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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 9:25:26 GMT
I'm completely with you love... Elphaba in Wicked, Effie in Dreamgirls, Eva in Evita; it is practically inhumane to expect someone to be able to perform these roles every week, 8 times a week for a year, as full-out as the original scores are written. ali973 I do apologise for your quote going weird for some reason. I had to delete most of it just to keep the sentence I was reffering too and now the whole thing dissapeared. But you get my point haha. Because god forbid you accidently have a long quote on this board, we must alert the Church Elders!  |
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Post by JJShaw on Mar 6, 2017 18:05:00 GMT
Jennifer Holiday didn't have 2 alternates or a standby, and was scheduled to do all performances. THANK YOU While I appreciate that different roles might require a standby (alternates... hmm never really seen one apart from Evita used for a good reason. Many Christine's say that it's a really nice role because of only doing 6 shows and the high notes are pre recorded!) If the original didn't have one, why do you? And I completely agree that the green-ness of some new performers is sometimes grating. Mr. Ball is right some new actors these days, while its harder to get into the big drama schools, are just not cut out for the gruelling 8 shows. Thankfully we do have some like Charlie Stemp who prove that the 21st Century actors can still cut it with the likes of Imelda Staunton! (Work wise, I'm not quite elevating him to her just yet!!) |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 18:43:19 GMT
Jennifer Holiday didn't have 2 alternates or a standby, and was scheduled to do all performances. THANK YOU While I appreciate that different roles might require a standby (alternates... hmm never really seen one apart from Evita used for a good reason. Many Christine's say that it's a really nice role because of only doing 6 shows and the high notes are pre recorded!) If the original didn't have one, why do you? And I completely agree that the green-ness of some new performers is sometimes grating. Mr. Ball is right some new actors these days, while its harder to get into the big drama schools, are just not cut out for the gruelling 8 shows. Thankfully we do have some like Charlie Stemp who prove that the 21st Century actors can still cut it with the likes of Imelda Staunton! (Work wise, I'm not quite elevating him to her just yet!!) As has already been pointed out if you read the rest of the last couple of pages, Jennifer Holliday did have a standby. And that's pretty irrelevant anyway, one person's capability for doing all 8 shows a week doesn't mean everyone else has to be capable of doing the same. What matters more is their ability to perform the role period, not how many times they are capable of doing it in a week. I'd much rather have an actor who puts their all into a role for 6 shows a week than someone who holds back or phones it in just so they can do all 8. Of course there are some people who are capable of inhabiting a particular role for all 8 shows, but that has never been and never will be a requirement for being cast in a role, and it shouldn't be - the important thing is talent and suitability to play the character. If you have more respect for a performer because they can do 8 shows a week rather than judging them on the performance they give when they are actually onstage, then in my opinion you've got your priorities wrong. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 20:43:44 GMT
Jennifer Holiday didn't have a standby till well into the run. Maybe they didnt know the role couldnt be sustained till after opening.
Amber Riley only did the first week of performances because there weren't 8 performances that week, and they already had 2 standbys in place.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 21:46:52 GMT
As I tried to point out, I think over-simplifying it to judge someone simply on whether they have a standby or not misses the point, unless of course you don't care about the quality of the performance and simply care whether someone shows up 6 times a week or 8...
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Post by JJShaw on Mar 6, 2017 21:55:03 GMT
I completely understand the need for a standby, and have no issues with that. And one alternate for a matinee? Sure, its not the worst thing in the world. But 2 for Effie??
