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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 28, 2020 20:05:32 GMT
Thing is with Manchester it does have 3 theatres, however all the big shows end up in the Palace, the ones that can’t get the Palace end up in the Opera House. The Lowry seems to struggle to get shows. I would have thought Manchester scene would be much brisker, as it is our second biggest city. It is also very accessible from other cities such as Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool. So no big deal to go for a night out in other cities. Where in London you are pretty much trapped in London and it is very hard to go to other cities.. The main stage at the lowry is committed to regular performances from Opera North and Northern Ballet. Donkeys ago when I lived in Brum I remember the tour of Les Miz coming in and Welsh National Opera was kicked out of the Hippodrome. Back then they performed for three weeks of the year but because of Les Miz it was only two that year
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 20:07:28 GMT
Thing is with Manchester it does have 3 theatres, however all the big shows end up in the Palace, the ones that can’t get the Palace end up in the Opera House. The Lowry seems to struggle to get shows. I would have thought Manchester scene would be much brisker, as it is our second biggest city. It is also very accessible from other cities such as Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool. So no big deal to go for a night out in other cities. Where in London you are pretty much trapped in London and it is very hard to go to other cities.. Is the Palace more desirable than The Opera House in terms of location or stage/technical facilities? Was amazed when found out they have much the same seating capacity as the Palace feels so vast.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 28, 2020 20:17:38 GMT
Does anyone remember David Cameron's, genius plan of 'levelling up' the North by making the Royal Opera perform at the Palace Theatre for a season each year? It may have made a s*it down tour of I can't sing quite difficult... I can't remember what happened to the plan!
From my Manchester days I much preferred the Opera House.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 21:02:33 GMT
Thing is with Manchester it does have 3 theatres, however all the big shows end up in the Palace, the ones that can’t get the Palace end up in the Opera House. The Lowry seems to struggle to get shows. I would have thought Manchester scene would be much brisker, as it is our second biggest city. It is also very accessible from other cities such as Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool. So no big deal to go for a night out in other cities. Where in London you are pretty much trapped in London and it is very hard to go to other cities.. Is the Palace more desirable than The Opera House in terms of location or stage/technical facilities? Was amazed when found out they have much the same seating capacity as the Palace feels so vast. From what I can tell, the Palace stage is bigger than the Opera’s, so therefore it’s better equipped for big productions such as Wicked, Lion, Phantom. And also there are a hundred or so more seats, which I guess producers may enjoy as they can really cram people in.
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Post by david on Dec 28, 2020 21:03:51 GMT
I'm another fan of the Manc Opera House. For me it just has that more intimate feel that the Palace doesn't.
I am glad that producers are using cities like Manchester more for previewing shows rather than just going straight to the WE. It hopefully gives opportunities to people to see these shows who may not be able to get to London.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 21:24:20 GMT
I’ve only been to the Palace and I wasn’t a fan, found the FOH very claustrophobic and legroom too tight. Can’t speak for the other Manc theatres but the Lowry looks lovely.
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Post by danb on Dec 28, 2020 21:33:48 GMT
The Opera House looks and feels more like an opera house, hence it being Phantoms obvious second home. The Palace isn’t very comfortable but is much better located right opposite the station. The Opera House less so and much further down the road...
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Post by sph on Dec 28, 2020 21:39:58 GMT
I doubt Cats was to be open-ended in Blackpool - it's a tourist town and is very quiet during the winter, a show wouldn't survive past the summer/illuminations season. It's virtually empty from November to April. Other musicals have done long summer seasons there too. Mamma Mia did a few years back I think.
There have been a few sit-downs outside the UK within Europe. Germany is known for them but apparently in Spain, Madrid has had a production of The Lion King running since 2011!
I guess UK sit-downs are rare because London is technically quite accessible for most of the country. I could imagine Harry Potter doing an open-ended Manchester run, but everything else will just tour with a few elongated summer/christmas stops.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 28, 2020 21:57:43 GMT
Is the Palace more desirable than The Opera House in terms of location or stage/technical facilities? Was amazed when found out they have much the same seating capacity as the Palace feels so vast. From what I can tell, the Palace stage is bigger than the Opera’s, so therefore it’s better equipped for big productions such as Wicked, Lion, Phantom. And also there are a hundred or so more seats, which I guess producers may enjoy as they can really cram people in. The Palace has 35 extra seats. I actually prefer the Lowry, over the Palace and Opera House.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 28, 2020 22:02:08 GMT
Toronto used to be massive for sit downslope until 9/11 changed everything.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 28, 2020 22:52:58 GMT
Put the above in English.
Toronto used to be a massive sit down city, until 9/11 changed everything.
