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Post by BVM on Jun 29, 2023 10:34:31 GMT
You know, this is a moment when I wish the West End did what Broadway does, i.e. publishing the figures weekly - because I would love to know how this pricing strategy is working for them. As it is, we have no idea, and we never will, and there's just so many moving parts in a show in the West End, most especially what deal is done between ATG and Avalon - maybe it's a vastly different deal from most other productions? Who knows? All we have is speculation, really. I do think, regardless of how I personally feel about £90 for a seat in the back row of the Upper Circle on a Saturday, that's it's a very different way to price theatre/a musical, and that merits study. They are certainly interesting. I followed them for the last year or two as was reading BWW generally due to a couple of NYC trips that I had some undecided show slots for. Interesting though they are though, I think they create a pretty unpleasant environment and am actually pleased on balance we don't have them here. Certainly for struggling shows there is HUGE amounts of gleeful carping in an "OMG this is doing SO badly" manner which is pretty gross. I also wonder if it can become a self fulfilling prophecy for struggling shows where people see how badly they are doing, assume it's rubbish, and choose not to go. There is most definitely the haves and the have nots on Broadway. The ongoing juggernauts bring in vast amounts and out of every 5 or so new shows, one takes off and 4 disappear very quickly (with aforementioned glee). It's sad to watch their grosses diminish week on week until they die. So yeah, I think it can be better not to know. Back to Operation Mincemeat - playing devil's advocate again. - People are talking about pricing - no such thing as bad publicity? - They've successfully filled the hard to fill Mon/Tues/Weds shows - early week for fans, end of week for tourists? - The theatre is TINY. So blanket pricing is really not as wild as it would be for the Palladium. - It's a different way of doing things. Things change, you gotta try new things. If it's a failure, well they've learnt, it won't be done again. - ALL successful shows pretty much whack prices up. Personally I find Six massively overpriced for a one act show with a cast of 6, band of 4 and no set automation. - Much as I dislike them - ATG are very savvy with pricing (I know people have said it's producer driven but all pricing is agreed between theatre and producer). If the weekend prices later in the run don't sell, they will come down. They respond more quickly and agressively to demand than other theatres I would say. - Theatre, as ever is a business. The outrage will be limited to communities like this which make up a tiny proportion of ticket buyers. Anyway, I don't actually have strong feelings on this - just thinking of some counterarguments. |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jun 29, 2023 12:10:23 GMT
To counter your points
- I would argue there is such thing as bad publicity when it's 'the show is amazing' vs 'the show is expensive', especially because it's not like it's making headlines, it's most that its reputation amongst theatregoers is being damaged
- There are fans of the show who don't live in London and cannot see shows mid-week. Pricing them out of weekends means pricing them out entirely. Just seems wrong to me.
- As tiny as the theatre is, it is obscene to charge £90 for the back row of the upper circle, especially when you're charging exactly the same for premium views in the stalls. It's just not comparable.
- If this is a failure, it also means Operation Mincemeat on the West End becomes a failure and it does not deserve to be a guinea pig for a bad idea like this.
- While everyone expected a price hike, this is to the extreme. You used to be able to see Six for £6, now it's £19.50 at the cheapest. An increase, sure, but £19.50 is still accessible. £40 and only for one day a week is not.
I have no comments on ATG being 'savvy with pricing' because personally I feel like this pricing strategy is elitist (ironic for a show poking fun at 'English public school boys'), unethical, and has the potential to risk the future of one of the best shows the West End currently has. Pretty much the opposite of savvy.
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Post by partytentdown on Jun 29, 2023 17:52:29 GMT
From what I've heard, the show is breaking even whatever happens to the top level, so if they sell those seats for £89 and people are willing to pay that much, that's great for them. But similarly they can use that level for £25 lottery seats and it doesn't impact much on the overall wrap. If you've won the lottery on this show you'll notice that most of those seats are in the upper circle on Friday and Saturday.
