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Post by Rory on Aug 4, 2023 11:33:13 GMT
Such a prolific figure back in the day but he hardly does anything now in the West End.
I wonder is it just because shows are so expensive to run now in London and he just wants to recycle his tours?
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Post by Jon on Aug 4, 2023 12:37:17 GMT
I suppose when you have the likes of Michael Harrison, Sonia Friedman and Wessex Grove to name but three, why go for someone like Kenwright?
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Post by andys on Aug 4, 2023 14:01:48 GMT
I believe that many, if not all West End venues will only take shows from BKL if they are desperate. His shows are not imaginative, innovative or daring. He also doesn't attract star casting, or spend enough on marketing. Even the poster designs all look the same.
I think he was more prevalent decades ago when Stoll Moss seemed content to take shows from him to fill the four Shaftesbury Avenue theatres.
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Post by Rory on Aug 4, 2023 15:45:41 GMT
Yes it's interesting. Years ago a show of his like Frank & Percy or this new play with Seagrove and Shaw would have been dead certs for Shaftesbury Avenue or the Haymarket, now both are doing Windsor and I suspect won't transfer in. His last West End run was Rob Madge at the Ambassadors but nothing before that for quite a while.
He did have a few interesting shows over the years. Plague Over England at the Duchess, On the Waterfront at the Haymarket, Let the Right One In at the Apollo stand out for me, and I did have a soft spot for The Exorcist at the Phoenix.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2023 15:49:07 GMT
Bill has always been careful with costs and maybe hiring West End theatres isn't cost effective to him these days. He can still get good audiences with No 1 tours and going around the secondary level provincial theatres.
I'd imagine Frank and Percy would be a shoe in to transfer in if Sir Ian would definitely do it.
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Post by toomasj on Aug 4, 2023 15:58:48 GMT
He is of course still chairman of Everton FC which takes up a huge chunk of his time, especially with fans being somewhat unhappy with his continued tenure there, and he is an old man at this stage.
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Post by andys on Aug 4, 2023 16:58:59 GMT
Bill has always been careful with costs and maybe hiring West End theatres isn't cost effective to him these days. He can still get good audiences with No 1 tours and going around the secondary level provincial theatres. I'd imagine Frank and Percy would be a shoe in to transfer in if Sir Ian would definitely do it. A different interpretation might be that he pays below average, and incessantly nitpicks over legitimate venue charges. Plenty will not work with him, and the west end seems to manage well without him.
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Post by partytentdown on Aug 4, 2023 18:30:55 GMT
He severed a lot of ties with venue owners, PRs, marketing agencies and many just don't want to work with him because of the reasons others have stated. One agency he used to work with a lot closed down in the last few years and I presume none of the remaining ones want anything to do with him. Hence working with out of town venues who come with their own sales, marketing, technical teams etc.
He does occasionally in shows in London (Rob Madge etc) but these were general managed by other people, he was just a money guy.
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Post by Jon on Aug 4, 2023 19:08:36 GMT
He severed a lot of ties with venue owners, PRs, marketing agencies and many just don't want to work with him because of the reasons others have stated. One agency he used to work with a lot closed down in the last few years and I presume none of the remaining ones want anything to do with him. Hence working with out of town venues who come with their own sales, marketing, technical teams etc. He does occasionally in shows in London (Rob Madge etc) but these were general managed by other people, he was just a money guy. Heathers is one of his shows as well but that's in a venue he owns. Apparently Willy Russell wasn't happy with how he was running Blood Brothers so the West End rights were withdrawn once it had closed.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2023 21:52:37 GMT
A different interpretation might be that he pays below average, and incessantly nitpicks over legitimate venue charges. Plenty will not work with him, and the west end seems to manage well without him. Bill has a reputation in the football world when he was Everton owner for being "careful" with his cash so maybe could be considered "tight". He would have to pay the Equity rates but probably doesn't pay above that unless it is to the select group of actors he seems to often cast in his plays. Some of them are pretty well known names and I'd assume they would want a reasonable rate. Also you can pretty much guess which names he will cast in many of his plays.
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Post by andys on Aug 5, 2023 6:47:06 GMT
Especially the female lead that happens to be his partner.
