|
Post by Deleted on May 3, 2017 9:27:46 GMT
Yes 100% agree with that- we had next to no music education in our school, and being in a fairly deprived area as a whole very few students had external music tuition. I remember there being musicals put on before my time in school but in my 5 years in High School nothing. As a result I can't really read music and have no technical knowledge so despite being fairly 'musical' in that I can sing well (by ear) my actual musical knowledge stalled at around 10 years old. And not coming from a 'musical' or 'arty' home there was no drive to push it outside school even if we could have afforded it (we couldn't)
So without the very basic training we're left with a very limited pool to draw on. And many of those who do pursue music are still pushed the 'classical' route because that's still seen as superior.
|
|
1,103 posts
|
Post by mallardo on May 3, 2017 10:04:45 GMT
Interesting. When I was in high school in Toronto we had quite a lot of music in the classroom plus a school orchestra, a jazz band (I played tenor sax and clarinet), a marching band, a choir and recitals from the more accomplished students. This was just a regular city school. I'm pretty sure that much of my taste in music was developed there. Plus, I think it's a given now that music education improves the overall learning ability of students. Listening IS learning.
It was my impression that US schools did even more in that regard - witness some of the amazing high school musical productions on YouTube - although recently that sort of thing has come under fire from the Right Wing who have no interest in educating the masses beyond basic job skills.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 3, 2017 10:14:36 GMT
Yup from my Canadian and American friends it seems that (at least in the past) music in both classroom and extra-curricular is more a part of life- and the money put into things like bands and musicals is evident from just those youtube clips. In the UK your musical set in the 80s and 90s would have been made of cardboard and poster paint!
One of our music teachers went sick about a month into Year 9 and we basically had no music classes that year. As a result we also didn't have the option for a GCSE in music in my school.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 3, 2017 16:50:33 GMT
People are pretty overweight in this country, maybe everybody's fingers are too chubby to play the piano? Which would explain why Gary Barlow has taken over Ah yes, because everyone's so incredibly skinny in America.
|
|
4,631 posts
|
Post by Phantom of London on May 3, 2017 20:02:45 GMT
However in the UK could argue that politics are always meddling with the curriculum and have unrelenting standards.
I am not sure in North America if you also have to do Languages (French and Spanish ((4/5 year option)), Religious Studies (A Waste of Time) and History (4/5 year option)?
On top of;
Maths English Games Physical Education Personal Development Science (4/5 year option) Further Science (4/5 year option) Geography (4/5 year option) Sociology (3rd year, the 4/5 year option) Technical Drawing (4/5 year option) Home Economics (4/5 year option) Craft, Design and Technology (4/5 year option) Art (4/5 year option) Music (4/5 year option) Drama Personal Development (4/5 year option)
|
|
131 posts
|
Post by primitivewallflower on May 4, 2017 13:53:18 GMT
However in the UK could argue that politics are always meddling with the curriculum and have unrelenting standards. I am not sure in North America if you also have to do Languages (French and Spanish ((4/5 year option)), Religious Studies (A Waste of Time) and History (4/5 year option)? On top of; Maths English Games Physical Education Personal Development Science (4/5 year option) Further Science (4/5 year option) Geography (4/5 year option) Sociology (3rd year, the 4/5 year option) Technical Drawing (4/5 year option) Home Economics (4/5 year option) Craft, Design and Technology (4/5 year option) Art (4/5 year option) Music (4/5 year option) Drama Personal Development (4/5 year option) The irony of all this is that Americans have a deep inferiority complex about the arts in their education curriculum (the film Mr. Holland's Opus captures this). I have little doubt that the average American just assumes that the UK *must* have better arts programs in their schools. Grass is always greener, etc. But I'm not sure that, in reality, things are significantly better or worse in the US. It varies by state and region of course, but I think it's fair to say that a typical middle-class state-run suburban high school in the US will in all likelihood have a marching band and/or an orchestra, and a drama program that may do a play prior to Christmas and then a musical right before summer. Lacking these options isn't unheard of, particularly in the past or in rural or poorer areas today, but close to cities their absence would probably raise eyebrows among parents nowadays. Larger high schools in and around major cities may have further options, e.g. a dance troupe or a Shakespeare company. Quality varies widely, as you'd expect. Medium-to-large cities may have one or two schools particularly well-known for their drama programs, and the others will be... well, passable, but not extraordinary. Some US cities now also have magnet (specialist) state-run schools devoted to the arts, and they tend to be quite good (Lin-Manuel Miranda for example went to magnet state-run high school in New York, though it didn't specialize in the arts per se, it was for smart kids generally). The actual education component varies even more widely than the actual programs or activities. The US doesn't have a national curriculum and even most US states don't have a state-wide curriculum; it varies regionally. Some schools offer an array of formal classes that students can take in tandem with their arts activities. Other schools don't offer much in the way of classes but may give students equivalent credit for the time they spend participating in each arts program. Furthermore, some schools *require* a certain amount of arts-related credit, others do not. The other dynamic to keep in mind here that's driving parental demand for these programs is university. US secondary education has become increasingly tailored toward making students competitive for university admissions. This should not be *over* emphasized since the bulk of Americans go to state-run colleges or universities where admissions is minimally competitive. But in the US any state-funded or private university that is at least mildly competitive tends to take a holistic view of applicants: looking not just at standardized testing and academic achievement but also activities. This desire to have kids with a bit of balance fuels some of the demand for, and participation in, US arts programs. All of this is to say: while there are definitely individual US secondary schools that are stellar at drama, it's not something I'd expect to be significantly better *in the education system as a whole* than the UK.
