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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 9:08:09 GMT
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jan 22, 2020 12:18:53 GMT
Good article and I do agree.
Are popular musicals staged at Christmas to bankroll the theatres other productions throughout the year?
A lot of the public sector could learn from the Watermill who create wonders on a shoestring. Not every show has to have a huge cast, orchestra and a revolve. Yes NT I'm talking to you!
Edit. I went off topic as the subject is new musicals. But Watermill are staging two new musicals in the coming months
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 13:46:55 GMT
Not every show has to have a huge cast, orchestra and a revolve. No, but wouldn’t it be fabulous if they did! (I’m joking of course. Well. Ish!)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 15:12:39 GMT
I agree. New British musicals are sorely lacking and it feels like the west end is full of US imports at the moment, or revivals of US musicals. When was the last time a new British musical really became a runaway success? Could we even count 10 across the last decade?
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Post by kathryn on Jan 22, 2020 15:51:28 GMT
I think the last genuine British success must be Matilda? Though Six might eventually qualify.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 16:21:33 GMT
I think the last genuine British success must be Matilda? Though Six might eventually qualify. Yes, my only thought was Matilda too, and as it is an RSC production... does that mean it was subsidised too? Which basically proves the point (if it was). Matilda was first performed almost 10 years too.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 16:24:33 GMT
When was the last time a new British musical really became a runaway success? Everybody's Talking About Jamie Not many new musicals get a film adaptation so quickly. If ever.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Jan 22, 2020 17:17:56 GMT
How many American musicals are created with state subsidy?
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jan 22, 2020 18:12:29 GMT
How many American musicals are created with state subsidy? Good point but if the British tax payer is funding the writing of new operas and plays then why not musicals?
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Post by xanady on Jan 22, 2020 19:01:44 GMT
^Yes,musicals should have the same equal treatment as other theatre styles.Guessing that audience numbers for MT are very high in the UK.
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Post by oxfordsimon on Jan 22, 2020 19:21:47 GMT
How many American musicals are created with state subsidy? Good point but if the British tax payer is funding the writing of new operas and plays then why not musicals? There is public subsidy of the whole panoply of theatre forms in the UK It might not be directed specifically at creating new musicals - but the various Arts Councils do support theatres that help create new musicals. Theatr Clwyd helped create The Assassination of Katie Hopkins not so long ago. I believe Metta Theatre has received a range of support from ACE and ACE-supported theatres to help them create shows like The Willows. ACE funding certainly supported the creation of Matilda and The Boy in the Dress at the RSC (and going back further in time, I am pretty certain that public money helped the RSC create Les Mis to some extent) If creators of new Musical Theatre put together a funding bid for ACE (or equivalent) money, they are going to be given due consideration. There is nothing excluding them from receiving support. There may not be a specific pot of money set aside for this - but there are public funds available to help creators bring all sorts of work into the world. People have been given £10-15K to complete a novel by ACE - so anything is possible if you make the case for it in the right way. Those running major (and less major) theatres that receive public subsidy have their own priorities and that may not currently involve helping to create new musicals. But they have the potential to do so. I don't buy the line about the ROH - because the world of opera and the world of the musical are two very, very different beasts. Opera with short runs, large orchestras, big choruses and top soloists wouldn't exist without either public subsidy (the UK and European model) or philanthropic support (the US model) - the same goes for ballet. Musicals have longer runs, lower running costs and greater box office potential. Whenever people play the 'ROH gets millions' card, it tends to smack of jealousy rather than making a killer point. There is money for new musicals out there - whether through direct or indirect support. It is up to the theatres themselves to make it more of a priority. You don't always need new public money for everything. Look at using the existing pot more effectively.
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Post by princeton on Jan 23, 2020 1:01:00 GMT
No matter how strong the sentiment about musicals deserving to be better funded - I thought it was a pretty ropey piece of journalism and seemed to be basically a cut and paste from three interviews with very little research or context to back up the claims. Any article which implies that musicals are created by 'songwriters' should certainly be taken with a pitch of salt.
OxfordSimon hits the nail on the head - it really is a case of looking at ways of using the 'pots' more effectively. As noted above many theatres do use some of their public subsidy to develop new musicals some of which go on to have a further life whilst others don't. In addition to Jamie, Sheffield Theatres developed and staged Flowers for Mrs Harris and Standing at the Sky's Edge. The Lyric Hammersmith produced Leave To Remain; Birmingham Rep - One Love: the Bob Marley Musical; The Mercury Theatre Colchester - Pieces of String; and Northampton and Ipswich jointly produced The Season. All of these theatres receive funding from Arts Council England, and have chosen to develop these works - none of which are, to quote Rupert Goold, 'obviously commercial'.
