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Post by fluxcapacitor on Sept 7, 2023 19:02:27 GMT
Surprised they’re delaying at all to be honest, rather than just covering (or even skipping!) her songs in previews until a replacement is found. It’s ultimately a concert after all and they managed to just cover when Hannah Waddingham - who was ultimately a much bigger draw - had to pull out of the original one-off special. I think the answer lies in creating early buzz. They are very keen for critics and invited audience to see a star-laden early cast and get those review quotes up on posters. How many shows have we all seen where original casts are front-loaded, director in every night, star names. Then gradually quality drops, the show is frozen and dance captain is running the show. Performers don’t get replaced like-for-like in terms of stature (if at all - “do we really need to spend this £3k a week while ticket sales fall? Performer ax can double”. The reviews for opening are the key and endgame for many producers. How many times did respected critics go back and review Les Mis or Phantom or Wicked between opening and a decade later? Yet those productions constantly cite reviews which were 20-30 years out of date at this point. Front load, get good reviews, hope for sales and then downgrade cheaper ASAP to find that crucial profitable running figure. Anything else is a bonus. #dear Appreciate the need for reviews and for names to sell seats, but we’re talking about preview shows here - reviewers wouldn’t be publicising the show until its official opening anyway. I’m sure they saw it as the best option, but for what is essentially a concert it does feel like it could have been avoided. Maybe they think a new replacement star name will help sell seats… |
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Post by apubleed on Sept 7, 2023 20:59:00 GMT
I'm sure if it could have been avoided, it would have. Cameron Mackintosh cares about one thing, making money. And it must have been painful for him to have to cancel the first few performances since they were the only ones actually selling lol (especially the first!)
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Post by Fleance on Sept 7, 2023 21:38:16 GMT
Surprised they’re delaying at all to be honest, rather than just covering (or even skipping!) her songs in previews until a replacement is found. It’s ultimately a concert after all and they managed to just cover when Hannah Waddingham - who was ultimately a much bigger draw - had to pull out of the original one-off special. I think the answer lies in creating early buzz. They are very keen for critics and invited audience to see a star-laden early cast and get those review quotes up on posters. How many shows have we all seen where original casts are front-loaded, director in every night, star names. Then gradually quality drops, the show is frozen and dance captain is running the show. Performers don’t get replaced like-for-like in terms of stature (if at all - “do we really need to spend this £3k a week while ticket sales fall? Performer ax can double”. The reviews for opening are the key and endgame for many producers. How many times did respected critics go back and review Les Mis or Phantom or Wicked between opening and a decade later? Yet those productions constantly cite reviews which were 20-30 years out of date at this point. Front load, get good reviews, hope for sales and then downgrade cheaper ASAP to find that crucial profitable running figure. Anything else is a bonus. #dear An example of that is a show that I loved: the Coleman/Comden/Green musical On the Twentieth Century. To much fanfare, Madeleine Kahn was touted as the show's star, Lily Garland. She played Lily for two months. She's on the original cast album. By the time I got to see the show, which was shortly after that two-month period, Kahn had been replaced by Judy Kaye. Kaye was wonderful, and the role launched her career, but Kahn was one of the original draws. |
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Post by sph on Sept 7, 2023 22:17:14 GMT
I think the answer lies in creating early buzz. They are very keen for critics and invited audience to see a star-laden early cast and get those review quotes up on posters. How many shows have we all seen where original casts are front-loaded, director in every night, star names. Then gradually quality drops, the show is frozen and dance captain is running the show. Performers don’t get replaced like-for-like in terms of stature (if at all - “do we really need to spend this £3k a week while ticket sales fall? Performer ax can double”. The reviews for opening are the key and endgame for many producers. How many times did respected critics go back and review Les Mis or Phantom or Wicked between opening and a decade later? Yet those productions constantly cite reviews which were 20-30 years out of date at this point. Front load, get good reviews, hope for sales and then downgrade cheaper ASAP to find that crucial profitable running figure. Anything else is a bonus. #dear An example of that is a show that I loved: the Coleman/Comden/Green musical On the Twentieth Century. To much fanfare, Madeleine Kahn was touted as the show's star, Lily Garland. She played Lily for two months. She's on the original cast album. By the time I got to see the show, which was shortly after that two-month period, Kahn had been replaced by Judy Kaye. Kaye was wonderful, and the role launched her career, but Kahn was one of the original draws. I believe Kahn withdrew due to struggling to keep up with the show vocally. It's a big sing! A shame she didn't last a bit longer. |
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Sept 7, 2023 23:48:09 GMT
How hard is it to place someone into a revue show? They couldn't do that in 9 days?
