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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2020 13:09:47 GMT
This is when I wish I had a DMT+ account. Just logged on to get one of those £20, £30, £40 tickets only to find that they don't exist. Normal prices and cheapest are £37.50 at back of stalls and £22.50 for back row of dress circle. I guess the offer was for members who had pre-booking opportunities. But looking at the prices they aren't silly money. It is a show I would like to see again next year but as they operate dynamic pricing I think I will hold out as if the tourists don't come back next year, which is quite possible, then prices could be lower nearer the time. I have a DMT+ membership, didn’t get an email about the offer, and didn’t get a response when I emailed (twice!) to enquire as to why. Frustrating. I got the email but I think I’d previously opted to have emails specifically for BoM. Snapped up £40 row E stalls which I’m pleased about. I’ve not seen the show before, is this a good deal? If anyone wants me to forward the email to them I’ll happily do it. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 19, 2020 13:10:57 GMT
Just thought I’d add, I don’t have a DMT account so I don’t think it was an offer from them.
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Post by FrontrowverPaul on Dec 19, 2020 13:37:41 GMT
The offer as I received it was definitely headed "DMT+" and included "As a DMT+ member we would like to offer you .."
It was due to end yesterday at 5pm and the link now leads to a page simply stating that the offer has expired.
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Post by CG on the loose on Dec 19, 2020 17:34:39 GMT
This is when I wish I had a DMT+ account. Just logged on to get one of those £20, £30, £40 tickets only to find that they don't exist. Normal prices and cheapest are £37.50 at back of stalls and £22.50 for back row of dress circle. I guess the offer was for members who had pre-booking opportunities. But looking at the prices they aren't silly money. It is a show I would like to see again next year but as they operate dynamic pricing I think I will hold out as if the tourists don't come back next year, which is quite possible, then prices could be lower nearer the time. I have a DMT+ membership, didn’t get an email about the offer, and didn’t get a response when I emailed (twice!) to enquire as to why. Frustrating. Likewise. |
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Post by stagebyte on Mar 14, 2021 0:48:16 GMT
Possible rewrites and a film.
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Post by sph on Mar 14, 2021 14:39:34 GMT
I always thought that the whole point of The Book of Mormon was its send-up and criticism of western religion. Every character from every group in the show is some form of stereotype, highly exaggerated. I'm pretty sure the gay Mormon character is not the most sensitive depiction of a gay man for example, but it serves as a humorous commentary on the existence of LGBT people trapped in the confines of a religious institution that condemns them.
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Post by danb on Mar 14, 2021 15:09:52 GMT
Yes, if it’s guilty of anything it’s being offensive to absolutely everyone. I’d rather they just stuck even more group numbers in there and upped the oooomph throughout. That’s when BOM is really great. The smaller stuff doesn’t land as well for me.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2021 21:54:28 GMT
I've been thinking about this since I saw this video with one of the cast members;
As much as I enjoyed this show (and was actually a couple of days away from seeing it a 2nd time when Boris announced the theatre closures), I found this really eye-opening. Will be very curious to see how the show changes if they go ahead with it.
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Post by marob on Mar 14, 2021 23:52:33 GMT
To be fair though I think the general public (myself included) only ever hear about Africa in terms of famines, pandemics, militias, and coups, and it’s that ignorance that they’re satirising, taken to the extreme. Is the show insensitive? Absolutely. But I’m not sure I’d agree that it’s racist.
I get her point about the stage door for the show, but that’s just the way it is. I’m sure at Wicked more people want a selfie with Elphaba than Flying Monkey #3.
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Post by musicalmarge on Mar 15, 2021 7:03:49 GMT
OH GOD
HERE WE GO
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 15, 2021 7:04:37 GMT
I agree with every word she says. I sat through it a few years ago and never cracked a smile. I found it offensive and unfunny.
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Post by mhumphries on Mar 15, 2021 9:51:28 GMT
If we are going to use BOM as an stick to beat the old ‘why there are there more white people in the audience then black people’ debate, maybe it’s not because they feel excluded, not because they are not interested and not because they feel the show insensitivity handles black representation poorly.
Maybe they are just smart enough to realise £90 to £100+ for a single ticket is not good value for money. Maybe they are smart enough to not support inflated ticket prices and there by locking anyone out of even a single ticket let alone a family booking.
As for the background artist concerns in the video, if that is what she felt looking out into the audience for Mormon, wonder if she would feel the same if she was in Hamilton?
