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Post by musicalmarge on Dec 9, 2017 20:32:15 GMT
Because that's the benchmark that Disney has set; The Lion King, Beauty & The Beast, AIDA, Aladdin. And that's the way they're going with Frozen. Basically recreating the cartoon image on stage so given this, it's not unrealistic to expect something of a similar nature. But those are big West end and Broadway shows, this is being done at the national for a limited run and isn't being marketed as 'Disney's Pinocchio'. Also those movies were big lavish fairytales. Pinocchio has always had a different feel and is a different type of story so sorry yes I think it is unrealistic to just assume all Disney shows are the same. Newsies, jungle book, hunchback, Peter and starcatchers...none were big or lavish. Newsies was very lavish actually! A big huge dance musical on Broadway. I saw it!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 20:39:06 GMT
I've seen it too...i wouldn't class it as lavish in terms of physical production in the same.way other Disney Broadway shows have been
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Post by musicalmarge on Dec 9, 2017 20:50:33 GMT
I've seen it too...i wouldn't class it as lavish in terms of physical production in the same.way other Disney Broadway shows have been I must have dreamt the various rotating split level metal towers that depicted Manhattan then. My fault!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 21:01:42 GMT
Each to their own, I wouldn't call that lavish. To me its a clever, but simple design as it was never planned to be the hit it was so it didn't have the investment the likes of batb, Aladdin, lion king etc had.
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Post by Dr Tom on Dec 9, 2017 21:54:13 GMT
I must say, I am really enjoying it. Its got a certain charm to it that I really like, and the lead is fantastic. It should be said though, the person wthere is no songs until an hour in, complete overreaction. The show began just after 7 and the interval just started. Hi Diddle Dee Dee comes about two thirds in and it is pretty much consistantly songs fro, the movie from then until the end of Act 1, and there is a song called Little Wooden Head sung by whatshisname, the puppet maker, at the start of the show, and the Fairy also gets a brief number. There is also music throughout. So its not like it is just a play with one or two songs. Not a full out musical either. Its a weird one. But I'm really enjoying it! Glad you're enjoying it. Hi Diddle Dee Dee was the one about an hour in. I don't remember any full songs earlier though, just a couple of lines from longer songs here and there. They are changing this every day though, so they might have expanded the earlier songs from when I saw it earlier in the week (which would be a good thing).
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Post by tmesis on Dec 9, 2017 22:04:00 GMT
I enjoyed it but wasn't blown away. I have an aversion to productions with a lot of puppetry anyway but, obviously this time it was pretty apt. I felt act one zipped along but act two dragged, particularly the pleasureland bit (there was some quite naff acting in this bit too.) As others have said the end was quite affecting but the concluding arrangement for 'When you wish upon a Star' was horrible and robbed the song of its effectiveness. In fact most of the re-orchestrations were poor. On the whole a very effective production but the step-ladders because tiresome (a bit Sally Cookson in that respect but with more dosh thrown at it.)
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 22:12:04 GMT
I really enjoyed this. I actually thought the staging and music were actually beautiful, and quite haunting in my opinion. I loved the use of the snow and the lighting. I found the final scene actually quite moving and emotional, and I think the music and staging had a large part to play in that. Also loved the use of the blue flame and appearances of the fairy. The lead Joe as Pinocchio was fantastic, and great to see Dawn as Lampy following her performance in Our Ladies! Annette was another standout as the Blue Fairy, a beautiful performance. Could of used a tad more glitter haha. I guessed how the Monstro scene would be done, so it was a tad underwhelming for me, but staged very well. It was just alot of fun! Id love to catch it again later in the run to see it improve as it goes on.