My opinion is that A) having two alternates is odd and B) I do think performers should have the ability to do at least 7 of the shows if it is an incredibly demanding role (Killian Donnelly has had alternates for roles that are not necessarily that taxing). If you can't do it, its not the job for you. The job is to do 8 shows a week. (I apologise this is coming of harsher than intended and I do not mean to disregard anyone else views on the matter)
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Post by louloubee on Mar 6, 2017 22:35:47 GMT
I completely understand the need for a standby, and have no issues with that. And one alternate for a matinee? Sure, its not the worst thing in the world. But 2 for Effie?? My opinion is that A) having two alternates is odd and B) I do think performers should have the ability to do at least 7 of the shows if it is an incredibly demanding role (Killian Donnelly has had alternates for roles that are not necessarily that taxing). If you can't do it, its not the job for you. The job is to do 8 shows a week. (I apologise this is coming of harsher than intended and I do not mean to disregard anyone else views on the matter) Performers are not machines. Standbys and understudies are in place to ensure the person playing the role can look after themselves / take time off when ill/ paternity/ maternity/ holidays etc... performers are entitled to this exactly the same as any other industry in the world. Musical theatre tends to be physical and the voice is a muscle and everyone is built differently..... but the voice can be affected by a cold / hay fever / crying / air conditioning/ allergies / ..... vocal chords can be very sensitive and sometimes no matter how much you take care of yourself, you can still very easily be affected to outside occurances that affect your voice. In some styles .. opera for example... they tend to not even do 8 shows a week. I personally find this view of "if you can't do 8 shows this industry isn't for you" quite harsh. Effie is a very demanding sing (not to say that others aren't either) but it is... and if the producers have put in two amazing standbys to ensure Ambers health AND that the audience isn't disappointed by a bad show or a cancelled show... surely this is a good thing. As I said performers aren't robots. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 6, 2017 22:53:53 GMT
I imagine the two alternates was a decision based on Amber's unproven ability to do the 8 shows. Ive said all along she wouldn't be able to do it. That's not a criticism of her but a simple recognition of the fact that she's never done it before so why would she be able to? I still maintain she won't stay for the entire run. Or the holidays will get longer and longer. Shout me down if you like  |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 6, 2017 22:57:48 GMT
Many Christine's say that it's a really nice role because of only doing 6 shows and the high notes are pre recorded!) Been saying this for years. I could sing Christine better than the last two I saw. Pass me the nightie and the fright-wig and I'm right there. Nilo Problemo. |
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Post by bellboard27 on Mar 6, 2017 23:06:00 GMT
Many Christine's say that it's a really nice role because of only doing 6 shows and the high notes are pre recorded!) Been saying this for years. I could sing Christine better than the last two I saw. Pass me the nightie and the fright-wig and I'm right there. Nilo Problemo. Photos asap please! |
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Post by popcultureboy on Mar 6, 2017 23:12:04 GMT
I imagine the two alternates was a decision based on Amber's unproven ability to do the 8 shows. Ive said all along she wouldn't be able to do it. That's not a criticism of her but a simple recognition of the fact that she's never done it before so why would she be able to? I still maintain she won't stay for the entire run. Or the holidays will get longer and longer. Shout me down if you like I imagine the alternates was a decision based on the proven ability of the role of Effie White to murder the vocal chords of anyone who plays it. Amber was really ill over Christmas, as were a lot of performers in both this and other shows across the West End. She probably came back before she was fully ready, and that will mean she's more susceptible to getting sick again. Which is what seems to have happened. I still maintain you're looking for a scandal where there isn't one, so pipe down. |
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Post by ali973 on Mar 7, 2017 5:25:46 GMT
I personally find this view of "if you can't do 8 shows this industry isn't for you" quite harsh. Effie is a very demanding sing (not to say that others aren't either) but it is... and if the producers have put in two amazing standbys to ensure Ambers health AND that the audience isn't disappointed by a bad show or a cancelled show... surely this is a good thing. As I said performers aren't robots. I agree. This is especially noting that most people with standard work who are on the same pay level as these performers have two days off a week, not one. I don't even know what gives people the entitlement to judge and to make this whole 8 shows a week such a holy commandment that if broken, it's as if the performer has committed a capital crime. The 8 shows a week system is probably devised by producers and a capitalist, commercial money generating system that is to benefit the producer and investors above all of us. Performers have the right to be sick, feel like sh*t or simply not inspired to go to work. So do all other laborers and anyone participating in any industry or workspace. Says me, who is typing this, already late to work, and not wanting to get out of my PJs. |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 7, 2017 7:51:31 GMT
I still maintain you're looking for a scandal where there isn't one, so pipe down. You couldn't be more wrong, I'm speculating along with everyone else on this thread |
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Post by couldileaveyou on Mar 7, 2017 9:07:05 GMT
Besides, we don't really have reports and audios of almost every performance of the original run of Dreamgirls, like it might happen today. Now we read about every single time Idina cracks, and probably someone is recording it as well. I'm always suspicious of the stories like Ethel Merman never missed a performance, Jennifer Holliday had no alternate, Carol Channing missed 3 performances of Dolly in 40 years... the fact that they never missed a show doesn't imply that they were constantly good eight times a week.