It's a very odd thing to do, cancel your first week which is probably the most heavily booked so far.
I'm taking a refund on my exspensive seat and go when it's papering instead.
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Post by mrbarnaby on Sept 8, 2023 7:51:51 GMT
How hard is it to place someone into a revue show? They couldn't do that in 9 days? It's a very odd thing to do, cancel your first week which is probably the most heavily booked so far. I'm taking a refund on my exspensive seat and go when it's papering instead. There’s a good chance they haven’t even found a replacement yet or if they have, perhaps they weren’t available to start rehearsals right away |
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Post by theoracle on Sept 8, 2023 9:49:07 GMT
Speculating on a replacement - Claire Moore? I would like to see an actual “old friend” of Stephen Sondheim as some of the names in this cast never even worked with him… I would like to see Joanna Riding take on Ladies Who Lunch though if they’re having to redistribute songs. And please can Janie Dee take Could I Leave You back, after Michael Ball’s questionable interpretation last year
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Post by Mark on Sept 8, 2023 9:52:39 GMT
Speculating on a replacement - Claire Moore? I would like to see an actual “old friend” of Stephen Sondheim as some of the names in this cast never even worked with him… I would like to see Joanna Riding take on Ladies Who Lunch though if they’re having to redistribute songs. And please can Janie Dee take Could I Leave You back, after Michael Ball’s questionable interpretation last year Claire Moore would be wonderful casting. |
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Post by couldileaveyou on Sept 8, 2023 10:03:31 GMT
Speculating on a replacement - Claire Moore? I would like to see an actual “old friend” of Stephen Sondheim as some of the names in this cast never even worked with him… I would like to see Joanna Riding take on Ladies Who Lunch though if they’re having to redistribute songs. And please can Janie Dee take Could I Leave You back, after Michael Ball’s questionable interpretation last year I so wanted to hear Haydn sing Could I Leave You?, she's always been my dream Phyllis! Seconded, hope Janie gets it back |
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Post by lou105 on Sept 8, 2023 12:34:46 GMT
There was an interview with Bonnie on BBC
Breakfast the other day when she said the whole cast is in a lot of numbers and learning complex harmonies etc. So I guess they have a whole track for someone to learn, not just a couple of numbers and a finale
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Post by fluxcapacitor on Sept 8, 2023 12:52:43 GMT
There was an interview with Bonnie on BBC Breakfast the other day when she said the whole cast is in a lot of numbers and learning complex harmonies etc. So I guess they have a whole track for someone to learn, not just a couple of numbers and a finale I’m so confused at this show. That makes it sound like a completely different production to the original revue that was mounted last year. I’m not surprised if that’s the case. A lot of the original material was there to facilitate specific performers after all. But if it is a different show, WHY try to sell it as the same thing? They’re doing it and the performers involved a disservice and I dare say it might have sold better if they’d marketed this as a brand new curated celebration of Sondheim rather than an inferior attempted remount of a star studded one off concert without most of the star names. |
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Post by alece10 on Sept 8, 2023 13:28:45 GMT
The power of t'internet. At the bottom of the page of this thread (where the adverts are) is an advert for this show.....
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Post by mrbarnaby on Sept 8, 2023 13:52:55 GMT
There was an interview with Bonnie on BBC Breakfast the other day when she said the whole cast is in a lot of numbers and learning complex harmonies etc. So I guess they have a whole track for someone to learn, not just a couple of numbers and a finale I’m so confused at this show. That makes it sound like a completely different production to the original revue that was mounted last year. I’m not surprised if that’s the case. A lot of the original material was there to facilitate specific performers after all. But if it is a different show, WHY try to sell it as the same thing? They’re doing it and the performers involved a disservice and I dare say it might have sold better if they’d marketed this as a brand new curated celebration of Sondheim rather than an inferior attempted remount of a star studded one off concert without most of the star names. I don’t get what the problem is? It has a different cast so it’s inherently different. I’m sure anyone that was really wanting to see the original concert did so either in person, or watched the tv broadcast. |
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Post by anthony40 on Sept 8, 2023 13:57:50 GMT
I don’t get what the problem is? It has a different cast so it’s inherently different. I’m sure anyone that was really wanting to see the original concert did so either in person, or watched the tv broadcast. Speaking of which, anyone her or know anything about this being released to purchase? |
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Post by mrbarnaby on Sept 8, 2023 14:04:36 GMT
I don’t get what the problem is? It has a different cast so it’s inherently different. I’m sure anyone that was really wanting to see the original concert did so either in person, or watched the tv broadcast. Speaking of which, anyone her or know anything about this being released to purchase? It certainly wouldn’t be while they are trying to flog tickets for this run! After perhaps? When is the Cast recording out? |
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Post by lou105 on Sept 8, 2023 14:28:19 GMT
It's still on iPlayer, if anyone didnt know.