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Post by jake1345 on Dec 9, 2017 22:42:04 GMT
Just back from this. I feel this is somewhat a jumbled mess, that has some shining moments! The magic is done very well, but is quite reminiscent in places of the Cursed Child. I feel the biggest flaw currently, is the use of puppets for the "real" characters. Whilst this could work the puppets whilst huge and dominating, are so expressionless if their mouths dont move, or their eyes, or anything!! We were essentially listening at points to the story whilst watching bits of wood not really doing very much! Jiminy was the only real stand out puppetry work for me. Loved the blue flames, and the whale was impressive and quite scary from row c, although the inside of the whale was underwhelming. I have to disagree and say that Pleasure Island was one of the stand out pieces of the show for me, and the humour and darkness in this scene were done brilliantly! This may be down to my dislike of being around children, and this scene encouraging them to basically harm themselves (it works in context and isnt as horrifying as i have made it sound). I really didnt like Joe as Pinocchio, found him very panto, and no real dark and shade in the performance for me, just one tone the whole way through. It kept my attention, and I wasn't bored, but can't say I was excited coming out, indifferent springs to mind.
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Post by jake1345 on Dec 9, 2017 22:43:35 GMT
Forgot to add, that by the fox only explaining why he was so horrid to Pinocchio until the very end meant we also couldnt really understand why he was doing this and made his actions seem random.
I did enjoy the costume however, especially the moving tail!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 23:34:50 GMT
I got the point of Geppetto, Stromboli and the Driver being a puppet, didn't understand at all why the Blue Fairy was, even for the one scene. Especially as she appears to Geppetto later in human form anyway. That part made no sense to me.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2017 23:35:58 GMT
Just back from this. I feel this is somewhat a jumbled mess, that has some shining moments! The magic is done very well, but is quite reminiscent in places of the Cursed Child. I feel the biggest flaw currently, is the use of puppets for the "real" characters. Whilst this could work the puppets whilst huge and dominating, are so expressionless if their mouths dont move, or their eyes, or anything!! We were essentially listening at points to the story whilst watching bits of wood not really doing very much! Jiminy was the only real stand out puppetry work for me. Loved the blue flames, and the whale was impressive and quite scary from row c, although the inside of the whale was underwhelming. I have to disagree and say that Pleasure Island was one of the stand out pieces of the show for me, and the humour and darkness in this scene were done brilliantly! This may be down to my dislike of being around children, and this scene encouraging them to basically harm themselves (it works in context and isnt as horrifying as i have made it sound). I really didnt like Joe as Pinocchio, found him very panto, and no real dark and shade in the performance for me, just one tone the whole way through. It kept my attention, and I wasn't bored, but can't say I was excited coming out, indifferent springs to mind. Oooo I was Row B! I admit it was quite daunting, the Monstro scene!
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Post by Dr Tom on Dec 10, 2017 0:33:45 GMT
I got the point of Geppetto, Stromboli and the Driver being a puppet, didn't understand at all why the Blue Fairy was, even for the one scene. Especially as she appears to Geppetto later in human form anyway. That part made no sense to me. Wasn't the Blue Fairy the same person who (in human form) gave the magic wood to Geppetto in the opening, which was then carved to form Pinocchio? I must admit, it's years since I've seen the film version which this is loosely based on (I will compare this to the Disney film, as the original novel is different again), so I may be muddling up the characters. To me, the idea of the role reversal, that most of the characters are puppets, but Pinocchio is not, is one of the strongest parts of the production.
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Post by Jon on Dec 10, 2017 0:42:22 GMT
I saw it on Friday and quite liked it but I wonder if human sized puppets for Geppetto, Stromboli and The Coachman would be better rather than the giant puppets they have? I sort of get the giant puppets for Stromboli and The Coachman but it didn't quite work for Geppetto. The ending is very poignant, the idea that pain is what makes us human worked really well, I don't think that was in either the film or the novel but i could be wrong
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Post by dippy on Dec 10, 2017 0:53:00 GMT
I saw it on Friday and quite liked it but I wonder if human sized puppets for Geppetto, Stromboli and The Coachman would be better rather than the giant puppets they have? I sort of get the giant puppets for Stromboli and The Coachman but it didn't quite work for Geppetto. A human sized Geppetto wouldn't make sense though, he's got to be bigger than Pinocchio until then end. I thought the puppets were nicely made but as others have said the fact that their faces don't move at all didn't help me want to watch them. I remember how much the puppets and humans in Avenue Q became one but in this I gave up watching the giant puppet's because I wasn't involved in watching them. However I thought Jiminy was amazing and loved the puppet. I don't see why people found the big blue fairy puppet at the start odd. It makes sense because she's showing herself to Geppetto as a woman so she'd be a similar size to him. Obviously we see her smaller later and in non human form and then at the end she's the same size as Geppetto again.