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Post by marob on Aug 5, 2023 7:55:29 GMT
What? Nepotism in the theatre industry? Shocking. 😮
Seriously though, he does have Heathers chugging along, both at the Other Palace and out on tour, as well as almost incessantly touring Calendar Girls and Blood Brothers and the just-announced 12 Angry Men. So he shouldn’t end up in the poor house just yet.
I quite like the idea that we might one-day get a new production of Blood Brothers. One that doesn’t cast people in their 50s to play kids. (Funny how they always cast a young actress for miniskirt-wearing Linda… 🙄) Still surprisingly powerful, but incredibly dated.
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Post by marob on Aug 5, 2023 9:52:19 GMT
Spoke too soon. Scratch Heathers off that list.
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Post by Rory on Aug 5, 2023 9:54:36 GMT
Patrick Duffy is doing the Twelve Angry Men tour.
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Post by theatrefan62 on Aug 5, 2023 10:39:41 GMT
Not just london, since covid he seems to only do smaller plays and his shows don't pop up at my local number 1 venue like they used to (aside blood brothers). Has he lost the rights for his usual musicals (evita, whistle etc).
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Post by partytentdown on Aug 5, 2023 10:40:43 GMT
The rights to the ALW musicals were taken back.
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Post by chestwig on Aug 6, 2023 8:29:24 GMT
The rights to the ALW musicals were taken back. Good coz Joseph has allways been terrible when he had the rights. C&N as i call him Cheap and Nasty. He ruined Ghost too when he had the rights to that. Only had Blood Brothers at the Phoenix so long as he was given free rent. Hope he never gets Joseph back among others….
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Post by TallPaul on Aug 6, 2023 12:25:28 GMT
Bill Kenwright's endless tour of Joseph probably introduced more people to the joy of musical theatre than any other production. And it went to places other tours didn't and don't.
It gave me a lot of pleasure over many years.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Aug 6, 2023 12:54:40 GMT
Bill Kenwright's endless tour of Joseph probably introduced more people to the joy of musical theatre than any other production. And it went to places other tours didn't and don't. It gave me a lot of pleasure over many years. I grew up on Panto and the Sooty show and then BK's Joseph rocked up at the Hull New Theatre. Pow! The rest is history!
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Post by westendboy on Aug 6, 2023 14:30:32 GMT
Only had Blood Brothers at the Phoenix so long as he was given free rent. I heard about that from someone I worked with briefly. Apparently he made a deal with whoever owned the Phoenix at the time to run the show and get him free rent, as was stated. But I suppose after ATG bought the venue, the deal broke down and resulted in the show's closure. Mind you, this is what I got from a second hand account, so it may not be the whole story, or even 100% accurate. But from reading the comments on this thread and the potential knowledge of Kenwright burning bridges, it may not be so far fetched.
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Post by Jon on Aug 6, 2023 17:29:26 GMT
I heard about that from someone I worked with briefly. Apparently he made a deal with whoever owned the Phoenix at the time to run the show and get him free rent, as was stated. But I suppose after ATG bought the venue, the deal broke down and resulted in the show's closure. Mind you, this is what I got from a second hand account, so it may not be the whole story, or even 100% accurate. But from reading the comments on this thread and the potential knowledge of Kenwright burning bridges, it may not be so far fetched. ATG IIRC wanted to get rid of Blood Brothers for quite some time because they weren't making much if anything in terms of rent from the show.
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Post by Rory on Aug 6, 2023 17:53:08 GMT
He must have given ATG rent after Blood Brothers though, because he produced Evita and The Exorcist at the Phoenix subsequently.
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Post by partytentdown on Aug 7, 2023 9:12:00 GMT
Patrick Duffy is doing the Twelve Angry Men tour. Can't wait for the updated diverse version " Twelve Angry Them" Immature and off-topic.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2023 20:06:06 GMT
Patrick Duffy is doing the Twelve Angry Men tour. Can't wait for the updated diverse version " Twelve Angry Them" Or they will do some gender blind casting.
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Post by mrbarnaby on Aug 8, 2023 9:43:13 GMT
Could Jenny possibly play a Heather?
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