|
|
4,631 posts
|
Post by Phantom of London on May 4, 2017 23:34:03 GMT
Okay brilliant answer.
Out of interest would you guys have to do languages, Religious Studies or History?
Why I ask the U.S. doesn't have near neighbours that speak languages and the U.S. Being the biggest country in the world, would expect other countries to speak their language.
History, we spent forever learning about the British monarchy, which America doesn't have.
Religious Studies, not sure if you would teach this, I always assume religion in America is about personal choice.
|
|
2,706 posts
|
Post by Cardinal Pirelli on May 5, 2017 0:05:22 GMT
What on earth is 'Drama personal development', or is that supposed to be two separate subjects?
I was involved in a tour around Illinois/Wisconsin schools some twenty years ago and the theatres in some (though not all) schools were astonishing, serving as the local theatre as well. Double tiered auditoriums, stage sizes that wouldn't be out of place in a medium size West End theatre etc.
|
|
28 posts
|
Post by forb4 on May 5, 2017 1:06:59 GMT
Okay brilliant answer. Out of interest would you guys have to do languages, Religious Studies or History? Why I ask the U.S. doesn't have near neighbours that speak languages and the U.S. Being the biggest country in the world, would expect other countries to speak their language. History, we spent forever learning about the British monarchy, which America doesn't have. Religious Studies, not sure if you would teach this, I always assume religion in America is about personal choice. Talking from my high school experience: Everyone was required to take 2 years of a foreign language but you can take up to 4 years if you wanted. Our choices were between Spanish, French, Japanese, ASL, and German. History, we also spent ages on the British monarchy. Sophomore year was World History, Junior was American History, and Senior year was Goverment and Econ. European history was an elective. No religious studies (that was incorporated in History) but I came from a highly Mormon area so those kids could take Seminary.
|
|
131 posts
|
Post by primitivewallflower on May 5, 2017 2:17:14 GMT
Okay brilliant answer. Out of interest would you guys have to do languages, Religious Studies or History? Why I ask the U.S. doesn't have near neighbours that speak languages and the U.S. Being the biggest country in the world, would expect other countries to speak their language. History, we spent forever learning about the British monarchy, which America doesn't have. Religious Studies, not sure if you would teach this, I always assume religion in America is about personal choice. Languages are a standard requirement in American high schools, but the years required vary from one to all four years. In general, language education in the US is focused on vocabulary and rules of grammar rather than conversation; in other words, highly frustrating and impractical. Spanish is a bit easier for students to immerse themselves in thanks to the relatively-large US Spanish-speaking population, but it's not like Europe where you can take a train, cross borders, and easily be in a different language area the same day. As a student taking French in California, the only way I had to practice was to watch French films (might have been easier had I lived in Louisiana or northern New England where there actually are native French speakers). My high schools were both Catholic so we had religious classes all four years. I think that would be highly unusual in US state-run schools due to the First Amendment but I have heard of schools offering classes with a more anthropological rather than theological study of religion. History is standard and generally three to four years. Instruction is highly influenced by the Advanced Placement (AP) exams, which are subject-specific baccalaureate exams that often give college credit to students who score highly enough. A typical high school curriculum might be World History in year 1, European History in year 2, and American History in year 3 (all of which have AP exams associated with them), with other social science classes like government or economics in year 4. World History in US schools is quick and doesn't really do justice to anyone, particularly Africa or Asia, but the Roman Empire and the UK are probably the least-poorly covered, though even then we're talking only a rough understanding of broad arcs of history. We Americans would be in big trouble if we had a gun to our heads to explain, say, the Wars of the Roses. We mercifully don't have a string of dynastic successions to memorize. Forty-five presidents under a single written Constitution over the last 230 years with no coups makes American History, if not "simple", then relatively straight-forward. Probably the most conceptually complex part is understanding the legal and philosophical underpinnings of the American Revolution (the political writings of people like Locke, Rousseau, Madison, and, well, Hamilton (natch)). But I don't think any episode in our history can match the English Civil Wars or the French Revolution for sheer complexity.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on May 5, 2017 14:08:55 GMT
We did stop off at Tudors'n'Stuarts when I was a kid, and I believe there might be a pirate module now?
|
|