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Post by inthenose on May 3, 2022 14:45:41 GMT
Hmmm. It looks a little bit silly. At least they are passionate about doing the right thing, but they could do with a few names turning up really. Naturally, they won't - he's still one of the biggest employers in the industry after all.
Where are all the actors who were spitting feathers? So much for solidarity...
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Post by marob on May 3, 2022 14:59:56 GMT
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Post by stagebyte on May 3, 2022 15:01:37 GMT
‘No Cinderella cast members were in attendance’
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Post by isabel on May 3, 2022 15:04:55 GMT
Funny how all the Cast members have gone silent …
Sadly I’m not sure what good that protest with a small amount of people would have done
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Post by danb on May 3, 2022 15:07:39 GMT
They are still employees so no doubt bound by the contracts that they work by (for however long). Given that some are already on warnings for their prior conduct I’m gonna say that it won’t be attended by the cast.
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Post by stagebyte on May 3, 2022 15:11:11 GMT
They are still employees so no doubt bound by the contracts that they work by (for however long). Given that some are already on warnings for their prior conduct I’m gonna say that it won’t be attended by the cast. Is this confirmed about the warnings? I just find it interesting how they are so vocal on social media yet when it really boils down to it no one was willing to step up. It’s been extremely quiet today especially from one who can’t usually wait to jump on a cause.
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Post by inthenose on May 3, 2022 15:14:13 GMT
They are still employees so no doubt bound by the contracts that they work by (for however long). Given that some are already on warnings for their prior conduct I’m gonna say that it won’t be attended by the cast. Is this confirmed about the warnings? I just find it interesting how they are so vocal on social media yet when it really boils down to it no one was willing to step up. It’s been extremely quiet today especially from one who can’t usually wait to jump on a cause. I can confirm it, yes. But I'm afraid that's the best you'll get until this has closed and someone breaks ranks.
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Post by mitch on May 3, 2022 16:00:42 GMT
I'm not sure if I'm missing the point with this, but surely if you strip all the noise out of this the only real issue here is that the news leaked before the cast and crew could be formally notified?
As it is, all of those currently employed will have far more notice than the majority of people working on a show that gets its notice (which is more often than not only 2 weeks) -- and while it's regrettable from the perspective of the people due to join the new cast, they will have all signed up to a 2 week notice period as a matter of course too (so all of the talk of having made decisions based on the assumption of a year's employment are a bit hyberbolic -- or massively ill-considered, depending on how you look at it).
I did see one of the cast (incorrectly) suggesting that on Broadway actors get 2 months notice and advocating for that to happen here: Just to be clear, if it did theatre would virtually shutdown overnight. There are very, very few producers who have pockets deep enough to prop up 2 months of a loss-making show -- and even fewer investors who would be prepared to accept that sort of liability.
I'm not saying that this hasn't been dealt with very clumsily -- because it has -- but I can't help think that a lot of people are getting a bit carried away.
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Post by musicbox on May 3, 2022 16:10:30 GMT
I work very close to the Gillian Lynne, so went to see the protest during a break today at around 20 to 3 and sadly the turnout wasn’t great, I’d say there was about 15 people including myself.
I applaud the protestors, but I agree with those saying better planning is needed for this kind of thing.
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Post by BurlyBeaR on May 3, 2022 16:15:08 GMT
I'm not sure if I'm missing the point with this, but surely if you strip all the noise out of this the only real issue here is that the news leaked before the cast and crew could be formally notified? As it is, all of those currently employed will have far more notice than the majority of people working on a show that gets its notice (which is more often than not only 2 weeks) -- and while it's regrettable from the perspective of the people due to join the new cast, they will have all signed up to a 2 week notice period as a matter of course too (so all of the talk of having made decisions based on the assumption of a year's employment are a bit hyberbolic -- or massively ill-considered, depending on how you look at it). I did see one of the cast (incorrectly) suggesting that on Broadway actors get 2 months notice and advocating for that to happen here: Just to be clear, if it did theatre would virtually shutdown overnight. There are very, very few producers who have pockets deep enough to prop up 2 months of a loss-making show -- and even fewer investors who would be prepared to accept that sort of liability. I'm not saying that this hasn't been dealt with very clumsily -- because it has -- but I can't help think that a lot of people are getting a bit carried away. One producer who does have deep enough pockets… ALW! And he’s been propping this up to the tune of £100k per week since it opened apparently. So any other show would have closed months ago leaving the current cast unemployed/uncertain about futures etc etc. One could spin this to make ALW look like a hero for keeping them employed and paid while the ship was literally sinking.