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Post by musicalmarge on Mar 15, 2021 10:09:40 GMT
I agree with every word she says. I sat through it a few years ago and never cracked a smile. I found it offensive and unfunny. Offensive and unfunny is WHY it is funny. Lol It’s like laughing at a dying person who has cancer and one leg. Though desperately sad, sometimes black humour is needed and you can (and sometimes) HAVE to find humour in this crazy life. Book of Mormon is funny because it’s so horrendously rude, UN PC, racist, mocks religion, sexuality and life in general |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2021 10:57:17 GMT
I agree with every word she says. I sat through it a few years ago and never cracked a smile. I found it offensive and unfunny. Offensive and unfunny is WHY it is funny. Lol It’s like laughing at a dying person who has cancer and one leg. Though desperately sad, sometimes black humour is needed and you can (and sometimes) HAVE to find humour in this crazy life. Book of Mormon is funny because it’s so horrendously rude, UN PC, racist, mocks religion, sexuality and life in general No, not everyone needs black humour. I don't think there is any circumstance in which I would find laughing at a dying person who has cancer funny. That is grossly offensive. |
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Post by Mark on Mar 15, 2021 11:01:29 GMT
Offensive and unfunny is WHY it is funny. Lol It’s like laughing at a dying person who has cancer and one leg. Though desperately sad, sometimes black humour is needed and you can (and sometimes) HAVE to find humour in this crazy life. Book of Mormon is funny because it’s so horrendously rude, UN PC, racist, mocks religion, sexuality and life in general No, not everyone needs black humour. I don't think there is any circumstance in which I would find laughing at a dying person who has cancer funny. That is grossly offensive. My sister was a dancer but she got cancer The doctor said she still had two months more I thought she had time, so I got in line For the new iPhone at the Apple Store She lay there dying with my father and mother Her very last words were, "Where is my brother?" Turn it off! |
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Post by musicalmarge on Mar 15, 2021 11:41:52 GMT
Offensive and unfunny is WHY it is funny. Lol It’s like laughing at a dying person who has cancer and one leg. Though desperately sad, sometimes black humour is needed and you can (and sometimes) HAVE to find humour in this crazy life. Book of Mormon is funny because it’s so horrendously rude, UN PC, racist, mocks religion, sexuality and life in general No, not everyone needs black humour. I don't think there is any circumstance in which I would find laughing at a dying person who has cancer funny. That is grossly offensive. Actually without going into personal details about my life. You do find humour in the darkest times in your life. That’s exactly what you do. In my times visiting ICU in hospital I’ve laughed more than I cried. It’s called survival. So yes, you can laugh at someone who has cancer (including yourself). Offensive yes? Reality yes. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2021 12:04:40 GMT
No, not everyone needs black humour. I don't think there is any circumstance in which I would find laughing at a dying person who has cancer funny. That is grossly offensive. Actually without going into personal details about my life. You do find humour in the darkest times in your life. That’s exactly what you do. In my times visiting ICU in hospital I’ve laughed more than I cried. It’s called survival. So yes, you can laugh at someone who has cancer (including yourself). Offensive yes? Reality yes. Maybe thats the case for you, in your particular experience, butt you cant speak on the behalf of everyone else. Everyone has their own coping strategies. And just because you find it appropriate to laugh at a subject doesn't trivialise it for others. Some people are able to laugh and joke about rape, it doesn't make it any less devastating for those affected. Because your able to laugh at songs poking fun at racism doesn't mean that someone whose spent their life enduring racist remarks and been the subject of hatred, doesn't mean they'll respond the same way. |
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Post by singularsensation10 on Mar 15, 2021 12:50:24 GMT
I think a big reason why BOM has done so well over here is because of the British love for satire. And this is satirical about more things than African people. The big question is whether this is still appropriate after a huge shift in our culture and awareness of racism, and whether people that found this funny 5 years ago (because of it’s silly, satirical and jokey view on genuine people and their cultural differences, I don’t think people sit at this show and ‘laugh at Black people’, they laugh at the characters’ quirks and punchy one liners) will feel comfortable laughing at this in 2021.
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Post by sph on Mar 15, 2021 14:21:23 GMT
While I agree with parts of what she says (for example, fans tend to love the Mormons rather than the Africans, which is sad), her point about the Mormons coming to the village and the ending not REALLY being happy because people still have AIDS etc, is, in my understanding, the entire point of the show is it not? The show literally makes fun of white saviours - "We're here to save you and here's our religion to help us do it!" when in fact they haven't helped at all. And many of the Africans, while naive, are far smarter than the Mormons and just want help with their actual daily problems. Sort of like they're saying "If your God is real, why should we worship him when he's clearly screwed us over?"
