68 posts
|
Post by lewis on Mar 26, 2018 16:02:32 GMT
Any casting news for this?
|
|
2,548 posts
|
Post by n1david on Mar 26, 2018 16:45:02 GMT
Haven't seen anything. I've now booked for this at the RSC as the changes at Stratford East make me wonder if it will ever reach "the other Stratford"...
|
|
2,548 posts
|
Post by n1david on Apr 13, 2018 8:41:48 GMT
|
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Apr 13, 2018 8:48:02 GMT
Haven't seen anything. I've now booked for this at the RSC as the changes at Stratford East make me wonder if it will ever reach "the other Stratford"... I have it on good authority that the new Artistic Director at Theatre Royal, Stratford East, does not like musicals and at the moment she has no plans for 'Miss Littlewood' to be performed at Stratford East. |
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Apr 15, 2018 11:57:00 GMT
I have now studied the RSC announcement about 'Miss Littlewood' in detail and I simply do not understand why the production involves colour-blind casting of one of the major characters. Joan’s partner and the love of her life, Gerry Raffles, who managed the Theatre Workshop Company and ran the Theatre Royal, Stratford East, is played by a black actor, Solomon Israel.
Gerry was the person who formally engaged me to play piano in the bar at the Theatre Royal and paid me my wages. He was a lovely, gentle man and he was white. Will this not give the impression to people seeing the show without checking the facts, that Gerry Raffles was black? We are not talking about a work of fiction, or a hip-hop/rap reimagining of American history from 1776. This I hope will be a realist portrayal of real events and real people very much within living memory. Gerry died in 1975 aged 53 and Joan died in 2002 aged 87.
If colour-blind casting is to be the norm, can we expect some of Caroline's children or members of the radio or the laundry appliances to be played by white actors when 'Caroline or Change' transfers to the West End later in the year? Surely it must work both ways or is it only to give more work to BAME performers playing white roles?
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2018 12:36:02 GMT
I have now studied the RSC announcement about 'Miss Littlewood' in detail and I simply do not understand why the production involves colour-blind casting of one of the major characters. Joan’s partner and the love of her life, Gerry Raffles, who managed the Theatre Workshop Company and ran the Theatre Royal, Stratford East, is played by a black actor, Solomon Israel. Gerry was the person who formally engaged me to play piano in the bar at the Theatre Royal and paid me my wages. He was a lovely, gentle man and he was white. Will this not give the impression to people seeing the show without checking the facts, that Gerry Raffles was black? We are not talking about a work of fiction, or a hip-hop/rap reimagining of American history from 1776. This I hope will be a realist portrayal of real events and real people very much within living memory. Gerry died in 1975 aged 53 and Joan died in 2002 aged 87. If colour-blind casting is to be the norm, can we expect some of Caroline's children or members of the radio or the laundry appliances to be played by white actors when 'Caroline or Change' transfers to the West End later in the year? Surely it must work both ways or is it only to give more work to BAME performers playing white roles? In Caroline or Change the story is all about race and in shows where race is the central theme like Ragtime,Hairspray ect i dont think colour blind casting works as it goes against what the story is telling. In this case i'm all up for it and would like to think audiences nowadays don't really mind what the actor looks like as long as they can give a convincing performance. I probably wont see this but if it came down to London i would definitely as it sounds very promising. |
|
2,706 posts
|
Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Apr 15, 2018 12:41:42 GMT
I have now studied the RSC announcement about 'Miss Littlewood' in detail and I simply do not understand why the production involves colour-blind casting of one of the major characters. Joan’s partner and the love of her life, Gerry Raffles, who managed the Theatre Workshop Company and ran the Theatre Royal, Stratford East, is played by a black actor, Solomon Israel. Gerry was the person who formally engaged me to play piano in the bar at the Theatre Royal and paid me my wages. He was a lovely, gentle man and he was white. Will this not give the impression to people seeing the show without checking the facts, that Gerry Raffles was black? We are not talking about a work of fiction, or a hip-hop/rap reimagining of American history from 1776. This I hope will be a realist portrayal of real events and real people very much within living memory. Gerry died in 1975 aged 53 and Joan died in 2002 aged 87. If colour-blind casting is to be the norm, can we expect some of Caroline's children or members of the radio or the laundry appliances to be played by white actors when 'Caroline or Change' transfers to the West End later in the year? Surely it must work both ways or is it only to give more work to BAME performers playing white roles? Maybe watching the production first would clarify. It reads as though they are telling the story of her life so, as storytellers, they take on the roles of the people they play. That wouldn’t be colour blind casting as they remain actors playing characters. In fact, as the cast list appears to have seven versions of Joan (but there was only one Joan, people cry), three of whom are black, I’d say that appears to be the case - modern day Britain looking back at her life. |
