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Post by sph on Oct 30, 2020 19:40:27 GMT
It's all very well for those with a secure wage to criticise, but as long as these places are open they have bills and staff to pay. They can't afford to police people and turn them away at the door. All the pubs I go to are managing perfectly well with restrictions in place and are enforcing them. It's probably different for town-centre drinking establishments but many of the dining pubs are rarely at full capacity for most of the week, so apart from Saturday evening and Sunday lunch they're generally handling nearly as many people now as they would have been at the same time last year. There's some loss of business but it's certainly not a case of half the capacity meaning half the income.
That's obviously not the case for establishments that cater to the serious-drinking crowd, but given how much a risk those represent we can't really afford to keep them open. I don't think there are that many of them around these days anyway. Pub culture has changed a lot over the last couple of decades and it's become much more of a family environment with an emphasis on food and relaxation.
I think that's far from the truth and anyone working in the hospitality industry would disagree with everything you just said. Many venues are struggling or have already closed and are certainly not "managing perfectly well". And if restaurants were already not at full capacity last year, what chance do they have now that they can only have people from the same household? A pub is a social environment. Some cater to families yes, but it's hard graft getting the customers in at the best of times. I come from a restaurant and hotel family, I worked restaurants for years, my parents are still in the restaurant business. I've seen all of this with my own eyes, and I saw it from the other side, not as a casual patron who just decides "oh I see people here, I'm sure it's doing fine." "My paycheck is safe. The hospitality industry will just have to manage," say the civil servants. It truly blows my mind that this is the approach people have. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2020 19:51:35 GMT
I think that's far from the truth and anyone working in the hospitality industry would disagree with everything you just said. I got what I said from talking to people in the hospitality industry. YMMV, of course, but I'm not just making stuff up. Perhaps it depends what sort of places you go to. I mostly go to out-of-town places where the rents are lower and where there's a high proportion of loyal regulars rather than passing traffic. It's obviously going to different for a town centre site that needs to operate close to capacity to cover the higher costs and where chance trade makes up a significant part of the takings. But I already said that.
It's not easy, but people are making it work.
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Post by sph on Oct 30, 2020 20:03:42 GMT
I think that's far from the truth and anyone working in the hospitality industry would disagree with everything you just said. I got what I said from talking to people in the hospitality industry. YMMV, of course, but I'm not just making stuff up. Perhaps it depends what sort of places you go to. I mostly go to out-of-town places where the rents are lower and where there's a high proportion of loyal regulars rather than passing traffic. It's obviously going to different for a town centre site that needs to operate close to capacity to cover the higher costs and where chance trade makes up a significant part of the takings. But I already said that.
It's not easy, but people are making it work.
The people you have spoken to may be doing ok, but I have a feeling that a nationwide survey of the sector would suggest a very different story. This winter is going to be exceptionally hard for them - even a very quick search will bring up many articles that show that no, people are not in fact, "making it work." The actual facts and figures are pretty grim. |
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Post by theatreian on Oct 30, 2020 23:01:57 GMT
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Post by Phantom of London on Oct 30, 2020 23:49:07 GMT
I had to have a test on Tuesday and thankfully it was negative, as I was showing symptoms. I knew my results less than 24 hours later,.so full praise to the government for getting testing right. However this was not the case for my colleague Andy, who died from Covid on last Friiday, So it is very real..
With some of the youth not wearing masks and many of these live in multi-generational households, the results are going to be terrible, along with some of the Brexiter type tradespeople following a similar theme of not mask wearing.
So a lockdown is now the only way forward. I am vulnerable because of conditions and was shielded, but because I am in an essential service I have to go to work, where the journey to and from work by train absolutely petrifies me. This virus is totally out of control. We learned earlier this year, if you follow the science Covid can be controlled, albeit taking a sledgehammer to the economy and the populations enjoyments.
My garden is looking brilliant and I planted rouble 500 bulbs, so would like to be around to see the results.
However Covid and a strong economy will not co-exist, as people will be reluctant.
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 30, 2020 23:56:46 GMT
Inevitable. I was just beginning to get a tiny glimmer of hope that I might visit a friend, see a show. But no. A combination of a selfish minority and an omnishambles of a Government leads us to this.
What I want to know is their plans post lockdown. Because Track and Trace still doesn't work and there are so many things to consider. Surely we must be at a point where a Universal Basic Income is a must? It is clear now that any attempt to get the economy back to where it was will not work with Covid.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2020 0:33:24 GMT
Even with that the government are completely thick - how does locking down the country but leaving open the main sources of infection spreading solve anything?! |
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 13:01:54 GMT
Press conference at 4PM today with Johnson, Whitty and Valance.
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Post by theatreian on Oct 31, 2020 14:39:15 GMT
Press conference at 4PM today with Johnson, Whitty and Valance. It has now been put back to 5pm!! Keeping us in suspense for another hour or maybe because the rugby is on!! |
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 15:49:16 GMT
Press conference at 4PM today with Johnson, Whitty and Valance. It has now been put back to 5pm!! Keeping us in suspense for another hour or maybe because the rugby is on!! They can't even be on time for a press conference they organised never mind organise a second lockdown! |
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Post by NeilVHughes on Oct 31, 2020 16:00:08 GMT
Doesn’t matter it has been leaked at the original time.