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Post by JJShaw on Dec 28, 2020 23:27:09 GMT
Put the above in English. Toronto used to be a massive sit down city, until 9/11 changed everything. Very interested as to why you think that, would love to know more please! Also am I wrong in thinking Book of Mormon was trying to have a sit down in Manchester or again was it an extended stay before kicking off the tour?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 23:49:33 GMT
From what I can tell, the Palace stage is bigger than the Opera’s, so therefore it’s better equipped for big productions such as Wicked, Lion, Phantom. And also there are a hundred or so more seats, which I guess producers may enjoy as they can really cram people in. The Palace has 35 extra seats. I actually prefer the Lowry, over the Palace and Opera House. Really? Only that many more? It’s been a while since I looked.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 29, 2020 0:56:21 GMT
Put the above in English. Toronto used to be a massive sit down city, until 9/11 changed everything. Very interested as to why you think that, would love to know more please! Also am I wrong in thinking Book of Mormon was trying to have a sit down in Manchester or again was it an extended stay before kicking off the tour? Glad to fill you in then. Americans used to go to Toronto, as in some cases it was closer and cheaper than New York. Toronto being close to the states of New York, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Ohio. So Americans went for a cheaper weekend in Toronto instead of New York. Americans didn’t need a passport to enter Canada, but 9/11 changed that and now a passport is required as well as an ESTA. Toronto lost it big shows and also some of its theatres, it now resembles, how this for irony as we have been talking about it and that is Manchester, with having just 3 big theatres.It also didn’t help having a big impresario who was corrupt, who embezzled money and ended up doing a stretch. Glad to see Toronto making a comeback with audiences flocking to see The homegrown Come From Away. That is why Phantom run so long there, with Colm Wilkinson.
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Post by undeuxtrois on Dec 29, 2020 1:21:19 GMT
I'm another fan of the Manc Opera House. For me it just has that more intimate feel that the Palace doesn't. I am glad that producers are using cities like Manchester more for previewing shows rather than just going straight to the WE. It hopefully gives opportunities to people to see these shows who may not be able to get to London.
My only issue with the Opera House is the poor rake in the stalls. I sat in (I think) row M for The King And I, and even then I was having to peer my head round those in front at times. Other than that I prefer it to the Palace despite it being further away from Deansgate station which I use when going to the Opera House.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 29, 2020 1:21:39 GMT
Thing is with Manchester it does have 3 theatres, however all the big shows end up in the Palace, the ones that can’t get the Palace end up in the Opera House. The Lowry seems to struggle to get shows. I would have thought Manchester scene would be much brisker, as it is our second biggest city. It is also very accessible from other cities such as Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool. So no big deal to go for a night out in other cities. Where in London you are pretty much trapped in London and it is very hard to go to other cities.. The main stage at the lowry is committed to regular performances from Opera North and Northern Ballet. Donkeys ago when I lived in Brum I remember the tour of Les Miz coming in and Welsh National Opera was kicked out of the Hippodrome. Back then they performed for three weeks of the year but because of Les Miz it was only two that year Opera North also play Leeds (where it’s based), Nottingham and Newcastle as part of their season. Northern Ballet also tour. This leaves big holes in the Lowry schedule. I know when I am in Manchester and want to see something else, it is hard to find something appealing in the Lowry, it is very hit and miss there. The Lowry also did/does a big Christmas musical, recently it did The Girls, Dr Doolittle, Elf and White Christmas. The Palace also do a big Christmas musical. Where the Opera House always does a pantomime.
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Post by sarissima on Dec 29, 2020 11:36:25 GMT
I doubt Cats was to be open-ended in Blackpool - it's a tourist town and is very quiet during the winter, a show wouldn't survive past the summer/illuminations season. It's virtually empty from November to April. Other musicals have done long summer seasons there too. Mamma Mia did a few years back I think. There have been a few sit-downs outside the UK within Europe. Germany is known for them but apparently in Spain, Madrid has had a production of The Lion King running since 2011! I guess UK sit-downs are rare because London is technically quite accessible for most of the country. I could imagine Harry Potter doing an open-ended Manchester run, but everything else will just tour with a few elongated summer/christmas stops. Yes; they're quite common in Spain. Mamma Mia ran for three years in Madrid, then moved to Barcelona where it ran for about 18 months. It's always the same production, they never have two companies of the same show running simultaneously.
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Post by SuttonPeron on Dec 29, 2020 12:20:45 GMT
You forgot to say that MM! then toured Spain for two years, until 2011, including a short stint in Madrid; and then came back in 2015, and toured again for 3 seasons. Spain isn’t really the best example though. Shows here are done exclusively because of profit. Producers no longer want to bring new shows except if they’re their own productions. That’s the reason Lion King has been running for so long. A touring production in a sit-down house, with a very cheap orchestra and prices that are extremely expensive for our country. People think it’s a Broadway replica and they pay, when literally the UK Tour is bigger.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 29, 2020 20:18:09 GMT
Thing is with Manchester it does have 3 theatres, however all the big shows end up in the Palace, the ones that can’t get the Palace end up in the Opera House. The Lowry seems to struggle to get shows. I would have thought Manchester scene would be much brisker, as it is our second biggest city. It is also very accessible from other cities such as Leeds, Sheffield and Liverpool. So no big deal to go for a night out in other cities. Where in London you are pretty much trapped in London and it is very hard to go to other cities.. Lol. Not really! If you think people in the North are doing that “for a night out” you are very much mistaken. Some are, yes. Most are not.
