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Post by MrsCondomine on Mar 22, 2019 12:36:15 GMT
You: Sara Bareilles Them: Uh? You: Not gonna write you a love song Them: Aha oh yeah that was my myspace profile song Still "Uh?" from me, and CBATG. IRONICALLY I needed to Google 'CBATG,' which has given me a laugh! |
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Post by showtoones on Mar 22, 2019 12:39:22 GMT
Waitress is a mediocre show at best and the Adelphi is the wrong theater point blank. When a show on the strand doesn’t work, everyone suffers because there are empty seats, the cast doesn’t feel the love, and it’s not good for anybody. Joseph is already proved that it can fill the Adelphi. I think a transfer in September or October through the holidays would be the right idea and perfect for Joseph. A lot of people can’t get to London in the summer, but, over the festive holiday it’s packed in London.
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Post by sagiirl on Mar 22, 2019 14:52:00 GMT
Still "Uh?" from me, and CBATG. IRONICALLY I needed to Google 'CBATG,' which has given me a laugh! Ironically I did as well. 😂 |
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Post by TallPaul on Mar 22, 2019 14:56:04 GMT
Me too, ironically!
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Post by latefortheoverture on Mar 22, 2019 16:03:17 GMT
I think this has come around via a mixture of things;
- The theatre is far too large, even if it was to be a great success over here it would've been unsustainable in the long run. The producers should've gone with a smaller theatre without a shadow of a doubt. It does fit well in the Adelphi but it's not a 'large' show, so I imagine it fits ok anywhere.
- The prices are nearly Broadway prices, there's not a single discount flying around either. So the show is either doing well and we just don't know it or its running just over breaking even every week. Shows can still survive on reasonable discounts, am I right in saying that?
- Opening at the start of February, past Olivier catchment as well, was a terrible choice IMO. London is quiet and is only now just picking up punters, I imagine passing trade in February compared to say the six weeks or other popular holidays is a different ball game! It may be able to start raking people in from tickets sold on the day as it's starts getting more crowded towards late spring.
- There has been hardly any PR for this. A few tube posters and sending emails weekly from Ticket vendors aren't going to rake in the public. People on theatre ticket vendor's mailing lists are more than likely to already know about the show, and possibly even seen it. They need to get more advertisements out and about, get people talking. I've said before that if this show is sold well on a prime time TV show it could provide a much-needed boost. Ant + Dec's Saturday Night Takeaway starts again soon, as does BGT. Both shows have millions watching, a 4-minute performance would do the sales a world of good. Letting people film the curtain call is hardly genius either! I'd argue to say it's one of the worst marketed shows I've come across lately.
- While KMP is a great Jenna, she isn't a name here in the slightest. I'd imagine she's also being paid 'name' money. I wouldn't be one bit surprised if someone is thrown in to help boost sales; maybe not as Jenna, as a bad Jenna would turn this show into a car crash. Maybe someone for Ogie or Dr P. Beverley Knight as Becky? I love the cast but it wouldn't surprise me if someone is replaced for a name in the near future.
Let me know of any other factors you feel contributed to its current situation.
I love the show and think it more than deserves a place in the WE, it's a shame it struggling to move the seats atm. Would it be able to sustain at say 75/80% capacity, with a few discounted? (asking for those that would know the answer to these type of questions?)
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Post by kathryn on Mar 22, 2019 16:32:51 GMT
You: Sara Bareilles Them: Uh? You: Not gonna write you a love song Them: Aha oh yeah that was my myspace profile song Still "Uh?" from me, and CBATG. Yeah, I have no idea who she is either. |
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Post by kathryn on Mar 22, 2019 17:54:48 GMT
Well, box office just sold me H12 in the dress for £39.50, which seemed reasonable enough as I was using theatre tokens. Apparently reduced from top price, though I assume she meant the normal top price of £72.50 and not the crazy premium top price.