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Post by inthenose on May 3, 2022 16:19:32 GMT
I'm not sure if I'm missing the point with this, but surely if you strip all the noise out of this the only real issue here is that the news leaked before the cast and crew could be formally notified? As it is, all of those currently employed will have far more notice than the majority of people working on a show that gets its notice (which is more often than not only 2 weeks) -- and while it's regrettable from the perspective of the people due to join the new cast, they will have all signed up to a 2 week notice period as a matter of course too (so all of the talk of having made decisions based on the assumption of a year's employment are a bit hyberbolic -- or massively ill-considered, depending on how you look at it). I did see one of the cast (incorrectly) suggesting that on Broadway actors get 2 months notice and advocating for that to happen here: Just to be clear, if it did theatre would virtually shutdown overnight. There are very, very few producers who have pockets deep enough to prop up 2 months of a loss-making show -- and even fewer investors who would be prepared to accept that sort of liability. I'm not saying that this hasn't been dealt with very clumsily -- because it has -- but I can't help think that a lot of people are getting a bit carried away. One producer who does have deep enough pockets… ALW! And he’s been propping this up to the tune of £100k per week since it opened apparently. So in any other show it would have closed months ago leaving the current cast unemployed/uncertain about futures etc etc. One could spin this to make ALW look like a hero for keeping them employed and paid while the ship was literally sinking. One could do that, but that would be ignoring his conduct over at Phantom and his history of treating "the little people" shoddily over the decades in numerous shows. Not everything in the business will be clear sailing and sunny skies, this show has been an unmitigated disaster for instance, but it absolutely is not the first time as has been discussed extensively on the other thread.
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Post by mitch on May 3, 2022 16:20:27 GMT
That's kind of what I was driving at BurlyBeaR. It's a very difficult situation, but I do think it's important to not lose sight of the fact that most producers in this situation would have thrown up the shutters a long, long time ago. Unconditionally demonising him seems very myopic and doesn't do enough to engage with the vicissitudes of producing large scale theatre, particularly in the current climate. It's easy to tell someone else how they should burn their cash...
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Post by marob on May 3, 2022 16:38:44 GMT
It’s not a difficult situation, it’s very simple: don’t issue a press release until you’ve notified everyone that you’re firing them. It’s been made difficult by how badly it’s been handled.
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Post by mitch on May 3, 2022 16:48:56 GMT
It’s not a difficult situation, it’s very simple: You don’t issue a press release until you’ve notified everyone they’re losing their jobs. It’s been made difficult by how badly it’s been handled. But from what I understand the press release was issued in response to the fact that the story had broken before the formal notification to cast and crew. Obviously it's not ideal, but given the various different channels through which these things have to be managed -- including the multiple ticketing agencies -- it's not 'very simple' at all.
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Post by Peter on May 3, 2022 16:56:05 GMT
It was slightly complicated by the fact it appears the press release was issued earlier than planned (I imagine PR people and RUG executives don’t want to work the bank holiday weekend if they can help it!) and with twice as many people (current cast + new cast) needing to be contacted on very short notice, it appears more as incompetence than outright disregard… But I am making several wild guesses in there
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Post by danb on May 3, 2022 17:01:28 GMT
If you want to do it properly, you do it properly. If you don’t really care you let it slip out and accidentally spill elsewhere. End of.
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Post by mitch on May 3, 2022 17:09:10 GMT
If you want to do it properly, you do it properly. If you don’t really care you let it slip out and accidentally spill elsewhere. End of. Okay, but it's hardly the egregious crime that it is being made out to be. As I say, the current cast and crew are still getting more notice than most people in their position -- and while it is unfortunate for the incoming cast, whether they hear by press release or their agent doesn't make any material difference to the underlying reality. I'm not saying any of it is ideal, but the wave of opprobrium feels a bit much -- particularly if it is the case that the show has been propped up since it first opened.