Starts 00:01 on Thu and though not specifically stated we can assume that Theatres will have to close
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 16:11:23 GMT
Honestly, what is the point in any of this if thousands of kids are mixing in schools?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2020 17:13:24 GMT
Honestly, what is the point in any of this if thousands of kids are mixing in schools? My thoughts exactly - though include universities as well. The whole point is to try to reduce the number of hospital admissions at any one time, yet the major sources of infection and spread are not being closed and those who are, on the whole, taking adequate precautions are losing their livelihoods again. You couldn't make it up. Thank goodness my hairdresser had last minute availability today...! |
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Post by CG on the loose on Oct 31, 2020 17:19:01 GMT
After a very vivid 'COVID was a dream' dream a few days ago (SO depressing when I woke up for real), last night I dreamt my hair (which was shoulder length in February and hasn't been cut since) had grown past my waist. I'm just hoping it wasn't a portent of when I can next get it cut!
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Post by CG on the loose on Oct 31, 2020 17:19:39 GMT
Oh and press conference further delayed... Press Association are saying 6.30pm, but who the hell knows!
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 17:20:33 GMT
Vital public health messaging at 4. No 5. Actually it'll be closer to 6 but maybe a bit after when we can be bothered. The words I have for this Government would probably get me banned so suffice it to say, I think they are doing an atrocious job.
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Post by danb on Oct 31, 2020 17:26:35 GMT
My mood is darker than dark about now...
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Post by NeilVHughes on Oct 31, 2020 17:30:05 GMT
Looking through the Thesaurus and agreeing on another term for lockdown takes time.
It cannot in any way be called lockdown, circuit breaker or fire break.
At the moment in Government is calling it ‘tough new national measures’ which doesn’t scan very well.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2020 17:36:28 GMT
Vital public health messaging at 4. No 5. Actually it'll be closer to 6 but maybe a bit after when we can be bothered. We all have a pretty good idea of what's going to happen so the press conference is just a boring formality. Unless Boris Johnson literally says "We were too slow to act and now we're f—ed unless the whole country pulls together to get out of this hole we dumped you in" it'll be a total non-event. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2020 17:38:34 GMT
Vital public health messaging at 4. No 5. Actually it'll be closer to 6 but maybe a bit after when we can be bothered. We all have a pretty good idea of what's going to happen so the press conference is just a boring formality. Unless Boris Johnson literally says "We were too slow to act and now we're f—ed unless the whole country pulls together to get out of this hole we dumped you in" it'll be a total non-event. I'm not even giving it 10 seconds of my time - even that amount of time hearing that buffoon's voice is enough to make my blood pressure skyrocket... |
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Post by clair on Oct 31, 2020 17:40:50 GMT
I wish he would say just that! Maybe a simple admittance of getting it wrong and a plea to everyone to do their bit would get through - at least it would be understandable rather than all the mixed messaging rhetoric to date.
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 17:43:40 GMT
Vital public health messaging at 4. No 5. Actually it'll be closer to 6 but maybe a bit after when we can be bothered. We all have a pretty good idea of what's going to happen so the press conference is just a boring formality. Unless Boris Johnson literally says "We were too slow to act and now we're f—ed unless the whole country pulls together to get out of this hole we dumped you in" it'll be a total non-event. Yes, but Governance by Press cannot go on. This isn't political point scoring. This is vital public health messaging. All this hearsay and speculation is detrimental to what should be a clear and concise briefing. |
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Post by Phantom of London on Oct 31, 2020 18:15:26 GMT
Perhaps the delay is because Boris is still trying to get his Halloween costume right.
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Post by talkingheads on Oct 31, 2020 20:42:37 GMT
The lack of support for the self employed and workers in the arts in the first lockdown was unbelievable. But now in Lockdown 2 it's unforgivable! Not to mention those who had no support first time round. Universal Basic Income will need to become part of the conversation very soon.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 31, 2020 20:47:47 GMT
We all have a pretty good idea of what's going to happen so the press conference is just a boring formality. Unless Boris Johnson literally says "We were too slow to act and now we're f—ed unless the whole country pulls together to get out of this hole we dumped you in" it'll be a total non-event. Yes, but Governance by Press cannot go on. This isn't political point scoring. This is vital public health messaging. All this hearsay and speculation is detrimental to what should be a clear and concise briefing. If it was really vital public health messaging alone it would have been a full lockdown with educational institutions closed. The message they are giving instead is that education is more important than health, despite the fact that at least some (though I appreciate not all) children and absolutely all university students can be taught from home. Therefore, it is vital for the government to admit they have been wrong, as they are reliant on enough people who aren't currently the biggest causes of the virus spreading complying with these new measures to over-compensate for the government's lack of backbone when it comes to a proper short sharp lockdown. People need to really understand why this lockdown is happening now, and the only reason is because the government have failed. Otherwise how on earth do they have any new incentive to comply if they haven't been already? |
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