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Post by smithfield on Jun 23, 2024 1:02:10 GMT
Since around 2020, there has been a huge disruption in the drama schools. Most of the staff left LAMDA in 2020/2021; may of the most respected teachers, including Patsy Rodenburg, have resigned from Guildhall and from BOVTS; a number of the same at RADA. This has been owing to the schools' efforts to update and 'de-colonize' the curriculum, etc. The teachers see a decline in craft training. I don't want to start a political debate (the reasons for the disruption need not necessarily concern us), but I am curious to know if any of you have noticed a decline in the abilities and training of recent drama school graduates on the stage.
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Post by max on Jun 23, 2024 7:33:37 GMT
It's a sweeping statement to cite 'de-colonizing of the curriculum' as the definite reason for specific staff (one named, others implied) leaving their institutions (also named). What's factual is that some staff have left drama schools you haven't named due to: failure to tackle abuse allegations from students (allegations of a racial, sexual, or body-discrimination nature).
I think it's fair to ask if there's a trade-off between decolonizing the curriculum and time spent on craft training, but if you don't want to start a political debate this thread will be very short.
There shouldn't need to be any reduction of craft training simply because schools change the texts or performance modes to be more widely inclusive of the world around us.
Intake is another matter. If you're widening the intake of drama students to be less focused on the child who did Guildhall or Lamda exams from the age of 7 and has some elocution lessons under their belt, then 'craft training' time may well be spent levelling up today's diverse intake on use of voice, diction (clarity in any accent), and textual interpretation. I can see that for some longstanding teaching staff they may feel that students aren't going to rise as high as they've been used to producing over decades - due to what may feel like 'catch-up' teaching at the start. For others, the definition of 'rising as high' may be outdated, and like comparing apples with oranges. For everyone's comfort a turnover of staff is a good thing in these circumstances - invite them back as specialist visitors when the students if/when the students are as they've been used to encountering them (in attainment level). It's not about things 'getting worse' necessarily, just about them 'getting different'; like the world has been getting different for a long time without drama training noticing (or wanting to notice).
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Post by smithfield on Jun 28, 2024 5:29:06 GMT
Interesting--thanks! What are the schools where staff resigned owing to sexual and racial abuse allegations?
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Post by ceebee on Jun 28, 2024 5:49:03 GMT
It comes back to quality and standards. Some schools have excellent reputations and standards, others don't. Certainly when I was studying at drama school 25 years ago, some practices were dubious, there was obvious institutional bias, passive racism, and big question marks over the capability and quality of some of the teaching staff. These in turn were led by "old school" leaders, placed in role either through longevity or nepotism, desperately clinging on to their little gravy train and fiefdom by their finger nails. When malpractice was cited and raised, it was brushed under the carpet. Many students were fearful of speaking out because of the intense competition to get in, as well as the fee caveats which effectively rendered funds paid unrefundable in the event of conflict, dissatisfaction or dispute.
I have little reason to believe that things have changed that much, though my particular school didn't know what to do when we mobilised ourselves to take internal action and drive change against the flaccid leadership, many of whom ruled by stealth and bullying. It's amazing what a few energised students can achieve when they know things are rotten to the core and need to change.
To answer the question, the turmoil seems to be perpetual and I believe there is a knock-on effect in the quality of teaching (and therefore the calibre of graduates). That said, most young actors I see on stage in musicals or play seem to be exceptionally talented, so I have faith that the cream will always rise to the top, regardless of the mediocrity that surrounds them during training (staff and students).
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 28, 2024 6:21:28 GMT
Interesting--thanks! What are the schools where staff resigned owing to sexual and racial abuse allegations? No, can we not get into naming schools or individuals please.
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Post by Jane Parfitt on Jun 28, 2024 7:39:00 GMT
Are you a journalist? 🤔 Interesting--thanks! What are the schools where staff resigned owing to sexual and racial abuse allegations?
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Post by ceebee on Jun 28, 2024 7:49:16 GMT
Are you a journalist? 🤔 Interesting--thanks! What are the schools where staff resigned owing to sexual and racial abuse allegations? Does it matter if they are? Standards in drama schools have been an endemic issue for decades and I welcome any discussion on this matter, provided people are careful not to identify people or places (for the sake of the moderators)!
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Post by cavocado on Jun 28, 2024 10:45:31 GMT
I don't know anything about drama schools so excuse my ignorance...I just wondered, as some posters are saying there is a big range in the technical ability of new students, do drama schools do what a lot of universities do in other subject areas, and offer foundation years for people who have aptitude but need to do some catching up on skills/knowledge before starting their first year? That is surely something that could be done for levelling up - offering ways to catch up for students from less privileged backgrounds who haven't had all the extra-curricular opportunities as children. Maybe not a whole foundation year, but a term, or part-time catch up tuition, or partner with other institutions around the country who could offer catch-up tuition in a way that would be affordable.
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Post by aspieandy on Jun 28, 2024 11:15:01 GMT
This is an issue across further education. Has been for most of the last decade.
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Post by Dr Tom on Jun 28, 2024 11:36:30 GMT
To answer the original question, no I have not seen a decline of the standard of the drama school graduates who reach a professional stage.
Please remember though that unfortunately there are many times more graduates than there are spaces for new talent to replace people who are leaving the business etc, so producers still have their pick of the crop. Graduates do generally need to stand out in some way (not necessarily by being the best actor). That's nothing new.
More diversity in the school intakes and on professional stages is something to be applauded.
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Post by smithfield on Jun 29, 2024 9:11:48 GMT
Interesting--thanks! What are the schools where staff resigned owing to sexual and racial abuse allegations? No, can we not get into naming schools or individuals please. Sorry, but isn't the issue here that another poster ('Max') wrote that it is a fact that staff members at certain schools resigned owing to their failure to address sexual and racial abuse allegations?* If that statement is indeed a matter of fact, then publishing something that is "factual"--that is, by definition, a matter that's been properly adjudicated, established as fact, and therefore previously published--couldn't be libelous and is therefore not inappropriate. On the other hand, if that other poster wrote that something was factual, but that something was (in fact) merely the poster's opinion or speculation, then it seems to me that the moderator would want to warn the poster not to assert something as factual that isn't. *'What's factual is that some staff have left drama schools you haven't named due to: failure to tackle abuse allegations from students (allegations of a racial, sexual, or body-discrimination nature).'
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Jun 29, 2024 10:08:25 GMT
No, can we not get into naming schools or individuals please. Sorry, but isn't the issue here that another poster ('Max') wrote that it is a fact that staff members at certain schools resigned owing to their failure to address sexual and racial abuse allegations?* If that statement is indeed a matter of fact, then publishing something that is "factual"--that is, by definition, a matter that's been properly adjudicated, established as fact, and therefore previously published--couldn't be libelous and is therefore not inappropriate. On the other hand, if that other poster wrote that something was factual, but that something was (in fact) merely the poster's opinion or speculation, then it seems to me that the moderator would want to warn the poster not to assert something as factual that isn't. *'What's factual is that some staff have left drama schools you haven't named due to: failure to tackle abuse allegations from students (allegations of a racial, sexual, or body-discrimination nature).' Which puts the entire responsibility onto the mods to fact check every statement made about schools or people. Sorry, no. I allowed your initial post to mention Patsy Rodenburg’s reason for leaving Guildhall only after I’d researched and seen her say as much in published interviews. However I am not going to take responsibility for doing that for every name or establishment that anyone might casually toss into a forum discussion. If you’ve joined purely to discuss this subject then please respect this. If that’s not good enough then I’ll close the thread.
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