1,970 posts
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Post by sf on Oct 5, 2018 16:17:37 GMT
There's nothing wrong in essence with making a musical to broadly appeal, but I didn't find that there was anything there specific to social anxiety which is what we're told Evan is going through. I've had social anxiety my entire life and not one lyric or sentence spoke to me or that side of me. This is unlike the specificity of shows like Next to Normal that I found aptly portrayed depression (something I have been through) or a show like Fun Home which portrayed something I haven't been through (being closeted). In both cases, it didn't matter whether I'd been through it or not because they were able to portray specific devastating circumstances in a way that made me feel for the characters. I'm not gonna feel for someone who feels down and alone, because to be honest, that's just life, and I saw very little that made it feel specifically like social anxiety. So his lies and wrong actions were even less forgivable for me. I haven't seen it, but that's more or less exactly what I get from the lyrics/synopsis. The overall impression is of a misguided story that, whatever the show's creators thought they were writing, uses depression and social anxiety as a get-out-of-jail-free card to allow their central character to behave incredibly badly without facing any consequences for it. I don't find the premise uplifting; I'm not at all fond of the types of criticism that ascribe deficiencies in a text to personality faults in the author(s), but this particular plot pushes some buttons for me (I was a very socially awkward teenager myself, and was diagnosed with and treated for depression at that point in my life as well). NONE of it rings true, and I'm afraid I can't shake the impression that anybody who could invent that plot and try to pass it off as "uplifting" or inspirational or in any way positive pretty much has to be a truly disgusting, utterly narcissistic excuse for a human being.
...which means I probably won't be buying a ticket. I find the music attractive - but as I said, this material pushes some buttons for me, and not in a good way.
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Post by Rory on Oct 5, 2018 16:20:39 GMT
It’s official, 2019 is my favourite already. Whilst there are moral questions surrounding the storyline of DEH it was easily one of the best things I’ve ever seen. Exciting to hear that the cast is to be British, I’d love Rebecca Lock for Heidi Hansen pretty please. Ever since I saw her in Heathers this year I thought she’d be perfect. Keeping everything crossed that the Fun Home rumour is true too. What’s the Fun Home rumour? That it may be transferring to the Garrick as per tweets by Baz and Mark Shenton. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 16:24:09 GMT
I haven't seen it, but that's more or less exactly what I get from the lyrics/synopsis. The overall impression is of a misguided story that, whatever the show's creators thought they were writing, uses depression and social anxiety as a get-out-of-jail-free card to allow their central character to behave incredibly badly without facing any consequences for it. I don't find the premise uplifting; I'm not at all fond of the types of criticism that ascribe deficiencies in a text to personality faults in the author(s), but this particular plot pushes some buttons for me (I was a very socially awkward teenager myself, and was diagnosed with and treated for depression at that point in my life as well), and I'm afraid I can't shake the impression that anybody who could invent that plot and try to pass it off as "uplifting" or inspirational or in any way positive pretty much has to be a truly disgusting, utterly narcissistic excuse for a human being.
...which means I probably won't be buying a ticket. I find the music attractive - but as I said, this material pushes some buttons for me, and not in a good way.
The whole premise of the show is based on real events the writers (Pasek & Paul) experienced at High School. Whilst obviously there's some creative licence been taken in the development of the story, the plot for DEH is not merely 'invented'. For me what makes the show poignant and ultimately uplifting, is not the premise of an American teen lying his way through a complex social situation, it's the overall message delivered rather than the events that trigger the message. |
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1,970 posts
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Post by sf on Oct 5, 2018 16:28:08 GMT
The whole premise of the show is based on real events the writers (Pasek & Paul) experienced at High School. Whilst obviously there's some creative licence been taken in the development of the story, the plot for DEH is not merely 'invented'. In which case, that actually makes it worse. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 16:28:15 GMT
What’s the Fun Home rumour? That it may be transferring to the Garrick as per tweets by Baz and Mark Shenton. You’ve really cheered me up! I’m mostly avoiding Twitter since the Kavanaugh hearing and I am behind on Theatreboard reading. Thanks for replying. |
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Post by 49thand8th on Oct 5, 2018 16:33:43 GMT
See here:
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:19:19 GMT
After Hamilton, I found this show to be a backwards step for musical theatre. Compared to something else like Fun Home, it’s all so generic, bland and not in control of its message and tone. I put it well behind Spring Awakening or even Heathers, for example. It never took off with my students, of the type who helped to make Hamilton into a phenomenon, either.
Above anything, I find it cynical and manipulative.
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19,735 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 5, 2018 17:37:40 GMT
Still can’t believe Hope Mill’s Spring Awakening hasn’t found a transfer.