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Jun 30, 2023 3:41:23 GMT
Whats unethical about it? Tickets are available from £20 on a monday and Tuesday. If you can't get there on those days, thats not the productions problem. Go on a Tuesday matinee. If you want to see it that much, book the day off to see it, or wait for the tour to come to a theatre near you. I would argue there is such thing as bad publicity when it's 'the show is amazing' vs 'the show is expensive', especially because it's not like it's making headlines, it's most that its reputation amongst theatregoers is being damaged The show attracts more people than just your theatre mates. There are posters everywhee saying how many 5* reviews it's had, it's run has been extended numerous times, nothing about it is a flop or failure. I think it is very savvy to charge less on the days that are typically quiet and more on the days it is busy. |
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Post by westendfan1 on Jun 30, 2023 8:46:09 GMT
Whats unethical about it? Tickets are available from £20 on a monday and Tuesday. Where can you get a £20 ticket? |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jun 30, 2023 9:44:27 GMT
Only £20 tickets available are standing, which are not bookable very long in advance (so not helpful for people needing to arrange travel and, as you suggest, potentially time off work). Also inaccessible to people who cannot stand for upwards of 2 hours.
All aspects of the pricing strategy - starting at £40; starting weekends at £90; pricing every seat in the theatre at the same price - are unethical. I am far from the only one who thinks so.
Also - what tour? There is no tour.
I'm glad it has the 5 stars reviews. It more than deserves them. But one look at the ticket website shows how much people are not inclined to book at ridiculously high prices. Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out. They're risking the future of the show, imo, and it is such a shame because it is truly excellent.
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Post by Rory on Jun 30, 2023 10:01:13 GMT
Only £20 tickets available are standing, which are not bookable very long in advance (so not helpful for people needing to arrange travel and, as you suggest, potentially time of work). Also inaccessible to people who cannot stand for upwards of 2 hours. All aspects of the pricing strategy - starting at £40; starting weekends at £90; pricing every seat in the theatre at the same price - are unethical. I am far from the only one who thinks so. Also - what tour? There is no tour. I'm glad it has the 5 stars reviews. It more than deserves them. But one look at the ticket website shows how much people are not inclined to book at ridiculously high prices. Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out. They're risking the future of the show, imo, and it is such a shame because it is truly excellent. Well said! |
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Post by Jon on Jun 30, 2023 10:45:36 GMT
Only £20 tickets available are standing, which are not bookable very long in advance (so not helpful for people needing to arrange travel and, as you suggest, potentially time of work). Also inaccessible to people who cannot stand for upwards of 2 hours. All aspects of the pricing strategy - starting at £40; starting weekends at £90; pricing every seat in the theatre at the same price - are unethical. I am far from the only one who thinks so. Also - what tour? There is no tour. I'm glad it has the 5 stars reviews. It more than deserves them. But one look at the ticket website shows how much people are not inclined to book at ridiculously high prices. Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out. They're risking the future of the show, imo, and it is such a shame because it is truly excellent. OM's pricing is many things but unethical is not one of them. I wonder what pricing would people be happy with it? The show does need to recoup and make profit in order to have a good run so charging Monday pricing all week is simply not realistic. |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jun 30, 2023 11:00:32 GMT
Only £20 tickets available are standing, which are not bookable very long in advance (so not helpful for people needing to arrange travel and, as you suggest, potentially time of work). Also inaccessible to people who cannot stand for upwards of 2 hours. All aspects of the pricing strategy - starting at £40; starting weekends at £90; pricing every seat in the theatre at the same price - are unethical. I am far from the only one who thinks so. Also - what tour? There is no tour. I'm glad it has the 5 stars reviews. It more than deserves them. But one look at the ticket website shows how much people are not inclined to book at ridiculously high prices. Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out. They're risking the future of the show, imo, and it is such a shame because it is truly excellent. OM's pricing is many things but unethical is not one of them. I wonder what pricing would people be happy with it? The show does need to recoup and make profit in order to have a good run so charging Monday pricing all week is simply not realistic. No one has ever said they should charge Monday prices all week. People would be happy with the standard pricing structure modelled by literally every other west end show - charge less for your upper circle/restricted view seats and more for your stalls/best view seats. That is all anyone has ever asked for. It is really not a difficult solution at all, seeing as every other show seems to be able to manage it. |
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Post by lynette on Jun 30, 2023 22:58:30 GMT
I saw this just now. Why start at 8? Should have started at 7.30, ended at just after 10, before the cafes all shut. Anyway, I liked it. All the performances were good. What is this thing with a couple of them about being untrained as if this were something heroic? Not going to win them any prizes amongst the fraternity I shouldn’t think. Sets good for small venue, lighting good as behoves a real pro and direction good. A slight lull in the tension beginning of second half. The heart searching songs from the female characters. Might have liked a bit of soul searching with Montague ? Will this go on to be a classic? I’m not sure. If I can read up on Hamilton then the US audiences can research this but not sure it will carry that far. Or am I already proved wrong. Anyone know?
