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Post by BurlyBeaR on May 7, 2021 18:34:54 GMT
Let’s keep a semblance of fairness here shall we?
Just as a recent example the SNP’s Alex Salmond went to court with 13 accusations of sexual assault charges against him. He was found not guilty on twelve and unproven on one.
Unexpected things happen!
So far these are allegations against Noel Clarke. Please post your comments with that in mind.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on May 7, 2021 18:41:19 GMT
And just to add I have no axe to grind either way. I don’t even know who NC is. I do know he is denying it though so we need to keep that in mind.
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Post by adolphus on May 7, 2021 21:51:28 GMT
Like shops, offices and factories, tv and film sets are workspaces and I'm frankly astonished anyone who repeatedly exposed his penis to his colleagues was allowed to continue working in those spaces, no matter how he and others justified and laughed the behaviour off.
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Post by zahidf on May 7, 2021 22:23:50 GMT
Let’s keep a semblance of fairness here shall we? Just as a recent example the SNP’s Alex Salmond went to court with 13 accusations of sexual assault charges against him. He was found not guilty on twelve and unproven on one. Unexpected things happen! So far these are allegations against Noel Clarke. Please post your comments with that in mind. Legally and practicality are two different things I think salmond and clarke are two peas in a pod. |
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Post by jojo on May 8, 2021 9:54:57 GMT
I can understand why they took the actions they did. They wanted to preserve their relationship with a high profile industry professional. I can imagine they thought that he wasn't a trained educator and didn't appreciate the different boundaries that have to exist between teacher and student. They took steps to make sure he was never left alone with students again. With hindsight, that now looks an inadequate response. But at the time, it probably felt to them that it was proportionate based on the information they had. And they were dealing with a powerful individual who could help their students in the industry. Yes, they should have asked more questions to find out more about his activities with students. But even a few years ago, the atmosphere was different to how it is today. This sort of behaviour should never have been tolerated. We all get that now. But it has taken time to get there. I have sympathy with organisations trying to work out how best to deal with these things, especially if someone high profile is involved. But one thing we should be learning by now is that there are often patterns of behaviour and it's those patterns, rather than a one off incident, that tells the story. Establishing that pattern isn't easy, which is what these habitual predators rely on. It is important for organisations and society in general to be clear that certain behaviour is a problem, because people are less comfortable saying no to or calling out the rich, famous and powerful, so they need protected and the rich, famous and powerful need to understand. However, that excuse only goes so far. Some behaviour is outright pervy and they know it. |
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Post by talkingheads on May 22, 2021 6:48:34 GMT
Bulletproof has been cancelled. I'm not surprised, Clarke's name is so intrinsically interwoven with the show. All I can say is I feel sorry for all the other cast members and production team losing out on so much work: www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-57198187.amp |
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Post by kathryn on May 22, 2021 13:51:03 GMT
Like shops, offices and factories, tv and film sets are workspaces and I'm frankly astonished anyone who repeatedly exposed his penis to his colleagues was allowed to continue working in those spaces, no matter how he and others justified and laughed the behaviour off. Sometimes tv and film sets require actors to be nude, and for their colleagues to be present. There was an early episode of Doctor Who where Barrowman’s character was required to be naked. It can make for fuzzy boundaries, which can be exploited by those with a mind to do so. Fairly obviously Barrowman is an exhibitionist, equally obviously the direct feedback his antics were getting from cast mates and crew in the moment was laughter and enjoyment. It’s so hard to speak up and say that you are uncomfortable in a room full of people laughing, because it makes you the killjoy. That produces a culture that perpetuates the fuzzy boundaries around appropriate behaviour. However, I don’t think the same can be said of the NC allegations. He can’t have been under the impression that his behaviour was enjoyed or welcomed given that people refused to work with him after and directly told him to stop. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Mar 28, 2022 11:59:55 GMT
I see the Met has declined to open a police investigation into Clarke because of a lack of evidence.
Isn't that just perplexing?
The best way to gather evidence into a set of allegations of wrongdoing over 15 years is to carry out an investigation.
