951 posts
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Post by vdcni on Jun 20, 2018 18:25:53 GMT
The law hasn’t changed. Exactly the same law was in place under Obama when the Democrats had majorities in both houses and they did precisely nothing about it. Children were separated from their parents at the border under Obama using exactly the same facilities and no-one posted a thing about it here. If you are suggesting Trump personally should tell them to ignore this law you’d better be ready for him to ignore a bunch of other laws too. Congress created the problem and needs to fix it. Of course a large majority of children being held at the border were sent there alone by their parents, often with strangers, in the hope they’d be allowed to stay and later bring their families - this is a harder problem to solve. No I'm sorry that's a lie. The Obama administration did some dubious things on immigration but there was no policy to separate families. Yes they took unaccompanied minors into custody or sometimes did separate children out when there were questions about custody or whether trafficking was involved but that was only a short term thing until the questions were resolved. This move by Trump is a policy change and was even announced as such back in May. |
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376 posts
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Post by sherriebythesea on Jun 20, 2018 18:41:13 GMT
The law hasn’t changed. Exactly the same law was in place under Obama when the Democrats had majorities in both houses and they did precisely nothing about it. Children were separated from their parents at the border under Obama using exactly the same facilities and no-one posted a thing about it here. If you are suggesting Trump personally should tell them to ignore this law you’d better be ready for him to ignore a bunch of other laws too. Congress created the problem and needs to fix it. Of course a large majority of children being held at the border were sent there alone by their parents, often with strangers, in the hope they’d be allowed to stay and later bring their families - this is a harder problem to solve. A Trump and Fox News LIE. Edit to add: Do you really think that if that had happened the conservative news groups wouldn't have been all over it??? |
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 20, 2018 19:14:48 GMT
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376 posts
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Post by sherriebythesea on Jun 20, 2018 19:37:53 GMT
Drump just signed Executive Order saying families will be kept together but that Zero Tolerance still is active. Nothing about how this is going to be accomplished. And so much for him saying he couldn't do anything about it.
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 20, 2018 19:47:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 19:52:43 GMT
I keep seeing reports that no one knows what happens to the young girls (someone does), which is something which needs to be addressed urgently along with the whole mess. Video below; in the dead of night in NY a reporter tracked what has turned out to be some of the young girls. Mayor De Blasio has now confirmed that 239 are there and that he had no idea his city was being used for this. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 20:41:01 GMT
Trump is clearly a megalomaniac who needs to be stopped but I'm way more concerned by the number two (in so many ways). Mike Pence disturbs me more than I can say. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Trump is being used as a means to grab power by Pence via the back door without going through an election.
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376 posts
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Post by sherriebythesea on Jun 20, 2018 21:01:46 GMT
Trump is clearly a megalomaniac who needs to be stopped but I'm way more concerned by the number two (in so many ways). Mike Pence disturbs me more than I can say. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Trump is being used as a means to grab power by Pence via the back door without going through an election. That is the only reason I hope Trump will serve his one term. Pence would be so much more dangerous to individual liberties, separation of church and state, and womens rights |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 21:09:54 GMT
Trump is clearly a megalomaniac who needs to be stopped but I'm way more concerned by the number two (in so many ways). Mike Pence disturbs me more than I can say. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Trump is being used as a means to grab power by Pence via the back door without going through an election. That is the only reason I hope Trump will serve his one term. Pence would be so much more dangerous to individual liberties, separation of church and state, and womens rights Not to mention LGBTQ+ peoples rights. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 21:41:22 GMT
Agreed re: Pence. The only saving grace of Trump hanging on long enough to be booted out in an election is that we then won’t be faced by the more terrifying alternative: an actual politician with these terrifying agendas.
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 20, 2018 21:52:41 GMT
For any American members (or lurkers), it'll still help to call or write your senators regarding Feinstein's Keep Families Together Act. If they support it, thank them. If they don't, urge them to. Voicemails count! Just be sure to leave your zip code. 5calls.org/issue/keep-families-together-act |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 22:26:07 GMT
Apparently according to some Hillary Clinton is the greatest President the US never had. We'll soon find out who will be putting up against Trump in 2020.
Of course this all dates back to Presidents only being able to serve two terms otherwise things may have been different.
I've never really found out where the US parties stand compared to say Labour Party and the Tories. People have said the Democrats are Right Wing and the Republicans further right wing.
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3,321 posts
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Post by david on Jun 20, 2018 23:13:38 GMT
After the shocking images we have all seen coming out of the U.S., it makes me wonder what kind of country Trump will leave behind once he leaves the White House. In less than 2yrs he has managed to oversee the removal of the US from international environmental agreements, trying to ban transgender people from the military, Cut funding for HIV/AIDS research and causing trade wars with nearly everybody as well as run a government where people don’t last 5 minutes in a job before getting fired.
As @ryan has said, while Trump is dangerous, I do agree that having Pence would pose a far more dangerous President. I just hope that the Democrats can sort themselves out and produce a candidate that can remove these idiots from the WH. I really do think the next person in the Oval Office will have a massive job in trying to repair all the damage that Trump and his idiots have caused both at home and on the global stage. Hopefully the US voters will get rid of him at the next election.
