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Post by ThereWillBeSun on Apr 30, 2021 21:19:00 GMT
I haven't shut down the thread. I'm saying that anything anyone has to say can be said better with careful thought than with a frantic "must attack" post. That goes for everyone.
I posted in Feedback to have my account deleted, too much abuse and calling people mentally ill or a rape apologist isn’t something I accept. I don’t want to be associated with that or site that tolerates It. shirleydevore probably can’t see this but if they can: if you can’t handle the heat, step out of the kitchen. You wrote those posts. No one else did. Don’t have this ‘woe is me’ attitude when you belittled those women coming forward and having the courage to speak their truth. Twenty women. So incredibly brave. On another note, I’m sad to hear of your trauma, I am a sexual assault survivor too, but it’s not about trying to outdo and compare. Be an ally. If you have been through this, you should be more understanding - that’s what I do not understand, it’s bizarre to be quite frank and shameful. We tried to explain what was inherently wrong with your posts but you were not accepting. Good luck! |
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Post by zahidf on May 1, 2021 8:20:25 GMT
Holy crap
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 1, 2021 8:36:37 GMT
The man needs more than professional help. He needs to be before the courts.
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Post by zahidf on May 1, 2021 9:03:37 GMT
The man needs more than professional help. He needs to be before the courts. I'm amazed the school swept it under the carpet like that. They need to explain themselves a lot more as well |
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 1, 2021 9:10:39 GMT
I can understand why they took the actions they did.
They wanted to preserve their relationship with a high profile industry professional. I can imagine they thought that he wasn't a trained educator and didn't appreciate the different boundaries that have to exist between teacher and student. They took steps to make sure he was never left alone with students again.
With hindsight, that now looks an inadequate response. But at the time, it probably felt to them that it was proportionate based on the information they had. And they were dealing with a powerful individual who could help their students in the industry.
Yes, they should have asked more questions to find out more about his activities with students. But even a few years ago, the atmosphere was different to how it is today.
This sort of behaviour should never have been tolerated. We all get that now. But it has taken time to get there.
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Post by zahidf on May 1, 2021 9:14:25 GMT
I can understand why they took the actions they did. They wanted to preserve their relationship with a high profile industry professional. I can imagine they thought that he wasn't a trained educator and didn't appreciate the different boundaries that have to exist between teacher and student. They took steps to make sure he was never left alone with students again. With hindsight, that now looks an inadequate response. But at the time, it probably felt to them that it was proportionate based on the information they had. And they were dealing with a powerful individual who could help their students in the industry. Yes, they should have asked more questions to find out more about his activities with students. But even a few years ago, the atmosphere was different to how it is today. This sort of behaviour should never have been tolerated. We all get that now. But it has taken time to get there. It's reminiscent of what James Franco got up to in America as well actually. I wonder how many figures are guilty of doing this... (high I imagine) |
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Post by talkingheads on May 1, 2021 10:16:54 GMT
It's so discombobulating to see someone I respected and admired so much be outed as such a vile human being. In fact I count a few of his films amongst my favourites, now I'm not so sure.
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Post by kathryn on May 1, 2021 10:30:20 GMT
The boundaries with acting can be so fuzzy - how many other professional industries are there where people genuinely do need to feel comfortable getting physically intimate with each other, and being naked in front of potentially a whole room of people? - that it’s too easy for people with ulterior motives to exploit the ambiguities.
The industry really needs to set down strict codes of practice. You wouldn’t think that things like impromptu ‘acting exercises’ involving undressing and ‘naked auditions’ needed to be explicitly banned, but quite obviously they do.
Part of the problem here, I think, is the general attitude of ‘well I went through the same and it never hurt me! Stop playing the victim!’. Yes, yes it did hurt you - you just don’t realise that the coping mechanism you developed was denial, normalising and minimising the behaviour, and getting angry at anyone who complains about it happening to them.
That’s an editorial ‘you’ there, for avoidance of doubt.
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Post by talkingheads on May 1, 2021 10:44:53 GMT
The stories going around Twitter. This one really made me feel sick.