I went with the OH who hated it. So not just for the oldies then 😂
re the pricing thing above- I paid the full Monty of £89, second row at the side ( need to stretch legs ) and I don’t begrudge it them. But I haven’t been to this theatre before cos never seen WinB so please could they put some of the profits into a new toilets for the gals, maybe rejig the men’s, take out the urinals and put in stalls so both sides can be for everyone.
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Post by ncbears on Jun 30, 2023 23:07:54 GMT
We were there tonite - row E 12-13 - as we booked a while ago. Thought show was a lot of fun and brilliant in parts. No empty seats in stalls. I dont know if seats were discounted or people paid full price. Sounds like we saved some money off current ticket prices.
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Post by Matt on Jul 1, 2023 8:21:42 GMT
We were there tonite - row E 12-13 - as we booked a while ago. Thought show was a lot of fun and brilliant in parts. No empty seats in stalls. I dont know if seats were discounted or people paid full price. Sounds like we saved some money off current ticket prices. There are no discounts apart from a fortnightly £25 lottery which only gets you the crap seats at the moment. |
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Post by bobbievanhusen on Jul 1, 2023 19:49:09 GMT
Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out So their pricing strategy is working then? Because apparently Mondays are inconvenient and not a typical night out, yet it's the busiest day. Exactly what days are more convenient for you, if Mondays aren't? |
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Post by jennifer on Jul 2, 2023 8:31:14 GMT
Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out So their pricing strategy is working then? Because apparently Mondays are inconvenient and not a typical night out, yet it's the busiest day. Exactly what days are more convenient for you, if Mondays aren't?
Saturdays, obviously. The day when all the tickets are absolutely top price. But going on a weekday means taking 2 days off work and paying to stay over somewhere, so it's too expensive either way.
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Post by mrbarnaby on Jul 2, 2023 11:12:14 GMT
How can they charge the same price for a stalls seat and an upper circle seat? What the hell?
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Post by fiyero on Jul 2, 2023 11:43:29 GMT
How can they charge the same price for a stalls seat and an upper circle seat? What the hell? Is this worse than my local theatre keeping the traditionally cheap balcony off sale and only adding it in when other sections are full, whacking dynamic pricing on too so the balcony is top price!? Some would say it is fairer that people who don’t know to book early for the bargains aren’t being penalised with the one price system at least. |
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Post by fiyero on Jul 2, 2023 14:01:24 GMT
Is this worse than my local theatre keeping the traditionally cheap balcony off sale and only adding it in when other sections are full, whacking dynamic pricing on too so the balcony is top price!? Some would say it is fairer that people who don’t know to book early for the bargains aren’t being penalised with the one price system at least. Normally when theatres choose to close a level (eg Balcony)they offer the same price on a lower level (eg Upper Circle).Is this not still the case? Mine seem not to put it on sale, but have a few bottom priced seats elsewhere. Great if you get in early! They only put balcony on if other levels are sold and in recent times they put it on at top price. Best part of £50 for Joseph from the balcony?!? |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jul 3, 2023 9:14:42 GMT
Mondays are the best selling day because it is cheaper, despite it being inconvenient for a lot of people and not a typical night out So their pricing strategy is working then? Because apparently Mondays are inconvenient and not a typical night out, yet it's the busiest day. Exactly what days are more convenient for you, if Mondays aren't? No, their pricing strategy isn't working because ONLY Mondays are selling that well. Weekends, when there are vastly more people available to attend shows, are selling far more poorly, which indicates how reticent people are to book a new show at such a high price - especially when you're paying the same amount for the worst seats in the house that other people paid for the best. I'm really not sure how else to explain this. |
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Post by BVM on Jul 3, 2023 9:57:02 GMT