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904 posts
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Post by lonlad on Jun 20, 2018 23:14:37 GMT
>> People have said the Democrats are Right Wing and the Republicans further right wing.
What a bizarre way of putting it. I guess if you're comparing it to Socialism then, yes, but hard to imagine the Dems being thought of as "right wing" ....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 23:22:35 GMT
>> People have said the Democrats are Right Wing and the Republicans further right wing. What a bizarre way of putting it. I guess if you're comparing it to Socialism then, yes, but hard to imagine the Dems being thought of as "right wing" .... Bernie "Colonel" Sanders was probably the nearest the US had to a genuine socialist alternative. The US is probably a more right wing country generally than the UK or even England on it's own. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2018 23:34:45 GMT
Drump just signed Executive Order saying families will be kept together but that Zero Tolerance still is active. Nothing about how this is going to be accomplished. And so much for him saying he couldn't do anything about it. The EO is, apparently, a further problem. It calls for children to be detained with parents but another law says that children cannot be detained for more than twenty days, so, in a few weeks time, the same thing will happen as children are taken away again. Watch for Trump to start blaming judges for this. |
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5,062 posts
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Post by Phantom of London on Jun 21, 2018 5:10:58 GMT
This is just further proof - that I cannot think of anyone who is intellectually and emotionally unfit to be president than Trump.
Big shout out for James Corden who on his show, took time out to speak out about this.
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3,057 posts
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Post by ali973 on Jun 21, 2018 6:45:02 GMT
You know, I've been watching this and pretty surprised at people's reaction. Everyone's clutching their pearls over the US's behavior towards mainly brown families and their children. If this is about brutalizing children and separating them from their families, I don't see this kind of anger towards the way police have been treating black children for decades. And then I read something that Laura Bush said about how this is inhumane. May I remind her of her husband's war crimes? Abu Ghraib prison?
Trump is an animal, a racist and everything that is said about him is right, yes this is awful, this is disgusting, but it's not out of character at all. When news headlines say "this isn't us", I have to disagree.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2018 7:50:45 GMT
Drump just signed Executive Order saying families will be kept together but that Zero Tolerance still is active. Nothing about how this is going to be accomplished. And so much for him saying he couldn't do anything about it. The EO is, apparently, a further problem. It calls for children to be detained with parents but another law says that children cannot be detained for more than twenty days, so, in a few weeks time, the same thing will happen as children are taken away again. Watch for Trump to start blaming judges for this. And it also does nothing to even attempt to reunite any of the families that have already been separated. Yet another example of Trump trying to look like he has an ounce of humanity when he's actually doing something that makes it patently obvious that he has none whatsoever. The argument that this has happened before/under previous governments so why get angry now disgusts me. As it turns out, that line of information just isn't true, but even if it were, it doesn't make it right. People are entitled to and should stand up and demand that injustices are corrected whenever they become aware of them, not just let things lie. I cannot believe anyone with any decency would advocate keeping a policy that keeps innocent people separated from their loved ones and in cages just because they dared to exercise their right to seek asylum to escape a bad situation elsewhere. Supporting that shows an utter lack of compassion and tolerance and a clear inability to think rationally. Of course everyone is entitled to their own views on immigration, and to their own views on how stringent immigration policy should be, but any such policy has to be humane, no matter what level of stringency you feel should be applied. That's a basic and inalienable human right, and to attempt to justify breaching it based on a false argument that it's nothing new is in my opinion abhorrent and contrary to the basic requirement of each of us as humans to demonstrate humanity towards others. |
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 21, 2018 14:06:26 GMT
Trump is an animal, a racist and everything that is said about him is right, yes this is awful, this is disgusting, but it's not out of character at all. When news headlines say "this isn't us", I have to disagree. |
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 21, 2018 19:03:34 GMT
So this is fun.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2018 19:41:04 GMT
What. The. f***. Thats beyond belief. Lets try counteract that.  |
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2,041 posts
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Post by 49thand8th on Jun 21, 2018 19:51:46 GMT
I'm not really a fan of this Time cover. We don't know who the little girl is, who her parents are, or where she is, but she's being used on the cover of Time in a photo manip. It's just in bad taste.
(Disclosure: I used to be graphic designer at a weekly tabloid [but not the trashy kind (usually)].)
EDITED to add
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5,707 posts
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Post by lynette on Jun 22, 2018 9:38:59 GMT
The photographer was on twitter saying how he got the photos. I’m sorry j can’t remember his name but I think he said he was 'following' a group. The mum had been asked to remove the little girl's shoe laces. Of course dreadful that this tot's distress is made public for the rest of her life though if she has been separated then this will get her to her mum faster I should hope. This photo is in the tradition of using children to drive home a message. Think of the Vietnam photo of the little girl running naked down the road after a napalm attack. This galvanised a generation. And the poor toddler dead on the beach. It goes all the way back. Remember the boy caught holding up his hands in the Warsaw ghetto? I think here making a 'page', a front cover in fact, is a bit different. It isn’t the photo, it is a piece using the photo. What that means for copyright etc I don’t know.
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