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Apr 15, 2018 13:05:33 GMT
Maybe watching the production first would clarify. It reads as though they are telling the story of her life so, as storytellers, they take on the roles of the people they play. That wouldn’t be colour blind casting as they remain actors playing characters. In fact, as the cast list appears to have seven versions of Joan (but there was only one Joan, people cry), three of whom are black, I’d say that appears to be the case - modern day Britain looking back at her life. That's an interesting way to look at it and I guess I should see the production first. It's just that the prospectus seems to be promising us the life story of Joan Littlewood and I personally would expect this to be done mainly in a realistic way, in which case both Joan and Gerry should be played by white performers. I can just about accept that several of the 'other' Joans are black although playing a white person, but if there is only one Gerry Raffles and he is played by a black actor, and the main Joan is played by a white actress, then no matter from what angle the production presents the story, will not most viewers assume Gerry Raffles was a black man, which of course he was not? OK. Let's wait and see the show first before I complain about it any further. |
|
2,706 posts
|
Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Apr 15, 2018 13:11:15 GMT
Maybe watching the production first would clarify. It reads as though they are telling the story of her life so, as storytellers, they take on the roles of the people they play. That wouldn’t be colour blind casting as they remain actors playing characters. In fact, as the cast list appears to have seven versions of Joan (but there was only one Joan, people cry), three of whom are black, I’d say that appears to be the case - modern day Britain looking back at her life. That's an interesting way to look at it and I guess I should see the production first. It's just that the prospectus seems to be promising us the life story of Joan Littlewood and I personally would expect this to be done mainly in a realistic way, in which case both Joan and Gerry should be played by white performers. I can just about accept that several of the 'other' Joans are black although playing a white person, but if there is only one Gerry Raffles and he is played by a black actor, and the main Joan is played by a white actress, then no matter from what angle the production presents the story, will not most viewers assume Gerry Raffles was a black man, which of course he was not? OK. Let's wait and see the show first before I complain about it any further. If the production is out and out realism then it may need further clarification, but it appears as though it isn’t (which is entirely in keeping with Littlewood’s work, unless World War One was actually fought by opposing pierrot troupes). |
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Apr 15, 2018 13:16:33 GMT
If the production is out and out realism then it may need further clarification, but it appears as though it isn’t (which is entirely in keeping with Littlewood’s work, unless World War One was actually fought by opposing pierrot troupes). Touché! |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2018 13:40:24 GMT
That's an interesting way to look at it and I guess I should see the production first. It's just that the prospectus seems to be promising us the life story of Joan Littlewood and I personally would expect this to be done mainly in a realistic way, in which case both Joan and Gerry should be played by white performers. I can just about accept that several of the 'other' Joans are black although playing a white person, but if there is only one Gerry Raffles and he is played by a black actor, and the main Joan is played by a white actress, then no matter from what angle the production presents the story, will not most viewers assume Gerry Raffles was a black man, which of course he was not? OK. Let's wait and see the show first before I complain about it any further. If the production is out and out realism then it may need further clarification, but it appears as though it isn’t (which is entirely in keeping with Littlewood’s work, unless World War One was actually fought by opposing pierrot troupes). The thing is, we all know that WWI wasn't fought by pierrots as we've all sat through our history lessons and watched the endless documentaries, so Joan's use of pierrots was making some kind of point. Presumably that the soldiers were all naively drawn into the war to end all wars, and treated like puppets. By presenting the life story of someone that relatively few have heard of, it could be misleading, allowing the audience to think that she fell in love with a black man at a time when it would have been frowned upon (as Shelagh Delaney- who features as a character in the piece- was to show in A Taste of Honey.) According to the RSC publicity, we are promised a "new musical of Joan Littlewood’s life story ... told with her own uncompromising candour and reveals a mighty love story at its heart." Candour? I wonder what point the RSC is making by casting a black man as Joan's love of her life...? No doubt it'll all become clear when we see it. If we see it. If it has a life beyond Stratford. Upon Avon. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 15, 2018 13:52:29 GMT
Why do I always manage to confuse Joan Littlewood with star of 'Girls on Top', Joan Greenwood?
|
|
2,706 posts
|
Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Apr 15, 2018 14:01:21 GMT
Putting the backs of the establishment up and ridiculing their expectations of theatre was par for the course.