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Post by fluxcapacitor on Sept 8, 2023 15:01:57 GMT
I’m so confused at this show. That makes it sound like a completely different production to the original revue that was mounted last year. I’m not surprised if that’s the case. A lot of the original material was there to facilitate specific performers after all. But if it is a different show, WHY try to sell it as the same thing? They’re doing it and the performers involved a disservice and I dare say it might have sold better if they’d marketed this as a brand new curated celebration of Sondheim rather than an inferior attempted remount of a star studded one off concert without most of the star names. I don’t get what the problem is? It has a different cast so it’s inherently different. I’m sure anyone that was really wanting to see the original concert did so either in person, or watched the tv broadcast. But I think that is the problem, personally. As you say, it's inherently different, so why is it marketed as the same thing? It's a very different situation if someone does "Into the Woods" - you know what material you're getting, no matter who the cast is. Even "Sondheim on Sondheim" as a revue has a thread - a core to hold it together through Sondheim's narration; whist 'Putting it Together' also has a very loose plot to link the songs. But what makes this "Stephen Sondheim's Old Friends" and not just another revue with a unique song list and cast? It just feels like it's falling into a frustrating gap - it's neither a new show nor is it the same show that was mounted under that title last year, and I think that's probably a big reason why it's struggling to sell. |
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Post by BVM on Sept 8, 2023 15:07:05 GMT
Speculating on a replacement - Claire Moore? I would like to see an actual “old friend” of Stephen Sondheim as some of the names in this cast never even worked with him… I would like to see Joanna Riding take on Ladies Who Lunch though if they’re having to redistribute songs. And please can Janie Dee take Could I Leave You back, after Michael Ball’s questionable interpretation last year Dame Moore would push me over into actually buying a ticket for this. (Though I'd far rather she belted out It's Her Or Me than anything by Sondheim lol #SorryNotSorry). |
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Post by c4ndyc4ne on Sept 8, 2023 16:31:49 GMT
it sounds as though that this isn't just a repeat attempt at the Sondheim concert but something different - which is good news!
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Sept 8, 2023 19:10:53 GMT
I guess they're holding out for a name, given that they cast 4 'co-star alternates' which possibly means they only cover ensemble tracks? They would have been in the rehearsal room from day 1 and know the show.
No one in the ensemble able to step up for a few performances. Give someone a chance to get some good notices and press?
If one of the 'stars' can't do a performance during the run, then what?
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Post by sph on Sept 9, 2023 2:29:57 GMT
It's probably not selling too well as Sondheim isn't really a "name" for the general British public. Theatre people, yes, but even then Sondheim's actual shows have far more success and frequent revivals in the US compared to the UK. Even Bernadette Peters isn't really a "name" over here unless you know your Broadway stars. Definitely one for the hardcore theatre fans. I think this might be more of a Cameron Mackintosh passion project rather than a commercial hit.
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Post by marob on Sept 9, 2023 6:17:03 GMT
In terms of honouring the man’s legacy I just find the fact that this is the only ’major’ production of his work that we’ve got is kind of disappointing. Meanwhile Broadway’s had starry revivals of Sweeney Todd, Merrily We Roll Along and Into the Woods, and are about to get his final show.
I’ll probably end up going on a cheap ticket nearer the time, and then I’d be booking mainly to see Bernadette Peters and Lea Salonga rather than a cobbled together concert.
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Post by max on Sept 9, 2023 6:51:12 GMT
In terms of honouring the man’s legacy I just find the fact that this is the only ’major’ production of his work that we’ve got is kind of disappointing. Meanwhile Broadway’s had starry revivals of Sweeney Todd, Merrily We Roll Along and Into the Woods, and are about to get his final show. I’ll probably end up going on a cheap ticket nearer the time, and then I’d be booking mainly to see Bernadette Peters and Lea Salonga rather than a cobbled together concert. I think there's a good chance all three of those shows will come here from Broadway - why not? That doesn't assuage your disappointment for now though. Menier 'Pacific Overtures' upcoming. A shame Terry Gilliam 'Into The Woods' didn't get a longer life. What's the deal with the casting on this concert? The website says: "If a featured artist is unable to perform, their part will be played by one of their co-stars or co-star alternates". Who are these co-star alternates? Are they the cast named who aren't actually 'stars'? |
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Post by Rory on Sept 9, 2023 8:18:32 GMT
This may not actually be true but it feels like we send everything good to New York but get relatively little back in return.
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