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Post by Jon on May 3, 2022 17:18:27 GMT
I'm not sure if I'm missing the point with this, but surely if you strip all the noise out of this the only real issue here is that the news leaked before the cast and crew could be formally notified? As it is, all of those currently employed will have far more notice than the majority of people working on a show that gets its notice (which is more often than not only 2 weeks) -- and while it's regrettable from the perspective of the people due to join the new cast, they will have all signed up to a 2 week notice period as a matter of course too (so all of the talk of having made decisions based on the assumption of a year's employment are a bit hyberbolic -- or massively ill-considered, depending on how you look at it). I did see one of the cast (incorrectly) suggesting that on Broadway actors get 2 months notice and advocating for that to happen here: Just to be clear, if it did theatre would virtually shutdown overnight. There are very, very few producers who have pockets deep enough to prop up 2 months of a loss-making show -- and even fewer investors who would be prepared to accept that sort of liability. I'm not saying that this hasn't been dealt with very clumsily -- because it has -- but I can't help think that a lot of people are getting a bit carried away. Broadway shows can have very little notice of closure so whoever suggested Broadway shows get two months notice is talking a load of crap. Some shows do get a long closing notice but it's rare. Aladdin for example was 11 months but most long closures are between 4-6 months.
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Post by musicbox on May 3, 2022 17:37:55 GMT
I just seen on TV that this fiasco has now made it to the mainstream news - it was featured on the ITV evening news tonight, you can see the report on their homepage: www.itv.com/news/londonThis is getting very messy!
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Post by anthony on May 3, 2022 17:38:34 GMT
It’s not a difficult situation, it’s very simple: You don’t issue a press release until you’ve notified everyone they’re losing their jobs. It’s been made difficult by how badly it’s been handled. But from what I understand the press release was issued in response to the fact that the story had broken before the formal notification to cast and crew. Obviously it's not ideal, but given the various different channels through which these things have to be managed -- including the multiple ticketing agencies -- it's not 'very simple' at all. Exactly this. Is it heart breaking for the new cast? Yes. Is it misfortunate how it was handled? Of course. However, once context has been applied, it really, really isn't as bad as it initially seemed. It certainly isn't anywhere close to being as insidious as some theatre "influencers" are making out, either.
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Post by Jon on May 3, 2022 17:40:05 GMT
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Post by inthenose on May 3, 2022 17:40:13 GMT
It’s not a difficult situation, it’s very simple: You don’t issue a press release until you’ve notified everyone they’re losing their jobs. It’s been made difficult by how badly it’s been handled. But from what I understand the press release was issued in response to the fact that the story had broken before the formal notification to cast and crew. Obviously it's not ideal, but given the various different channels through which these things have to be managed -- including the multiple ticketing agencies -- it's not 'very simple' at all. The story had broken because box office staff noticed tickets had been taken off sale, because he'd decided to cancel the show. The story wouldn't have broken if they hadn't already made the decision and put the exit plan into action.
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Post by musicbox on May 3, 2022 17:42:12 GMT
This report was from ITV London, but I also seen it on the National lunchtime news today (That's how I found out about the protest).
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Post by inthenose on May 3, 2022 17:53:15 GMT
This report was from ITV London, but I also seen it on the National lunchtime news today (That's how I found out about the protest). And as I said earlier, yesterday it was the number one on the most read articles on BBC news. This has definitely had "impressions" as they say in the social media/advertising world.
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Post by musicbox on May 3, 2022 17:58:44 GMT
This report was from ITV London, but I also seen it on the National lunchtime news today (That's how I found out about the protest). And as I said earlier, yesterday it was the number one on the most read articles on BBC news. This has definitely had "impressions" as they say in the social media/advertising world. Yeah it definitely has! Without going into too much about my life, I also work in this industry and sadly this kind of thing is an every day scenario, but I'm glad that's being reported on as it's just not ok! The amount of times I've had jobs taken in seconds via an email, text message, short phone call or even notice board is horrendous, but if you work in this industry it's sadly normal and you eventually gain a tough skin. Just a few months ago I was in a position where I lost two jobs in a matter of months and had to borrow money from my parents for basic bills and food, which is demoralising for someone in their 20s. I'm really lucky to have a full time contract at the moment, but it's not the norm. Unfortunately creative professionals are often seen as not having a 'proper' job by the masses, like what we do is just fun and not hard work - Just look at some of the top Daily Mail comments if you want proof of that! My heart goes out to everyone involved as it's horrendous and really knocks your confidence, but it's also something you have to prepare for if you want to continue in this profession.
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