DEH is one of those that doesn’t immediately appeal but I feel I should see because you lot have built it up so much. That Waving Through a Window song just sounds like a horrible noise to me.
Having said that Fun Home didn’t immediately appeal either and I loved that so...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:38:10 GMT
On the surface, yes Evan’s actions appear immoral. However he is a boy who shares very similar thoughts and battles as Connor does. The way he behaves is a result of his empathy and as a result projects his personal thoughts onto Connor’s family as a means of dealing with his insecurities and guilt. Whilst lying to a grieving family isn’t moral by any stretch, he does so as a result of his own personal difficulties and to provide comfort to Connor’s parents who believed their son was unlikeable. Whether you interpret the story as terrible or not completely depends on your outlook, and for me, it wasn’t an issue as this all is very clear in the show. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:42:09 GMT
Ooo I wonder who could play Connor? I think that role is massively underrated (he says of the Tony-nominated role), but I think that is such an interesting character! Maybe my favourite in the show.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:48:12 GMT
Ooo I wonder who could play Connor? I think that role is massively underrated (he says of the Tony-nominated role), but I think that is such an interesting character! Maybe my favourite in the show. I’d like to see Louis Maskell’s take on the role, personally. He’s not the most obvious choice but I’ve been obsessed since the grinning man. Failing that Jamie Muscato would probably make an excellent job of the role. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:49:39 GMT
Ooo I wonder who could play Connor? I think that role is massively underrated (he says of the Tony-nominated role), but I think that is such an interesting character! Maybe my favourite in the show. I’d like to see Louis Maskell’s take on the role, personally. He’s not the most obvious choice but I’ve been obsessed since the grinning man. Failing that Jamie Muscato would probably make an excellent job of the role. Ooo Jamie Muscato is a shout! I wonder if he'd do it considering he is a low-key leading man now? |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 17:53:15 GMT
Scratch that - Matt Seadon-Young would make me very happy in this, I can imagine he’d make an excellent Connor.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 18:47:43 GMT
This would be the cast for me:
Evan: Luke Bayer
Heidi: Savannah Stevenson
Zoe: Laura Pick
Cynthia: Unsure. Maybe Steph Parry?
Larry: Steven Pinder
Connor: Jamie Muscato
Alana: Eva Noblezada
Jared: Unsure.
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19,735 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 5, 2018 19:08:22 GMT
Sorry but that video of Luke Bayer posted upthread is absolutely terrible in my personal opinion.
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Post by 49thand8th on Oct 5, 2018 19:18:56 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 19:21:30 GMT
My dearest, Evan Hansen, with a comma after dearest. You've written my dearest, Evan Hansen.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 19:26:53 GMT
On the surface, yes Evan’s actions appear immoral. However he is a boy who shares very similar thoughts and battles as Connor does. The way he behaves is a result of his empathy and as a result projects his personal thoughts onto Connor’s family as a means of dealing with his insecurities and guilt. Whilst lying to a grieving family isn’t moral by any stretch, he does so as a result of his own personal difficulties and to provide comfort to Connor’s parents who believed their son was unlikeable. Whether you interpret the story as terrible or not completely depends on your outlook, and for me, it wasn’t an issue as this all is very clear in the show. +1. Similar to the way the staging of Hope in Groundhog Day split some people between finding it appropriate and not so much - with its vivid depiction of suicide. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 19:50:30 GMT
I don't think Harry Francis would be a good fit for this in my honest opinion.
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Post by No. on Oct 5, 2018 21:55:26 GMT
In the light of all the support for Luke Bayer today, a certain fellow cast member of his is being a taaad shady (presumably towards the entire situation??) and I really don’t know how to feel about it
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Post by Seriously on Oct 5, 2018 21:57:35 GMT
Does Evan need to be white?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 21:59:43 GMT
In the light of all the support for Luke Bayer today, a certain fellow cast member of his is being a taaad shady (presumably towards the entire situation??) and I really don’t know how to feel about it The comments about performers auditioning on twitter these days? I saw that, I too don't know how I feel about his comment personally. On the topic of that though, Andy Coxon has joined the ranks of tweeting a video of him singing Waving Through the Window. |
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Post by No. on Oct 5, 2018 22:07:05 GMT
Does Evan need to be white? Not at all, we never see his dad so he could be mixed race, or depending on the casting of Heidi he could be any race at all. Not an impact on the plot whatsoever |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 22:08:04 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2018 22:09:26 GMT
I think the bad thing about Lukes co-stars comments is someone has commented saying about "so called professionals begging for work" online, and said co-star replying that its how to not show the kids how its done. It's unconfortable because of course he his commenting on Luke and they share the stage nightly!
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