I've always loathed Russell Brand, and thank God Billy Connolly calls this stuff out.
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Post by crowblack on May 1, 2021 10:52:04 GMT
He actually retweeted a female student's tweet at the time! '@noelclarke wanted us to show some flesh as a real test of our commitment!!! @lsda_acting we do all sorts of randoms'
May 2012, and '@' to the drama school. That coercive 'commitment' line again, used so often in that industry when praising young actors performing naked.
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on May 1, 2021 11:46:18 GMT
The boundaries with acting can be so fuzzy - how many other professional industries are there where people genuinely do need to feel comfortable getting physically intimate with each other, and being naked in front of potentially a whole room of people? - that it’s too easy for people with ulterior motives to exploit the ambiguities. The industry really needs to set down strict codes of practice. You wouldn’t think that things like impromptu ‘acting exercises’ involving undressing and ‘naked auditions’ needed to be explicitly banned, but quite obviously they do. Part of the problem here, I think, is the general attitude of ‘well I went through the same and it never hurt me! Stop playing the victim!’. Yes, yes it did hurt you - you just don’t realise that the coping mechanism you developed was denial, normalising and minimising the behaviour, and getting angry at anyone who complains about it happening to them. That’s an editorial ‘you’ there, for avoidance of doubt. Intimacy is a massive issue. Which is why I am glad intimacy directors are now a thing - the cast of Bridgerton praised Lizzy Talbot on her work and making them feel safe. www.lizzytalbot.com/ (great resource) and there are other linked resources she has including podcasts. In general - If you don't say 'YES' - you're seen as a failure. I witnessed this whilst training - not intimacy but more emotional memory with an acting teacher who was on a massive ego trip. Did I say anything? NO. Because I thought, 'well he knows best.' I was more impressionable. I thought, 'this is normal.' NEWSFLASH. IT ISN'T. You should not have to be 'BROKEN DOWN' to gain results. It's abuse. I should not have to relive my past trauma and dig deep for acting. It's BS, harmful and detrimental to mental health. This isn't just about Noel Clarke, this is about the industry in general - a lot of stuff is ignored. TIME IS UP. |
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on May 1, 2021 11:49:16 GMT
They are liars. They still invited him in for a talk in 2016. |
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on May 1, 2021 11:56:45 GMT
I don't get how they didn't know.
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Post by stagebyte on May 1, 2021 14:42:58 GMT
The stories going around Twitter. This one really made me feel sick. I've always loathed Russell Brand, and thank God Billy Connolly calls this stuff out. Just reading that piece made my skin crawl. I know the Sun isn’t exactly known for its serious reportage but the language they use is clearly telling their readership it’s all harmless fun. ‘Sex mad comic’ ‘Film lothario Russell’ ‘Saucy demand’ ‘Cheeky demand’ ‘Caused chaos’ ‘A charming scoundrel’ ‘Just a bit of fun’ ‘She gave in’ Charming Scoundrel? - grade A sex pest As for ‘sex addiction rehab’ is this something ‘celebs’ like him a d Michael Douglas go to to avoid prosecution? Sounds like over inflated egos with power issue problems to me dressed up as ‘sex addiction’ |
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Post by stagebyte on May 1, 2021 14:46:02 GMT
The stories going around Twitter. This one really made me feel sick. I've always loathed Russell Brand, and thank God Billy Connolly calls this stuff out. Just reading that piece made my skin crawl. I know the Sun isn’t exactly known for its serious reportage but the language they use is clearly telling their readership it’s all harmless fun. ‘Randy Russell’ ‘Sex mad comic’ ‘Film lothario Russell’ ‘Saucy demand’ ‘Cheeky demand’ ‘Caused chaos’ ‘A charming scoundrel’ ‘Just a bit of fun’ ‘She gave in’ Charming Scoundrel - grade A sex pest And what must the atmosphere have been like generally on the set for the woman to think she had to give in for the sake of the production - they to me were as culpable As for ‘sex addiction rehab’ is this something ‘celebs’ like him a d Michael Douglas go to to avoid prosecution? Sounds like over inflated egos with power issue problems to me dressed up as ‘sex addiction’ Also whoever was in charge of that set and the toxic atmosphere of Brand being allowed to ‘get away with murder’ they’re ALL equally culpable for making her feel like she had to ‘give in’ And PLEASE she’s not a wardrobe GIRL. JOB TITLE or at the very least let’s agree she’s a woman? |