The one thing that it does need is to reflect her absolute anger at the world as it was (is). A failure would be to miss her contempt for pretty much anything and a world view that was for confrontation with authority. If it’s a cosy story that doesn’t have its audience uncomfortable then it hasn’t hit the mark.
|
|
1,912 posts
|
Post by sf on Apr 15, 2018 14:17:22 GMT
If colour-blind casting is to be the norm, can we expect some of Caroline's children or members of the radio or the laundry appliances to be played by white actors when 'Caroline or Change' transfers to the West End later in the year? Surely it must work both ways or is it only to give more work to BAME performers playing white roles? Oh, for God's sake. |
|
14 posts
|
Post by george123 on Apr 15, 2018 15:23:59 GMT
In New York I recently saw Balls a play about Billy Jean King. The cast had her husband and girl friend played by people of color. Two ladies sitting behind me commented they never knew Billy Jean was married to a black man and had a black girlfriend.
|
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Apr 15, 2018 18:12:15 GMT
Precisely! That's what I said when I heard Gerry Raffles was to be played in 'Miss Littlewood' by a black actor |
|
2,452 posts
|
Post by theatremadness on Apr 15, 2018 18:44:53 GMT
Precisely! That's what I said when I heard Gerry Raffles was to be played in 'Miss Littlewood' by a black actor Oh, Tony. Not the best sentence I've seen from you on this board. What with this and Strictly Ballroom, your seeming aversion to black actors on stage is rather worrying, as is your apparent inability to look past the colour of someone's skin in a musical, of all mediums, for the sake of that absolutely pathetic excuse "historical accuracy". I'm sorry but that just does not cut it. You are *that* worried that someone may think Gerry Raffles was black, you're actively trying to deny POC representation in theatre where the role does *not* demand that the actor *has* to be black. And above all you seem proud to be doing it, too! There very well may be pictures of Gerry in the programme, and if audiences find themselves *so* confused by a black actor's presence, well they can look it up on the internet. And for someone who has always come across with theatre at their very heart, your staggering lack of inclusivity is rather alarming. Theatre is NOT a documentary it's a place of make-believe (yes, even with real stories!) where actors take on multiple personalities to tell stories. I am SO surprised that you are completely blind to seeing this. |
|
1,912 posts
|
Post by sf on Apr 15, 2018 18:55:09 GMT
Precisely! That's what I said when I heard Gerry Raffles was to be played in 'Miss Littlewood' by a black actor And it didn't occur to you that there might be some specific reason why this production, which none of us have yet seen, has made what appears to be some very deliberate casting decisions? As for your question about whether nontraditional casting is " only to give more work to BAME performers playing white roles" - well... oh, for God's sake. It's 2018. Evolve. White performers already have access to a vastly greater range of opportunities in this country than performers from any visible minority. Seeking a diverse cast to do a classic is not about "affirmative action", or about giving jobs to people solely because of the colour of their skin. It's simply about ensuring everybody gets into the room to show what they can do. It is not - at all - the same thing, either, as casting white performers in black roles in a piece that is specifically about civil rights in the early-1960s American South. It is also, I suspect, not what is going on in 'Miss Littlewood': the fact that, aside from Clare Burt, six performers, half of whom are not white, have been hired to play (presumably) different facets of Joan Littlewood suggests that there is some specific idea behind the casting in those roles. If that's a problem to you, given that none of us, as I said, have yet seen the show, I'm afraid that simply tells us something about you. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2018 22:53:28 GMT
Here's a small taster of one of songs "A Little Bit of Business". It sounds quite good!