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Post by Jon on Dec 10, 2017 1:03:57 GMT
I saw it on Friday and quite liked it but I wonder if human sized puppets for Geppetto, Stromboli and The Coachman would be better rather than the giant puppets they have? I sort of get the giant puppets for Stromboli and The Coachman but it didn't quite work for Geppetto. A human sized Geppetto wouldn't make sense though, he's got to be bigger than Pinocchio until then end. I thought the puppets were nicely made but as others have said the fact that their faces don't move at all didn't help me want to watch them. I remember how much the puppets and humans in Avenue Q became one but in this I gave up watching the giant puppet's because I wasn't involved in watching them. However I thought Jiminy was amazing and loved the puppet. I remember Handspring had human sized puppets for Titania and Oberon with in their co-production of A Midsummer's Night Dream and they were worked really well and I think that could have worked for Geppetto.
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Post by dippy on Dec 10, 2017 4:31:01 GMT
I remember Handspring had human sized puppets for Titania and Oberon with in their co-production of A Midsummer's Night Dream and they were worked really well and I think that could have worked for Geppetto. I'm not saying human sized puppets can't work, I'm sure they work well but if Geppetto was human sized it wouldn't work for Pinocchio being adult sized, he'd have to be child sized (or a child sized puppet) along with all the other children and Jiminy would have to be even smaller. As it is children are adult sized, Jiminy is knee high sized and adults are bigger than humans.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 9:46:12 GMT
I was also there last night and I really loved everything about it. The show for me was just so magical and entertaining. I height everyone I'm the cast was good and especially liked Audrey Brisson as well as Joe Idris-Roberts. I also liked the use of the puppetry and did not feel the giant puppets were odd and just liked all the quite scary elements esspecilay the masked children. The stage effects were also very nice and even though I could see how some of them were done they wee still quite impressive. the music was also really good but I still don't know wether to class it as a musical or play with music. Nothing obvious went wrong last night expect for a scene on the cliff were a coconut was meant to appease but that did get one of the biggest laughs. The end was also very moving and I just really loved everything in the show and for me I don't think much to anything needs changing.
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Post by Boob on Dec 10, 2017 11:16:11 GMT
Forgot to add, that by the fox only explaining why he was so horrid to Pinocchio until the very end meant we also couldnt really understand why he was doing this and made his actions seem random. I did enjoy the costume however, especially the moving tail! And his motivation for doing it doesn't make any sense!
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Post by dlevi on Dec 12, 2017 23:55:51 GMT
I saw this tonight and was completely baffled by what was on stage. It's charmless, joyless and witless. Yes there are a few lovely visuals but seriously, what were supposed to take away from this? That pain makes us human? Merry Christmas kids! The performances while sincere, failed to create any sympathy for any of the characters. Now I haven't seen the film since I was very very young a long time ago, and it wasn't one I remember liking, but it couldn't have been as dull as this ( it was only 88 minutes long and this ( not counting the interval) is a little over two hours. The sheer lack of musical numbers also made the show seem off-kilter. And I know the National has its budget troubles but seriously the black spare stage doesn't look great, it looks as if we're waiting for the set arrive. Bleah.
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Post by paplazaroo on Dec 13, 2017 9:08:15 GMT
Oh dear, this isn’t great. The Tiffany team’s box of tricks that somehow worked for Let The Right One In, Glass Menagerie and even Harry Potter - namely the black backdrop, snow, folksy music and jerky movements just make this show look sparse and dull.
The puppets all seemed a bit grotesque and naff, like something a community centre would throw together for a fish quay Festival. They also set a bunch of rules within the production that they then break, like everyone is a puppet except Pinocchio. Except the kids who are wearing puppetish masks, except when they’re not in act 2.
Overall just a bit under developed in my opionion. Puppetry is alright but Audrey Brisson is so beautiful that I couldn’t take my eyes off her and barely saw Jiminy.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 13, 2017 9:49:36 GMT
This show could really do with an opening number to set the scene. Also more songs are needed to be peppered throughout. Why doesn’t Pinocchio have a solo? Currently, each act could do with 10 minutes of dialogue trimmed.
