4,806 posts
|
Post by Mark on Dec 6, 2019 12:15:55 GMT
Interesting article here from the Evening Standard. www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/esmagazine/west-end-shows-are-no-longer-flopping-a4304151.htmlThe figure of up to 20% of unsold tix going through todaytix on the day is a one I can quite easily believe, very easy to keep dripping rush tickets into the system throughout the day to fill the house. I know many on here predicted an early closure for Waitress, but it's had a decent run. Some disappointments in recent years obviously Made in Dagenham and Mrs Henderson Presents only having short runs, but nothing like the "Novello Flops" with a month for Desperately Seeking Susan and two months for Drowsy and Spring Awakening.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2019 13:34:31 GMT
They might not be flopping like they were, but that doesn't mean the West End is in a Golden Age. Far from it.
|
|
|
Post by marob on Dec 6, 2019 15:01:47 GMT
I think we should probably wait a few months to see how & Juliet fares before saying the era of the expensive flop is over. And what happens to Back to the Future after it's try-out run in Manchester. Strange there's still no London announcement yet.
The Man in the White Suit closes early tomorrow, to be replaced by Curtains which is barely selling on its tour and has been reducing tickets on the likes of Todaytix and Whatsonstage for weeks now.
I think there's a wider problem with something like todaytix in that it encourages people not to book in advance, but to wait in the hopes of getting a bargain. Surely it would be better to charge less for a ticket in the first place, and sell more yourself, than to have to reduce through a ticketing agency and have them take a cut. But I'm not a billionaire theatre impresario, so what do I know. 🤷🏻♂️
|
|
|
Post by oxfordsimon on Dec 6, 2019 15:21:03 GMT
Out of town tryouts are a good way to refine a show and build some momentum - so that may well be a trend we see re-emerging with greater frequency going forward.
Producers - unless they have money to burn - will always tend towards the risk averse - and so we are, perhaps, seeing safer options more often that we may have done in the past.
It is hard to know exactly what is going on. The touring market is seen a number of very significant failures over the past few years. Regional audiences don't like being taken for fools with hackneyed revivals returning time after time after time. Nor do they want to see chamber shows being forced into 1000+ seater venues.
Perhaps it will settle in a couple of years - but we are in a state of flux at the moment.
|
|
|
Post by londonpostie on Dec 6, 2019 15:37:36 GMT
Great tool for tourists.
|
|
2,702 posts
|
Post by viserys on Dec 6, 2019 18:30:53 GMT
I think the article compares apples and oranges. Most of the short-lived flops in recent years were original British shows that arrived in the West End without much of a previous tryout if any. They might have done better with extended tryouts out of town and build more stamina. Nobody speaks of shows like The Grinning Man or Romantics Anonymous as flops because they did limited runs in smaller venues while stuff like Made in Dagenham (which I loved and would have liked to see do better) struggled to fill the Adelphi. If anything, I think, producers have learned to not head straight into the West End, but first try to build buzz elsewhere (like Bat, Juliet and BTTF all do in Manchester and Jamie did in Sheffield) or opt for smaller theatres and limited runs.
Currently almost all musicals that sell decently are US-imports that were worked on and refined before they were even sent to Broadway and then come over with the Broadway pedigree and often music that is already well-known such as Hamilton, DEH and Waitress. The flops don't make it across the pond (King Kong anyone?). Exceptions are Jamie and Six, although I'm sure Six benefits very much from its tiny fringe venue - I doubt it would put 1000 bums on seats nightly and I'm really curious to see how it will fare on Broadway at Broadway prices.
That said, I'm sure that things like TodayTix and Dynamic Pricing play a role, too, but on the other hand we used to have other options like the Half Price Booth in Leicester Square which is now TKTS and where only few shows are offered with really good discounts.
|
|
7,189 posts
|
Post by Jon on Dec 6, 2019 19:22:29 GMT
Jamie recouping after two years is good although it does suggest that it had small losses in the first few months, I suspect the stunt casting has helped sales somewhat.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2019 20:57:15 GMT
Jamie recouping after two years is good although it does suggest that it had small losses in the first few months, I suspect the stunt casting has helped sales somewhat. Cheap as chips to run, I am sure so I'm not surprised. It hardly ever discounted. Stunt casting. Small theatre. From a business point of view, it was obvious. Drag queens are all the rage right now. However, it's a shame that such a rubbish show is taking up a West End house.
|
|
5,062 posts
|
Post by Phantom of London on Dec 7, 2019 0:31:54 GMT
In fairness a flop:is a show that doesn’t return its investment.
I would say that Aladdin may have recouped, but Disney expected it to run longer. Waitress - coins in the air if that is going to recoup, but the producers again expected this to run longer. Young Frankenstein, Strictly Ballroom and Memphis closed earlier than expected and flopped.
But whilst shows are no longer flopping, maybe because the pound is weak, so more tourists are taking advantage. Also theatres are taking smaller houses than they used to do.
|
|
3,578 posts
|
Post by Rory on Dec 7, 2019 11:33:18 GMT
In terms of plays there is no doubt that the landscape in the West End has changed for the better. There are fewer dusty old Kenwright style Shaftesbury Avenue revivals now (although I did enjoy many of those). Instead we generally have the pick of the bunch critically and commercially from the subsidised sectors. It is very rare now to see a play post early closing notices (Foxfinder and The Man in the White Suit are the only recent examples I can readily think of) whereas a decade or two ago, stuff was regularly closing early. Also, theatres are only dark now when they are being refurbished, whereas I remember in Summer 2008 for example, loads of theatres were closed for months for no real reason. Now if a theatre is dark for even a couple of weeks, something slots in (The Life I Lead with Miles Jupp, The Girl on the Train). It is really dynamic and I think Sonia Friedman is largely responsible for this.
|
|
7,189 posts
|
Post by Jon on Dec 7, 2019 12:30:23 GMT
Ignore
|
|
19,793 posts
|
Post by BurlyBeaR on Dec 7, 2019 12:31:20 GMT
Is there a reason why this was merged with the Whatsonstage fraud case Sorry, that was me sorting out a members problem earlier and making a mess of it! Separated out again now.
|
|
4,156 posts
|
Post by kathryn on Dec 7, 2019 17:38:45 GMT
Is it really true that shows are no longer flopping? Or is it just that with the reduction in arts/theatre specialists in the media the flops are only being noticed if they are very high profile?
I can think of shows in recent years that have papered extensively and closed early - and I’m hardly the biggest musical theatre geek on the board. The likes of Strictly Ballroom can’t have recouped.
|
|