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on May 1, 2021 15:05:29 GMT
Just reading that piece made my skin crawl. I know the Sun isn’t exactly known for its serious reportage but the language they use is clearly telling their readership it’s all harmless fun. ‘Randy Russell’ ‘Sex mad comic’ ‘Film lothario Russell’ ‘Saucy demand’ ‘Cheeky demand’ ‘Caused chaos’ ‘A charming scoundrel’ ‘Just a bit of fun’ ‘She gave in’ Charming Scoundrel - grade A sex pest And what must the atmosphere have been like generally on the set for the woman to think she had to give in for the sake of the production - they to me were as culpable As for ‘sex addiction rehab’ is this something ‘celebs’ like him a d Michael Douglas go to to avoid prosecution? Sounds like over inflated egos with power issue problems to me dressed up as ‘sex addiction’ Also whoever was in charge of that set and the toxic atmosphere of Brand being allowed to ‘get away with murder’ they’re ALL equally culpable for making her feel like she had to ‘give in’ And PLEASE she’s not a wardrobe GIRL. JOB TITLE or at the very least let’s agree she’s a woman? SEXISM STILL EXISTS. Ugh. My skin is crawling. Russell Brand is trash. The way he treated Katy Perry was vile. |
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Post by oxfordsimon on May 1, 2021 15:45:33 GMT
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Post by talkingheads on May 4, 2021 11:20:03 GMT
Statement from Adam Deacon:
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Post by talkingheads on May 7, 2021 11:03:30 GMT
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Post by sph on May 7, 2021 11:25:55 GMT
Well it's all pretty damning isn't it? Such a shame to see this kind of behaviour and that it's been going on for so long.
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Post by cherokee on May 7, 2021 12:46:38 GMT
It's so strange to see headlines saying Barrowman is 'accused' of exposing himself. He - and numerous co-stars of his - have openly talked about it for years. It's a matter of public record that he did it in every job he ever did.
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Post by sph on May 7, 2021 16:26:18 GMT
Yes, I'm in two minds about the Barrowman accusations. Personally, I can't stand him (sorry), but I feel like he was just being a bit too exuberant which he has a reputation for, and actors who are comfortable with each other often have less boundaries than colleagues in your average daily office job for example.
Sometimes, it seems he went too far, like lying it on an actress' shoulder, but then we don't know what their personal dynamic was like and can't judge how they interact with each other. She may have found it hilarious, and quite frankly I'd hate theatres and film sets to become cold, impersonal corporate workplaces.
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Post by vdcni on May 7, 2021 16:45:23 GMT
The issue with Barrowman is though his co stars don't seem to have minded, based upon the many convention anecdotes and interviews where they've told these stories in good humour, the crew may not want to see him wave his dick around and they have less power and less of voice.
That said what he did wasn't anywhere near as bad as Clarke and trying to link them in some kind of the Doctor Who set was out of control story is a bit of a stretch.
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Post by mrbarnaby on May 7, 2021 17:41:24 GMT
As has been said, Barrowman has been doing this for years and years.
It’s totally unacceptable of course, but what’s weird is that no one seemed to ever pull him up on it or complain about it.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2021 18:09:21 GMT
The very fact that "everyone knows" what Barrowman is like suggests that most people saw it as just a bit of playfulness, or at least accepted that was the intent, even if it's inappropriate. It's a different situation when many people suddenly make accusations apparently out of nowhere because it suggests the perpetrator has been trying to keep things quiet, which is hardly the approach of someone who believes what they're doing is innocent fun.
In other words, if it takes a journalist to uncover what you've been doing you probably knew you shouldn't have been doing it.
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