I appreciate that police funds are not infinite and I know how difficult it is to gather evidence for this sort of crime. But Met owe the victims of Clarke's behaviour more that this half hearted response
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Post by talkingheads on Mar 28, 2022 12:09:49 GMT
"We can't press charges without evidence, but we also aren't opening an investigation to gather evidence that could lead to a prosecution'. We truly are living through 1984. Is twenty women coming forward not enough? How many do they need? Thirty? Fifty? Clarke's career is done anyway so that's something. We now have a day when two powerful actors got away with crimes.
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Post by frappuccino on Mar 29, 2022 10:19:11 GMT
"We can't press charges without evidence, but we also aren't opening an investigation to gather evidence that could lead to a prosecution'. We truly are living through 1984. Is twenty women coming forward not enough? How many do they need? Thirty? Fifty? Clarke's career is done anyway so that's something. We now have a day when two powerful actors got away with crimes. "Can't get evidence without an investigation!" *taps nose* |
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 29, 2022 20:22:43 GMT
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Post by sweets7 on May 29, 2022 22:06:01 GMT
These cases are notoriously difficult to prosecute. Because ultimately, in law, he said. She said. Law is far from a perfect beast and also far from being able to actually prosecute many crimes and of those I would say crimes of a sexual or predatory nature are the toughest.
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 29, 2022 22:51:23 GMT
There is no denying the difficulty in prosecuting this sort of crime
But there have been 20 complaints over an extended period. And here we have the alleged perpetrator trying to excuse his actions and being given the platform of major media platforms to try to justify himself.
The women affected by his alleged behaviour have got no voice in this. They have been let down by so many of the authorities.
Clarke may not have been prosecuted. But I have no interest in his attempt at rehabilitation whilst 20 complaints go unresolved.
Enough is enough.
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Post by talkingheads on May 30, 2022 6:18:01 GMT
It's very telling that all of his comments are along the lines of "If my behaviour was wrong, then I apologise". It's the classic politician's "I'm sorry if you feel this way". Not an ounce of actual regret, he's only sorry it's affected him.
I say this as somebody who used to be one of his biggest fans - I will never support his work again. Nobody is owed a living in the arts. There are millions of other jobs he can do, from the sounds of it, he needs to get off his arse and find one.
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Post by cavocado on May 30, 2022 9:51:29 GMT
Classic "what's the matter love, can't take a joke?" reaction, and claiming he's the real victim of 'modern McCarthyism'. Might have been better to use his time out of work to learn about consent and get his head around the idea that we should all be able to go to work without experiencing even low level sexual harrassment, bullying and abuse, not just criminal behaviour.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2022 14:26:11 GMT
Thing is if it had been one or two women then maybe I could believe him. But is he saying 20 women have colluded and lied?! Come on! Plus let's not forget people in the industry have come out and supported these women's claims so it was clearly an open secret within the industry.
Regarding the investigation, inappropriate behaviour is not necessarily illegal so it could well be what he did was found not to have broken any laws and/or been impossible to prove.
If he was so innocent why did he apologise at the time, and I assume he would be happy for another man to do the same to his wife or daughter as it was so harmless.
I used to follow him on social media and he often came across as arrogant with a chip on his shoulder which also helps me believe these claims are true. These articles further back up his arrogance.
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Post by Jon on May 30, 2022 17:38:06 GMT
Thing is if it had been one or two women then maybe I could believe him. But is he saying 20 women have colluded and lied?! Come on! Plus let's not forget people in the industry have come out and supported these women's claims so it was clearly an open secret within the industry. Regarding the investigation, inappropriate behaviour is not necessarily illegal so it could well be what he did was found not to have broken any laws and/or been impossible to prove. If he was so innocent why did he apologise at the time, and I assume he would be happy for another man to do the same to his wife or daughter as it was so harmless. I used to follow him on social media and he often came across as arrogant with a chip on his shoulder which also helps me believe these claims are true. These articles further back up his arrogance. I can't imagine he'll ever work in the industry again either way, he burnt too many bridges. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on May 30, 2022 20:30:27 GMT
Regardless of the circumstances he has not been charged or found guilty of anything. Please post with that in mind. Thank you.
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