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Post by latefortheoverture on Mar 22, 2019 18:07:02 GMT
^^^ THIS ^^^
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Post by andrew on Mar 22, 2019 18:14:57 GMT
Can people stop assuming that they know what it's best for theatres financially when they don't? Maybe just consider that the way that things work in this industry (like any other) are not always 1+1=2. There are tons of different professions around theatre regarding ticket sales etc, and things are always updated, because it's such a complicated matter. Also, comparing theatre to a farm park is the most hilarious thing that I've recently seen, although true in some cases.
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Post by shady23 on Mar 22, 2019 18:34:12 GMT
There is also nothing worse than being the person who has paid full price when someone else is bragging about the bargain they got from Groupon or elsewhere.
Even if you love the show there's the underlying feeling that you have been ripped off.
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Post by sirdaniel on Mar 22, 2019 18:45:00 GMT
I think this has come around via a mixture of things; They need to get more advertisements out and about, get people talking. I've said before that if this show is sold well on a prime time TV show it could provide a much-needed boost. Ant + Dec's Saturday Night Takeaway starts again soon, as does BGT. Both shows have millions watching, a 4-minute performance would do the sales a world of good. Takeaway isn’t on this year and sadly, this show is far too niche for mainstream ITV. |
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Post by shady23 on Mar 22, 2019 18:48:19 GMT
Loose Women would lap up a performance of "she used to be mine".
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Post by danb on Mar 22, 2019 20:06:50 GMT
The fact it doesn't apply to theatre aside, that farm park thing is horribly simplistic. Short term, it would work - provided it brings in full-paying new customers. Long-term, you get the situation the £10 holiday park newspaper deals are in. The full price customers stay away, standards slip, even the £10 lot stop staying and you go bust. Unlike a tourist attraction, a show can't cut more than the odd actor (if it's a big chorus to start with) or lose any backstage team. They are also tied to the management costs and health and safety rules etc. They also don't have the "asset" of land and buildings to borrow against. It's a cash turnover industry, with investors they can tap but that's it. Still, a really interesting intellectual exercise for a Friday evening. Not forgetting that we, as punters, would rather keep prices down as much as possible, share all the ins & outs and ways to get the best seats for the smallest amount. Regular theatregoers with internet savvy are their worst nightmare really. Roger & Margaret that want to see something from good stalls seats will always pay whatever because thats how much it costs these days. “It has got someone out of the Smash adverts in it though.” |
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Post by latefortheoverture on Mar 22, 2019 21:27:31 GMT
I think this has come around via a mixture of things; They need to get more advertisements out and about, get people talking. I've said before that if this show is sold well on a prime time TV show it could provide a much-needed boost. Ant + Dec's Saturday Night Takeaway starts again soon, as does BGT. Both shows have millions watching, a 4-minute performance would do the sales a world of good. Takeaway isn’t on this year and sadly, this show is far too niche for mainstream ITV. I'd argue that this show has quite a wide appeal. Whilst some may find it ditzy or whatever, it definitely has the chick-flick appeal IMO. It's not a great big glitzy jukebox musical but it is a great show, which most people would enjoy. |
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Post by anthem on Mar 22, 2019 21:57:15 GMT
Waitress is a mediocre show at best and the Adelphi is the wrong theater point blank. When a show on the strand doesn’t work, everyone suffers because there are empty seats, the cast doesn’t feel the love, and it’s not good for anybody. Joseph is already proved that it can fill the Adelphi. I think a transfer in September or October through the holidays would be the right idea and perfect for Joseph. A lot of people can’t get to London in the summer, but, over the festive holiday it’s packed in London. To be fair, this is completely subjective. For a 'mediocre' show, it has been very well received by critics. Joseph is a classic but it's also been done to death and I would much rather see Waitress continue in the Adelphi rather than see Joseph there. If the show is struggling, then it's not because of quality or a lack thereof (at least in my view). |
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Post by sirdaniel on Mar 22, 2019 22:13:39 GMT
Takeaway isn’t on this year and sadly, this show is far too niche for mainstream ITV. I'd argue that this show has quite a wide appeal. Whilst some may find it ditzy or whatever, it definitely has the chick-flick appeal IMO. It's not a great big glitzy jukebox musical but it is a great show, which most people would enjoy. People could love it but ITV primetime won’t really take anything that isn’t mainstream or widely known, or doesn’t have a ‘star’ known to their audiences (which this doesn’t). It’s a shame because I’d love to see more musicals on telly. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2019 22:44:07 GMT
If the cast of Six can get onto This Morning and perform, there's absolutely no reason why Waitress can't!