So their pricing strategy is working then? Because apparently Mondays are inconvenient and not a typical night out, yet it's the busiest day. Exactly what days are more convenient for you, if Mondays aren't? No, their pricing strategy isn't working because ONLY Mondays are selling that well. Weekends, when there are vastly more people available to attend shows, are selling far more poorly, which indicates how reticent people are to book a new show at such a high price - especially when you're paying the same amount for the worst seats in the house that other people paid for the best. I'm really not sure how else to explain this. I guess we don't really know yet. Hasn't been a problem so far. This Friday and Saturday look as if they are going to sell out. They don't need to sell all the tickets until the performance starts. I guess time will tell re weekends in the future.... Selling the cheapest tickets quickly and first to the deal hunters is not uncommon. Look at the Cabaret upper circle for it's first year. |
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Post by fiyerorocher on Jul 3, 2023 10:22:32 GMT
A lot of the worst seats on weekends are sold at £25 in the lottery - this weekend was sold in last week's lottery. They're not selling out the theatre at £80. It would just be nice to see them acknowledge that and put in a more sensible pricing structure from the start to avoid the excellence of the show being overshadowed by a poor pricing strategy.
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Post by Dawnstar on Jul 3, 2023 11:30:13 GMT
I've finally managed to get a ticket for tomorrow's matinee. I would have preferred either this evening or tomorrow evening but having been checking the website for returned for weeks I had to take what popped up. It's not ideal when you want to see an understudy who's due to be on all week but you can only afford the ticket prices for 2 of the 6 days!
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j85
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Post by j85 on Jul 5, 2023 9:01:55 GMT
I really enjoyed the show. I went in completely blind (I only knew it was set in WW2, had a cast of 5 and what I’d read on here) which is unlike me as I normally like to listen to it etc beforehand, but I’m glad I didn’t as it made the more emotional moments like Dear Bill more punchy. I can understand why people might go back a couple of times to catch the moments you may have missed as it’s so non stop, but not sure I’d want to go back loads of times.
The theatre itself is a nightmare though - I was in the upper circle on an aisle seat and I’m so glad I was on the aisle to give my legs somewhere to go as the leg space is so minimal I’m surprised I don’t have dents in my legs from the chair in front of me. If you’re going to have no leg room, at least make the backs of chairs soft (and the general chair comfy)! The whole theatre is cramped and on the way down an elderly lady I was behind was almost taken down by the ladies toilet door that swung out and caught her in the side. The scream she gave was dreadful and the woman opening the door didn’t give a care to the world. But anyway, I enjoyed the show.
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Post by alessia on Jul 5, 2023 10:10:12 GMT
I was there last night - had a nightmare journey on the tube and then the rain so not in my best mood. I had heard so much about the show on this forum and elsewhere that maybe I was expecting something exceptional, which I did not think this is (caveat- I don't usually do musicals). The first 10-15 minutes I was considering leaving at the interval as that kind of humour is really not my cup of tea but then it grew on me and I'm very glad I stayed til the end. In general I was mildly amused for the duration, unlike some of the audience who were proper belly laughing. The Nazi song and the sailors song were very good, and I found myself in tears at the Dear Bill song, which for me was the best thing of the whole show. I do admire the energy and talent of the five performers, they were great. Ultimately for me this was very good/entertaining but it confirmed that I am definitely not a musical theatre person.
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Post by darreno on Jul 7, 2023 22:25:24 GMT
Saw this tonight after so many recommendations and I am so glad I did! Absolutely loved it. I think the thread has probably covered everything I could possibly have said but if anyone is reading this and thinking about it - JUST DO IT.
Bonus fact: I visited the grave marker of the man who never was a few years ago in Spain.
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Post by Stephen on Jul 8, 2023 23:27:27 GMT
Any merch on sale for this? A poster perhaps?
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