the fireballs. The chandelier moved up and down at a snails pace. I simply don't believe that he is desperate to wipe our Prince, Lynne and Bjornson for financial gain. But things can and do need to progress. Even for living creatives, things are still interpreted without them. Trevor doesn't get involved with every production of Cats. John Napier doesn't design the exact replica of every single set. Other people who know them adapt their direction/designs for every theatre. Phantom should not be a museum piece. And I am sure will return slicker and more spectacular than ever. Also - controversial opinion - the musical is the star. It's not the case with the returning Phantom, but if in the future, a totally different creative team wanted to give it a go, it'd be great to see what they could do. OK the 25th version was not as good as the original, but that doesn't mean the original is completely sacred and nobody could ever dare to reimagine it. So many people obsessed with Prince's Evita - personally I preferred the Adelphi revival. And the OAT version of Superstar is by far and away the best version I personally have ever seen. So anyway, I am really looking fwd to seeing the new Phantom when it returns - hopefully in a format that can last another 34 years! Bravi, bravi, braVISSimi!!!
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Post by digipal on Aug 14, 2020 16:47:23 GMT
I don't deny or dispute any of the above. What is being contested are the repeated (groundless, besides optimism) assertions in this thread that the show will definitely return "more spectacular than ever", and that the concerns expressed in this thread by various posters are somehow invalidated by RUG's statement yesterday. So far, there isn't enough to lend any certainty to this. So it's only going to be natural that there is concern here. We will not know until the show opens again. Until then, none of us can say for certain what is going to happen either way. You have chosen to place faith in Mackintosh; I personally don't. Thank you, I feel the same. Taking this stance keeps me clear-headed and spares me the emotional rollercoaster that Cammack/RUG/ALW's PR teams seems to be bringing everyone on. I'm naturally skeptical, and if the words "Cammack", "update", "for the 21st century" are involved, then oof- tenfold. The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2020 10:00:19 GMT
Thank you, I feel the same. Taking this stance keeps me clear-headed and spares me the emotional rollercoaster that Cammack/RUG/ALW's PR teams seems to be bringing everyone on. I'm naturally skeptical, and if the words "Cammack", "update", "for the 21st century" are involved, then oof- tenfold. The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp Lighting update in as much as new fixtures and reprogramming yes. Projection? It's a black box production. Dont know if you've ever tried projecting video onto a black surface? Doesnt work too well.
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Post by scarpia on Aug 16, 2020 13:57:59 GMT
The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp Lighting update in as much as new fixtures and reprogramming yes. Projection? It's a black box production. Dont know if you've ever tried projecting video onto a black surface? Doesnt work too well.
Indeed - the whole point of the original production is that it is a conscious recreation of Victorian staging techniques. It is what gives the show its aura and charm. LED screens and video projections? No, thanks.
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Post by Seriously on Aug 16, 2020 15:01:29 GMT
So are you saying you'll never see the London production again because you won't like the lighting?
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19,685 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Aug 16, 2020 15:57:39 GMT
There’s a scene, might be the graveyard I don’t quite remember, where you see the clouds moving across the night sky on the back wall. If that’s not a projection what is it?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2020 16:01:18 GMT
The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp Lighting update in as much as new fixtures and reprogramming yes. Projection? It's a black box production. Dont know if you've ever tried projecting video onto a black surface? Doesnt work too well.
So I think it very much can. For Starlight's 30th (Bochum) they painted the whole set jet black and added very extensive projections (a mistake IMHO but there we are). So in fact for some high tech projections they need black to work!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2020 16:02:33 GMT
So are you saying you'll never see the London production again because you won't like the lighting? I have similarly wondered if the "brilliant original" devotees will still be going if it isn't 100% as previous - they have been very clear on how they would feel about any changes.
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Post by theatre241 on Aug 16, 2020 16:39:44 GMT
The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp Lighting update in as much as new fixtures and reprogramming yes. Projection? It's a black box production. Dont know if you've ever tried projecting video onto a black surface? Doesnt work too well.
In all I ask of you does anyone notice very faint moving clouds in the sky, I think they are projections
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19,685 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Aug 16, 2020 17:16:23 GMT
Lighting update in as much as new fixtures and reprogramming yes. Projection? It's a black box production. Dont know if you've ever tried projecting video onto a black surface? Doesnt work too well.
In all I ask of you does anyone notice very faint moving clouds in the sky, I think they are projections Asked the same question a couple of posts above. Thanks for confirming which song that happens in.