Barbra Streisand did all the shows when she was in Funny Girl, but had the score lowered down for the matinees. I prefer a good alternate to a half-assed performance.
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Post by ali973 on Mar 7, 2017 9:33:44 GMT
Besides, we don't really have reports and audios of almost every performance of the original run of Dreamgirls, like it might happen today. Now we read about every single time Idina cracks, and probably someone is recording it as well. I'm always suspicious of the stories like Ethel Merman never missed a performance, Jennifer Holliday had no alternate, Carol Channing missed 3 performances of Dolly in 40 years... the fact that they never missed a show doesn't imply that they were constantly good eight times a week. Yup. But just to go off on a tangent, of the recordings available of the original Dreamgirls..my my, it sounded absolutely thrilling. And for people who are annoyed by the whooping that is happening in London, you really ought to listen to the sea of adoration coming from the audience during the original run. There are recordings of the opening night on Broadway and Jennifer Holliday's final performance that are just unbelievable. |
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Post by cerfan on Mar 7, 2017 21:23:41 GMT
Hi all! Any chance to get to know who will sing "Effie" this thursday march 9th - as coming from far abroad is Amber still sick? Thank you so much for your help! |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Mar 7, 2017 21:30:06 GMT
Hi all! Any chance to get to know who will sing "Effie" this thursday march 9th - as coming from far abroad is Amber still sick? Thank you so much for your help! Welcome to TheatreBoard. Amber is off so I've offered to step in. I can totally kill it and Sonia F says she wants me but she has a queue of Effies already lined up, Marisha, Karen, Ruth? Oops! No... sorry not Ruth. Either way, you'll see an Effie. And the show is fabulous regardless of who plays her. Enjoy. |
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Post by theatre-turtle on Mar 7, 2017 22:08:04 GMT
Hi all! Any chance to get to know who will sing "Effie" this thursday march 9th - as coming from far abroad is Amber still sick? Thank you so much for your help! She's scheduled but hasn't been back from her illness yet. |
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Post by singularsensation10 on Mar 8, 2017 11:42:08 GMT
Going to the show this afternoon, totally didn't digest the info in this thread properly and link it to the fact I'm going - will be good to see the show again with a different Effie this time.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 11:44:00 GMT
Those wondering, Karen did Monday for her scheduled alternate show, and Marisha did last night as Amber is still ill. So presumably, if Amber is still ill, Marisha will be on for both performances today.
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Post by singularsensation on Mar 8, 2017 14:09:04 GMT
Marisha on as Effie at the matinee. In my seat now and so excited!
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Post by Mark on Mar 8, 2017 14:11:08 GMT
Marisha on as Effie at the matinee. In my seat now and so excited! Me too! Got premiums down to £39.50 at about midday - bargain. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 14:21:44 GMT
Yes Marisha, come through girl! She is doing both performance today, glad she getting the most out of her West End debut! 
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Post by Paul on Mar 8, 2017 14:38:14 GMT
I really want to see Marisha in the role next time I see the show.
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Post by singularsensation10 on Mar 8, 2017 17:22:41 GMT
Oh. My. Quivering. Life.
Marisha Wallace. What did I just witness??! I don't want to say she's better than Amber but...she's miles better than Amber. I actually 'get' Effie as a character now. Whilst I think I'd rather listen to Amber on a CD, Marisha gave her soul today. And it was only a matinee performance. I enjoyed the show tenfold compared to my previous visit - maybe it was to do with sitting in better seats, maybe it was Marisha... incomparable experience though. Marisha's characterisation was perfection. Loved it. (We also saw the understudy for Lorell who was funky and powerful - with arms and shoulders to die for)
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