|
|
|
|
Post by cartoonman on Jun 17, 2018 10:19:14 GMT
Haven't seen anything. I've now booked for this at the RSC as the changes at Stratford East make me wonder if it will ever reach "the other Stratford"... I have it on good authority that the new Artistic Director at Theatre Royal, Stratford East, does not like musicals and at the moment she has no plans for 'Miss Littlewood' to be performed at Stratford East. You are right I E-MAILED TRSE and they said its not coming there. |
|
|
|
Post by learfan on Jun 17, 2018 18:32:19 GMT
Not sure why anyone thought it would go to Stratford East. Spesh when it was obvious it wasn't a co production.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2018 19:04:35 GMT
^ But not just “anyone”, learfan ... several posters on here, including our very own tonyloco , who worked extensively at Theatre Royal Stratford East, and who actually knew Joan Littlewood, wondered if it might transfer for a short run, because... from 1953 it was the home of the Theatre Workshop Company, famously associated with Joan Littlewood! Not such a random idea after all...  |
|
|
|
Post by learfan on Jun 17, 2018 20:14:45 GMT
^ But not just “anyone”, learfan ... several posters on here, including our very own tonyloco , who worked extensively at Theatre Royal Stratford East, and who actually knew Joan Littlewood, wondered if it might transfer for a short run, because... from 1953 it was the home of the Theatre Workshop Company, famously associated with Joan Littlewood! Not such a random idea after all... Haha! Like i say though when it was first announced as an RSC only production and not a co-production with SE, you could tell. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2018 20:37:23 GMT
^ But not just “anyone”, learfan ... several posters on here, including our very own tonyloco , who worked extensively at Theatre Royal Stratford East, and who actually knew Joan Littlewood, wondered if it might transfer for a short run, because... from 1953 it was the home of the Theatre Workshop Company, famously associated with Joan Littlewood! Not such a random idea after all... Haha! Like i say though when it was first announced as an RSC only production and not a co-production with SE, you could tell. Actually the marketing and press did say "Developed in collaboration with Theatre Royal Stratford East" ... (although it isn't on the website anymore, it does in the season brochure including the TRSE logo in the corner!) |
|
499 posts
Member is Online
|
Post by QueerTheatre on Jun 17, 2018 20:45:49 GMT
booked to see this in stratford in a few weeks.... not totally convince by the tracks on the website, but hopefully they'll feel better when fully orchestrated etc.
|
|
2,548 posts
|
Post by n1david on Jun 17, 2018 20:52:10 GMT
Haha! Like i say though when it was first announced as an RSC only production and not a co-production with SE, you could tell. Actually the marketing and press did say "Developed in collaboration with Theatre Royal Stratford East" ... (although it isn't on the website anymore, it does in the season brochure including the TRSE logo in the corner!) And still visible in the press release: www.rsc.org.uk/press/releases/rsc-announces-2018-summer-season |
|
1,089 posts
|
Post by tonyloco on Jun 17, 2018 22:43:58 GMT
^ But not just “anyone”, learfan ... several posters on here, including our very own tonyloco , who worked extensively at Theatre Royal Stratford East, and who actually knew Joan Littlewood, wondered if it might transfer for a short run, because... from 1953 it was the home of the Theatre Workshop Company, famously associated with Joan Littlewood! Not such a random idea after all... Just to set the record straight from my point of view, I confirm what Caiaphas has said. I first heard about "Miss Littlewood" from my contacts at the Theatre Royal, Stratford East, at an early stage while it was definitely still being developed by the RSC in co-operation with TRSE and the intention was that it would definitely transfer from the Swan Theatre for a run at Stratford East. When the new Director, Nadia Fall, was appointed at the Theatre Royal to replace Kerry Michael, she made it clear that musicals would not be part of her agenda and I understand that she actually cancelled the existing arrangement with the RSC that "Miss Littlewood" would transfer to the Theatre Royal. This however is hearsay on my part, but the fact that the show is now officially not coming to Stratford East – the place where the most important part of the story actually took place – seems to bear this out. |
|
541 posts
|
Post by jek on Jun 18, 2018 6:53:05 GMT
Disappointed to hear that this isn't coming to TRSE. I would certainly have walked around the corner to see it. However, I do wonder if Nadia Fall is, understandably, eager to establish some clear blue water between herself and the previous regime at the theatre. And given the financial problems which the theatre has clearly found itself in, is that perhaps a consideration? I can't imagine the theatre opting out of anything that might encourage some footfall to their doors. I wonder how successful booking for the new season is? I didn't get round to seeing the most recent production there (Cafe Society Swing) but there were still plenty of seats available when I was looking at buying tickets there last week. I would love TRSE to do well so am keeping fingers crossed that it will.
|
|
4,608 posts
|
Post by Someone in a tree on Jun 18, 2018 7:23:01 GMT
Miss Littlewood is one of the few things I would be interested in seeing in the East London venue. Seems crazy to me to turn down a co with the RSC especially when you consider what the production is about
- does the AD really hate musicals that much?
I’m planning on seeing Noye Fludd next July. Hopefully biblical operas set in Norfolk will still tick the bounds of respectably
|
|
308 posts
Member is Online
|
Post by Boob on Jun 18, 2018 8:05:28 GMT
What a narrow-minded view, if true. An AD is there to serve their audiences and their community, esp in the case of TRSE, not their personal tastes. Although, one could argue this musical isn’t necessarily the right thing for them now, in spite of its relevance to the venue and its history.
|
|