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Post by sirdaniel on Mar 22, 2019 22:58:07 GMT
If the cast of Six can get onto This Morning and perform, there's absolutely no reason why Waitress can't! You’re right, but This Morning is very different to Takeaway or BGT. Would love to see them on it. |
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Post by kathryn on Mar 22, 2019 23:07:36 GMT
Well, the audience around me tonight lapped it up.
I wasn’t so keen - the overdone comedy characters didn’t land for me and I found Jenna frustratingly passive.
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Post by showtoones on Mar 23, 2019 4:58:53 GMT
Waitress is a mediocre show at best and the Adelphi is the wrong theater point blank. When a show on the strand doesn’t work, everyone suffers because there are empty seats, the cast doesn’t feel the love, and it’s not good for anybody. Joseph is already proved that it can fill the Adelphi. I think a transfer in September or October through the holidays would be the right idea and perfect for Joseph. A lot of people can’t get to London in the summer, but, over the festive holiday it’s packed in London. To be fair, this is completely subjective. For a 'mediocre' show, it has been very well received by critics. Joseph is a classic but it's also been done to death and I would much rather see Waitress continue in the Adelphi rather than see Joseph there. If the show is struggling, then it's not because of quality or a lack thereof (at least in my view). Of course my opinion being that the show was mediocre is my point of view and of course that’s subjective. But it’s my truth, or at least the way I feel. That’s what I thought this message board was… Our opinions. While some people love Waitress other people do not and that’s ok. My point is I’d rather see Joseph there. Waitress got good notices in ny and in the west end. Some shows get good reviews, even win awards and don’t run. Bands Visit won ten Tony’s in ny and I was bored to tears and it’s closing after a little over a year running. It’s a business and people need to attend for a show to run. As a member of this board, I value your opinion. I value everyone’s opinion… I may not agree with it, but I appreciate it. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2019 9:16:59 GMT
Can people stop assuming that they know what it's best for theatres financially when they don't? Maybe just consider that the way that things work in this industry (like any other) are not always 1+1=2. I was upfront in my post in saying I have no idea of the finance involved in staging a West End transfer; but that doesn't stop me from thinking that the producers have messed up something with the pricing, in terms of what they're expecting (if indeed they are expecting a full theatre at this stage) and what they're offering the public. Maybe their mistake was choosing this theatre, where they have to charge these prices to cover costs, I don't know; but I do think it's the price that is putting people off going (both among regular theatre goers and passing trade).
I know it's a very complex matter (and I agree that Groupon is definitely not the way to go), but they are already closing full sections of the theatre less than two weeks after officially opening (and there are already rumours of a replacement show at the Adelphi), so people are bound to put forward their theories as to why this has happened and what could be done to turn it around.
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Post by bengal73 on Mar 23, 2019 10:22:00 GMT
I admit of not seen this yet. I enjoyed the cast recording but not enough to prioritise booking it. It's nice enough though feels a bit bland. I'm rapidly losing interest in fitting it in partly because of the advance booking prices and partly the lack of dayseat/rush options
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Post by juicy_but_terribly_drab on Mar 23, 2019 12:17:26 GMT
I admit of not seen this yet. I enjoyed the cast recording but not enough to prioritise booking it. It's nice enough though feels a bit bland. I'm rapidly losing interest in fitting it in partly because of the advance booking prices and partly the lack of dayseat/rush options I actually really love the cast recording and thoroughly enjoyed the film but I've refrained from booking because of prices, timing and casting. I was going to wait until after the three month period in the hopes of discounts and a cast change but now it seems that it might not make it much further than its first three months and I'm a little worried that neither of my hopes will come true. It just seems like they haven't handled anything very well which is disappointing but I can't claim to know better than the producers who presumably know what they're doing, but so far it doesn't seem like it. |
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Post by gmoneyoutlaw on Mar 23, 2019 12:55:32 GMT
Waitress has been running on Broadway at a mid-size theatre. It's a smallish musical with a predominately female following. I had heard from an expert that the demographically, women from say their mid-twenties to 49 are the focus of all the Broadway producers. I don't know or care as I'm not in the gender or range. But for a show to be successful at "those prices" you have to hit that target.