Indeed Goold could use some of his Almeida pot to stage the work he describes. To date, however, he has only produced one musical during his tenure as Artistic Director, and that was set in New York, based on an American novel with American book writer and composer/lyricist - and one which clearly had an eye on the commercial market - hence the subsequent rather unsuccessful Broadway production
Worth noting that Pitch Perfect Musicals and Mercury Musical Developments both get some, albeit limited, funding from Arts Council England and in 2018 James Dacre of Northampton Royal and Derngate announced that the theatre had been given £684,000 over a three year period by Arts Council England to develop new musical theatre specifically for mid-scale venues. He said that the theatre would lead a consortium comprising producing companies China Plate and Improbable and musical theatre development companies Mercury Musical Developments, Musical Theatre Network and Perfect Pitch, as well as Scottish Opera. This funding presumably happened because, as Simon said, they made a case for it and ACE decided it was a worthwhile investment.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jan 23, 2020 7:56:36 GMT
No matter how strong the sentiment about musicals deserving to be better funded - I thought it was a pretty ropey piece of journalism and seemed to be basically a cut and paste from three interviews with very little research or context to back up the claims. Any article which implies that musicals are created by 'songwriters' should certainly be taken with a pitch of salt. OxfordSimon hits the nail on the head - it really is a case of looking at ways of using the 'pots' more effectively. As noted above many theatres do use some of their public subsidy to develop new musicals some of which go on to have a further life whilst others don't. In addition to Jamie, Sheffield Theatres developed and staged Flowers for Mrs Harris and Standing at the Sky's Edge. The Lyric Hammersmith produced Leave To Remain; Birmingham Rep - One Love: the Bob Marley Musical; The Mercury Theatre Colchester - Pieces of String; and Northampton and Ipswich jointly produced The Season. All of these theatres receive funding from Arts Council England, and have chosen to develop these works - none of which are, to quote Rupert Goold, 'obviously commercial'. Indeed Goold could use some of his Almeida pot to stage the work he describes. To date, however, he has only produced one musical during his tenure as Artistic Director, and that was set in New York, based on an American novel with American book writer and composer/lyricist - and one which clearly had an eye on the commercial market - hence the subsequent rather unsuccessful Broadway production Worth noting that Pitch Perfect Musicals and Mercury Musical Developments both get some, albeit limited, funding from Arts Council England and in 2018 James Dacre of Northampton Royal and Derngate announced that the theatre had been given £684,000 over a three year period by Arts Council England to develop new musical theatre specifically for mid-scale venues. He said that the theatre would lead a consortium comprising producing companies China Plate and Improbable and musical theatre development companies Mercury Musical Developments, Musical Theatre Network and Perfect Pitch, as well as Scottish Opera. This funding presumably happened because, as Simon said, they made a case for it and ACE decided it was a worthwhile investment. I had no idea about the information in the last paragraph. Interesting that Scottish Opera are also involved
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Post by MrBraithwaite on Jan 23, 2020 10:35:24 GMT
A lot of the public sector could learn from the Watermill who create wonders on a shoestring. Not every show has to have a huge cast, orchestra and a revolve. Yes NT I'm talking to you! The topic is new musicals here, but if the NT puts on a show like Follies for example I would expect a huge cast, orchestra and a revolve. This is something that they can and should do.
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jan 23, 2020 11:57:57 GMT
Although a book that demands vast resources may limit the revivals it can have?
Sweeney Todd seems to have a found a way around it and it happily sits in pub theatre or humongous barn and most of the Sondheim canon but Follies seems to follow suit
Anyway back to new writing 😉
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on Jan 23, 2020 13:54:19 GMT
All I'm going to say is www.royalandderngate.co.uk/whats-on/beam2020/I went to BEAM 2018 and discovered some fantastic shows, including The Season, which I saw a workshop at the Other Palace and them went to Royal Derngate to see the production. NOTE. The auditorium there was FREEZING; had to wear my coat; considering it was in November...They need to work on that, if they haven't done so already!
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Post by craig on Jan 23, 2020 14:02:26 GMT
Definitely an interesting subject.
I'm yet to see Six (I know... I promise I will see it this year) but I thought Jamie was a good night out and I've been delighted to see how well it has performed commercially. I just think a lot of British musicals that have made it to the West End have been really uninspiring.
Made In Dagenham, for instance, felt like such a cynical attempt to capture British imaginations with a story that has been told a hundred times over. I enjoyed the film but the thought of a musical version turned me off as soon as I heard about it.
I think that has been the problem in the last decade or so... anything that has made it within sniffing distance of the West End has felt focus grouped, derivative and uninspired, designed to appeal to as broad a demographic as possible. Those musicals might strike gold occasionally, but it's rare.
There are a few institutions nurturing new musical talent, but not enough. That's where the mega hits of the future will come from. Writers and producers we least expect it from with shows that pick up a following due to their quality.
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Post by samuelwhiskers on Jan 24, 2020 11:35:54 GMT
Goold has a musical he’s directing in development at the Almeida right now.
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