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19,685 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Aug 16, 2020 17:20:31 GMT
So are you saying you'll never see the London production again because you won't like the lighting? I have similarly wondered if the "brilliant original" devotees will still be going if it isn't 100% as previous - they have been very clear on how they would feel about any changes. This is the epitome of cutting your nose off to spite your face. We’ve seeen it with Les Miserables. People saying they’ll never go again because something got changed “I can’t POSSIBLY enjoy this show without the creaky revolve and those dreadful sh*t brown window shutters on the back wall... I’m DISGUSTED “. I seriously don’t get it. Even if the new version was better they’ll probably never admit it.
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Post by theatre241 on Aug 16, 2020 17:31:58 GMT
There’s a scene, might be the graveyard I don’t quite remember, where you see the clouds moving across the night sky on the back wall. If that’s not a projection what is it? Yes I dont know how else they'd do it, does anyone know how they do it? Is there a projector on one of the circles?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2020 17:47:35 GMT
I have similarly wondered if the "brilliant original" devotees will still be going if it isn't 100% as previous - they have been very clear on how they would feel about any changes. This is the epitome of cutting your nose off to spite your face. We’ve seeen it with Les Miserables. People saying they’ll never go again because something got changed “I can’t POSSIBLY enjoy this show without the creaky revolve and those dreadful sh*t brown window shutters on the back wall... I’m DISGUSTED “. I seriously don’t get it. Even if the new version was better they’ll probably never admit it. Agree 100%.
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Post by theatremole on Aug 16, 2020 17:55:29 GMT
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Post by theatre241 on Aug 16, 2020 17:58:01 GMT
do they use this for the cloud effect?
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Post by theatremole on Aug 16, 2020 18:03:11 GMT
I believe so.
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Post by ronnette on Aug 16, 2020 19:49:12 GMT
ALW has just posted a new video on FB - quite strong words from him. Original production coming back, boo to the naysayers basically....
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Post by westendboy on Aug 16, 2020 19:55:09 GMT
ALW has just posted a new video on FB - quite strong words from him. Original production coming back, boo to the naysayers basically.... Just watched it myself. Let's just hope this eases our nerves.
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2,245 posts
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Post by richey on Aug 16, 2020 20:29:00 GMT
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Post by Seriously on Aug 16, 2020 21:49:58 GMT
Sounds to me like he's fed up of arguing with Cameron, so he's calling his bluff by just announcing what will happen.
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Post by westendboy on Aug 16, 2020 22:02:00 GMT
Sounds to me like he's fed up of arguing with Cameron, so he's calling his bluff by just announcing what will happen. Can't say I blame him
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42ndBlvd
Swing
I'll be back where I was born to be
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Post by 42ndBlvd on Aug 16, 2020 22:03:20 GMT
There’s a scene, might be the graveyard I don’t quite remember, where you see the clouds moving across the night sky on the back wall. If that’s not a projection what is it? Yes I dont know how else they'd do it, does anyone know how they do it? Is there a projector on one of the circles? They do have a projector that's usually used for special events on a small 100-200 inch screen, don't really think it's powerful enough to project clouds on the rooftop backdrop though. There's some youth performing schools that often perform at Her Majesty's during the summer. I think they may use lighting gobos to create the moving cloud effects.
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Post by 141920grm on Aug 17, 2020 10:14:51 GMT
This is the epitome of cutting your nose off to spite your face. We’ve seeen it with Les Miserables. People saying they’ll never go again because something got changed “I can’t POSSIBLY enjoy this show without the creaky revolve and those dreadful sh*t brown window shutters on the back wall... I’m DISGUSTED “. I seriously don’t get it. Even if the new version was better they’ll probably never admit it. Agree 100%. If the disgruntlement of random strangers on the Internet brings you so much glee and cause for self-congratulation, by all means don't let anyone stop you 😂 Thank you, I feel the same. Taking this stance keeps me clear-headed and spares me the emotional rollercoaster that Cammack/RUG/ALW's PR teams seems to be bringing everyone on. I'm naturally skeptical, and if the words "Cammack", "update", "for the 21st century" are involved, then oof- tenfold. The chandelier in the Vegas production was spectacular, it seemed to be in three separate spinning pieces and when it took off above you, you could feel it moving. Several people ducked including me. I'm guessing updated lighting, new front projection mapping technology and LED screens will form part of any revamp This line of reasoning has been addressed before; the Vegas production was designed and is highly-regarded as a standalone alternate, the most recent tour productions tried to market themselves as surpassing the brilliant original and failed. So are you saying you'll never see the London production again because you won't like the lighting? Lighting design is as much of an art as set design, sound design, costume design, choreography- according to the humble opinions of Olivier/Tony Award judges- are you insinuating something about people whose future visits would indeed depend on the quality of changes in that aspect?
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