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 29, 2020 20:35:23 GMT
I agree some do and they’re all buying tickets? If a 100 - 200 come from outside Manchester, this is helpful production wise. I imagine something like Wicked at the Palace would attract a small percentage of an audience from nearby cities, because Manchester is very accessible transport wise, where for me who lives in London, on the Kent borders would take 70 minutes to get to London Euston.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 30, 2020 13:03:26 GMT
I agree some do and they’re all buying tickets? If a 100 - 200 come from outside Manchester, this is helpful production wise. I imagine something like Wicked at the Palace would attract a small percentage of an audience from nearby cities, because Manchester is very accessible transport wise, where for me who lives in London, on the Kent borders would take 70 minutes to get to London Euston. Manchester is not very accessible transport wise from Sheffield. The drive across the Woodhead Pass or the Snake Pass is single carriage all the way and hair raising even in good weather. It’s often closed at the slightest whiff of snow or ice in winter. To avoid it you have to go north on the M1 and across the M62 which is a huge detour. Train services aren't that great either. There’s been a huge public debate about this for years because as usual the North has suffered from underinvestment meaning that travel times between the major conurbations are much higher than comparable journeys in the South.The fastest train is 50 minutes and the worse case scenario is 90 minutes as TallPaul is well aware! Add your bus to either end of that and it’s all getting to look like a very long night out. The rail line is single track and plans to upgrade it and shave 10 minutes off the journey time were put back to 2023 but who knows what will happen with that now. For improvements to the services between Manchester and leeds we have to wait for HS3 which is probably decades away.
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Post by TallPaul on Dec 30, 2020 15:15:41 GMT
I'm a little surprised it took a full 16 hours, BurlyBeaR, but I just knew *that* 90 minutes would 'arrive' sooner or later. 🚃 I've been stood waiting in the cold on Platform 2. 🙂
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Post by Phantom of London on Dec 30, 2020 17:54:01 GMT
90 minute is an horrific journey, trains can also be overcrowded, I travelled last Christmas from Sheffield to Manchester on a late Saturday morning, Manchester United were playing at home and also the Xmas markets were on, the train was like sardines. I was standing and cramped, some people couldn’t get on. If I have time I enjoy taking the slow train between Manchester and Sheffield, and appreciate the beauty of the Peak District, but this isn’t ideal for theatre goers that want to get home in a hurry!
I cannot legislate for the quality of the train service, it takes me 40 minutes on a slow train to Charing Cross from where I live. Then if going to Paddington/Euston/Kings Cross have to allow half hour. But the fact is you can get fast trains between Manchester and Sheffield. Also I am no sure if Phantom, Wicked, The Lion King or Les Miserables played Sheffield as the theatre is too small. So you can either go to London and cannot get a train back after an evening performance and Pay for an hotel, or catch the show in Manchester, Leeds or Bradford.
I fully support improving train services, which includes improving the Sheffield to Manchester Line, HS2 and HS3.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 18:05:43 GMT
Don't discount the regions as well as the cities. I grew up in North Wales and would regularly travel with my family, an hour up the motorway, to Manchester to see a show. As did many others I grew up with. Manchester has a huge pull from west.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 30, 2020 18:39:31 GMT
Don't discount the regions as well as the cities. I grew up in North Wales and would regularly travel with my family, an hour up the motorway, to Manchester to see a show. As did many others I grew up with. Manchester has a huge pull from west. Same here we would travel from Hull to Manchester (barnum, Les Miz, Phantom and Me and my girl) . one day it was even to Birmingham for Joseph with with the wonderful Philip S. I also a wonderful trip to Sheffield City Hall for Victoria Wood.
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Post by danb on Dec 30, 2020 19:03:09 GMT
I grew up in Warrington & could get to and from Manchester or Liverpool for an evening show on the train. (and still could do last year).
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 30, 2020 19:39:51 GMT
I grew up in Warrington & could get to and from Manchester or Liverpool for an evening show on the train. (and still could do last year). I was responding to PoL’s comments about my home town Sheffield. Warrington benefits by not having a mountain range between it and Manc.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 20:15:14 GMT
I go to Manchester a lot (old uni City) for tours. Have previously looked into seeing a show in Liverpool on one night of a long weekend and getting train back to Manchester after - sadly not possible as no trains back after evening show. So connections certainly not as good as one might think/hope. That said, guess it's easier with a car. And certainly Manchester did have a big geographical pull for the surrounding counties of Cheshire and Lancashire.
And depending on how you define urban areas it has a good case for claiming to be England's 2nd city. So if there ever was to be an open ended run of something again, I think Manchester would be the best bet.
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Post by sph on Dec 30, 2020 21:54:14 GMT
Yes, Manchester has the benefit of being a large city which is also far enough away from London to attract Northern or even Scottish tourists who don't want to trek all the way down south for a show.
That being said, at the moment I still think the only show out there with a broad enough fanbase/appeal is Harry Potter. Others either have toured or will tour quite easily.
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Post by Figaro on Dec 30, 2020 21:56:17 GMT
Where did this Harry Potter rumour come from?!
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