As for representation within the audience, yes there are many cultural and economic factors which could contribute to why there are less black people than white people, but at the same time, you also have to remember that only just over 3% of the UK population is black, so statistically that's going to happen anyway.
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Post by robertb213 on Mar 15, 2021 14:53:15 GMT
I didn't find it overly offensive but equally I didn't laugh out loud either. Good songs though 😁
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Post by oxfordsimon on Mar 15, 2021 14:58:05 GMT
I think it would be better to close if thr alternative is to neuter the original intentions of the creators.
Perhaps there is a middle ground to be found. But their whole style of comedy is founded in finding ways to push boundaries and to exploit the idea of causing offence. If that spirit cannot be retained, it would be better to close rather than so blunt the satire that it ceases to satisfy.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2021 15:12:25 GMT
Actually without going into personal details about my life. You do find humour in the darkest times in your life. That’s exactly what you do. In my times visiting ICU in hospital I’ve laughed more than I cried. It’s called survival. So yes, you can laugh at someone who has cancer (including yourself). Offensive yes? Reality yes. Maybe thats the case for you, in your particular experience, butt you cant speak on the behalf of everyone else. Everyone has their own coping strategies. And just because you find it appropriate to laugh at a subject doesn't trivialise it for others. Some people are able to laugh and joke about rape, it doesn't make it any less devastating for those affected. Because your able to laugh at songs poking fun at racism doesn't mean that someone whose spent their life enduring racist remarks and been the subject of hatred, doesn't mean they'll respond the same way. Thank you, said much more eloquently than I had managed. I also distinguish between laughing AT someone and laughing WITH someone. There is a huge difference. |
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Post by musicalmarge on Mar 15, 2021 15:17:36 GMT
While I agree with parts of what she says (for example, fans tend to love the Mormons rather than the Africans, which is sad), her point about the Mormons coming to the village and the ending not REALLY being happy because people still have AIDS etc, is, in my understanding, the entire point of the show is it not? The show literally makes fun of white saviours - "We're here to save you and here's our religion to help us do it!" when in fact they haven't helped at all. And many of the Africans, while naive, are far smarter than the Mormons and just want help with their actual daily problems. Sort of like they're saying "If your God is real, why should we worship him when he's clearly screwed us over?" As for representation within the audience, yes there are many cultural and economic factors which could contribute to why there are less black people than white people, but at the same time, you also have to remember that only just over 3% of the UK population is black, so statistically that's going to happen anyway. Well if 3 per cent of the UK population is black that is NOT represented in UK adverts! It’s more like 50 per cent or more. I agree times have changed and with BLM and social justice here there and everywhere BOM is past its sell by date. Funny to some is now offensive to others. I get that. Do we adapt? Change? Or is this all a passing trend? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2021 15:51:11 GMT
While I agree with parts of what she says (for example, fans tend to love the Mormons rather than the Africans, which is sad), her point about the Mormons coming to the village and the ending not REALLY being happy because people still have AIDS etc, is, in my understanding, the entire point of the show is it not? The show literally makes fun of white saviours - "We're here to save you and here's our religion to help us do it!" when in fact they haven't helped at all. And many of the Africans, while naive, are far smarter than the Mormons and just want help with their actual daily problems. Sort of like they're saying "If your God is real, why should we worship him when he's clearly screwed us over?" As for representation within the audience, yes there are many cultural and economic factors which could contribute to why there are less black people than white people, but at the same time, you also have to remember that only just over 3% of the UK population is black, so statistically that's going to happen anyway. I agree times have changed and with BLM and social justice here there and everywhere BOM is past its sell by date. Funny to some is now offensive to others. I get that. Do we adapt? Change? Or is this all a passing trend? This kind of attitude is exactly the problem. |
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Post by sph on Mar 15, 2021 16:03:05 GMT
It's not really my sort of humour, and perhaps its moment has come and gone, but it does sell out consistently and tours with relative ease.
People may be a lot more sensitive in the future about how minorities are portrayed though. I can't remember who said it, but a comedian said comedy works if you're punching up, not punching down. So making fun of white, privileged Mormons might be easier to take than making jokes about Africans suffering from AIDS, especially in the post-2020 world.
As for the 3% statistic, that was according to the 2011 census.
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