In Johnathan Dove’s opera we see Pinocchio’s journey but also Gepeto’s anguish and despair, the tension mounts in a wonderful Peter Grimes pastiche complete with mad fisherman and wale-act 1 finale. We then don’t get to the wale till 11 o’clock spot but the tension has mounted fantastically. The opera is too episodic and feels longer than it is. Thankfully the NT production has a ‘good’ number of scenes.
Despite my negativity and thoughts of what we could of had, I throughly enjoyed it and cried at the end. The effects are really magical and I thought the actors playing Pin and Cricket were really brilliant.
Loved the scale the design brought and how this was carried out into the puppets but please less dialogue and more songs.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 13, 2017 9:51:11 GMT
Oh dear, this isn’t great. The Tiffany team’s box of tricks that somehow worked for Let The Right One In, Glass Menagerie and even Harry Potter - namely the black backdrop, snow, folksy music and jerky movements just make this show look sparse and dull. The puppets all seemed a bit grotesque and naff, like something a community centre would throw together for a fish quay Festival. They also set a bunch of rules within the production that they then break, like everyone is a puppet except Pinocchio. Except the kids who are wearing puppetish masks, except when they’re not in act 2. Overall just a bit under developed in my opionion. Puppetry is alright but Audrey Brisson is so beautiful that I couldn’t take my eyes off her and barely saw Jiminy. Totally agree on the occasional puppet masks for the kids
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2017 10:03:07 GMT
The only sequence I didn't unfpderstand at all was when there was four triangle ladders that were slid around the stage by Ensemble with Pinocchio and Jiminy on. There was no real context as to what it was supposed to represent, or at least I didn't gage it. It was a nice song and looked good, but I just didn't get the reasoning for it.
Ooo and there was another part where six random ladders appeared at the back. Never used. I thought it was to represent trees, but to make that clearer, just bring the tree from the start back. That looked odd.
But other than those, I really enjoyed it haha.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Dec 13, 2017 10:32:43 GMT
Yes. The random ladders - emergency set?! Director too scared to have an empty stage
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Post by mrbarnaby on Dec 13, 2017 14:07:02 GMT
Really worried about this now. Was so looking forward to it.
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Post by viserys on Dec 13, 2017 14:29:04 GMT
Same here. Am considering tearing up my £15 front row ticket and go and see Woman in White after all.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2017 14:34:58 GMT
I'm dissapointed that some are considering not bothering to go or are dreading to go to what I found a charming and enjoyable evening, just go and see for yourself. Some have enjoyed it, some haven't, you never know.
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Post by profquatermass on Dec 13, 2017 15:22:42 GMT
Same here. Am considering tearing up my £15 front row ticket and go and see Woman in White after all. This is why I never collect NT tickets in advance. It's very easy to return them online if you fear a turkey
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2017 15:23:05 GMT
I might be being biased but I don't really get why everyone is dislike it this show so much . We are all allowed different opinions but when I saw it I really loved it but I think it depends on your expectations as I was not really expecting anything and maybe just letting your inner child out whilst watching it. I really enjoyed it a lot and would recommend it,
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Post by viserys on Dec 13, 2017 15:34:45 GMT
Same here. Am considering tearing up my £15 front row ticket and go and see Woman in White after all. This is why I never collect NT tickets in advance. It's very easy to return them online if you fear a turkey Ironically this is the first time ever I collected a NT ticket in advance as I had paid this with my mother's credit card after something went wrong with mine and I wasn't sure if they would give me the ticket without the right credit card. So when I went to see Follies and picked up that ticket, I decided to ask for the Pinocchio ticket as well and see if there would be trouble (there wasn't). I had planned another quick London trip in late January primarily for Woman in White as I wanted to give the show another chance after the deadly dull original. But then so many new shows were announced - Pinocchio, the Grinning Man and Jamie - that I rather want to see these fresh productions (and support new original work). However, now people here write mainly good things about WiW whereas Pinocchio (which a few pages earlier in this thread was praised as the best new thing since sliced bread) is getting fairly negative comments.
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