Side note, Be More Chill on Broadway has a teen demographic, that's obvious. I went a few weeks ago and sat in a premium seat priced at $225 that I purchased for $69 (plus fees) from a reseller on Stubhub. Teens can't afford a $225 ticket and neither can their mothers - who are in the hit show demographic - for a sustained period of time to make the show profitable. In this experience, there were two mothers in front of me with their 15 year old daughters. How wonderful, the moms were introducing their children to the theatre and they would share the experience together. That was not the case. As we approached the door the mom's left. I asked them where they were going and they said dinner and drinks. "See you after the show!"
As for Waitress, the women are taking their girlfriends to this one and leaving the men at home. I expect the same was happening at Kinky Boots, but that show had more appeal as it's based on a British film.
I also agree that it's in the wrong theatre and should have taken a smaller venue. I didn't realize that the Adelphi was so large until I sat in the Balcony for the final performance of Kinky Boots. Waitress is not a massive production and would have fit nicely into the Savoy.
If you're sitting in the balcony at the Adelphi can you smell the pie?
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Post by esteveyb on Mar 23, 2019 14:52:53 GMT
From speaking to a friend who works at the Adelphi, presales and bulk bookings were enough to make them extend till October in the first place, but the anticipation is that it will close then and be a limited engagement, there's no talk of a tour or extension.
I love the show and saw it three times on Broadway, no one will ever touch Sara as Jenna for me, and Jason Mraz as Dr P was a highlight too. I get the Ogie 'creepiness' that feels more prevalent in the West End, but the idea is that he is so unthreatening, he's described as a 'dwarf' in the book, geeky, who has never done anything like this before but who sees something in Dawn - and her friends can sense that from her description that they are kindred spirits so push her into it. In the film, he's far, far more creepy and socially awkward and I am not really sure what Adrienne was trying to say with his character - so the musical has developed the character a lot. He's almost the opposite of Earl in many ways - Earl is a complete and utter bastard, whereas Ogie's misguided creepiness almost seems romantic and endearing so you root for him more. However, let's not pretend that all of the men in Waitress aren't problematic to an extent - and maybe that is part of the point - none of the characters are perfect. Ogie stalks Dawn, which is off-putting, but he's a genuinely nice guy who has fallen deeply in love with her after chatting and a 5 minute date; Joe is a sexist pig, but sees how Jenna has been downtrodden and leaves her the diner; Becky is cheating on her disabled husband with her boss; that very boss, Cal, is cheating on his wife who he believes is a lesbian; Jenna is downtrodden but decides to have the baby of a man she doesn't love; Dr. Pommater is cheating on his wife with a patient. Maybe part of the charm is that all these people are intrinsically flawed and yet you find yourself rooting for them - the tagline 'Everyone deserves a slice of happiness' is quite appropriate.
Waitress has a huge heart and when the Adelphi is full, as it has been on the times I've been to see it (I went opening night, first night of previews and have been once a week midweek with different friends since it opened), it is electric. I've seen Katharine get a standing ovation mid-show after She Used To Be Mine on multiple occasions.
If ticket sales aren't strong, I don't get why they aren't doing more dynamic pricing - the cheapest seats, right at the back and far sides of the upper circle, which were crawling with mice when Kinky Boots was ending, are £19.50 during the week and £25 during the weekend. There's no TodayTix lottery or rush sales, TKTS are charging more than the box office. I was able to secure second to front row for Kinky Boots during its initial opening for £50; Waitress has no front row lottery, so it's row AA and it seems to be a minimum of £69.50.
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