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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 10:45:22 GMT
I don't understand your repeated comment about New York and California.
Hilary Clinton won the popular vote of the entire USA.
In case you don't understand that, I mean that more of the entire USA electorate voted for Clinton than voted for Trump.
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Post by vdcni on Jan 24, 2017 10:45:57 GMT
Yes because making sure the government obey the law is the problem not people calling others parasites and traitors.
Funny enough I don't want a government which thinks it can do anything with no checks and balances.
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 11:16:19 GMT
Yes because making sure the government obey the law is the problem not people calling others parasites and traitors. No, people wasting the nation's money and creating wealth for lawyers and a wider profile for yourself is the problem...
The people voted leave, we are leaving whether I like it (and I voted remain) or you like it.
Parliament will have a symbolic vote but if you're happy with the waste of money....
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Post by vdcni on Jan 24, 2017 11:23:21 GMT
Yes because making sure the government obey the law is the problem not people calling others parasites and traitors. No, people wasting the nation's money and creating wealth for lawyers and a wider profile for yourself is the problem...
The people voted leave, we are leaving whether I like it (and I voted remain) or you like it.
Parliament will have a symbolic vote but if you're happy with the waste of money....
Then the government should have got it right in the first place. They are to blame, no one else. They didn't need to go through this process, it was obvious that there should be a vote in parliament. But if you have no respect for the law of the land then so be it. |
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 11:28:58 GMT
No, people wasting the nation's money and creating wealth for lawyers and a wider profile for yourself is the problem...
The people voted leave, we are leaving whether I like it (and I voted remain) or you like it.
Parliament will have a symbolic vote but if you're happy with the waste of money....
Then the government should have got it right in the first place. They are to blame, no one else. They didn't need to go through this process, it was obvious that there should be a vote in parliament. But if you have no respect for the law of the land then so be it. The 1975 referendum which led to the our membership of the European Union was not implemented via a Parliamentary vote.... |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 11:34:00 GMT
The 1975 referendum which led to the our membership of the European Union was not implemented via a Parliamentary vote.... So what? Are you now declaring yourself a greater legal expert than the Supreme Court? |
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 11:38:37 GMT
The 1975 referendum which led to the our membership of the European Union was not implemented via a Parliamentary vote.... So what? Are you now declaring yourself a greater legal expert than the Supreme Court? 3 members of the Supreme Court did not think we need further Parliament involvement..... Do you think you are cleverer than those thick, uneducated racists too?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 11:44:00 GMT
3 members of the Supreme Court did not think we need further Parliament involvement..... Do you think you are cleverer than those thick, uneducated racists too? All eleven Supreme Court Justices are legal experts. I know that Michael Gove triggered the flaming torch brigade by saying that we shouldn't listen to experts any more but, unfortunately for him, the rule of law still stands in the UK. I suppose that Andrea Leadsom would wish us to disenfranchise all members of the Supreme Court who aren't mothers. Would that have led to a different majority outcome this morning? |
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Post by Jan on Jan 24, 2017 11:56:08 GMT
Yes, Brexit was DEFINITELY caused by the people who said "we need to prevent this, they're not going to give that money to the NHS" and DEFINITELY NOT caused by the people who said "hey we can give all this money to the NHS" and the patsies who believed them when they said it. DEFINITELY. I bet you don't know a single person who voted Leave so your views on why they did so are worthless. What you are saying is exactly equivalent to saying the Remain voters were so thick and gullible they believed Osborne & Darling's threat of an immediate post-vote recession and an immediate punishment budget with income tax rises for all. Trump lost the popular vote, Remain lost the popular vote, you can't argue different sides on those two outcomes. |
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 12:02:48 GMT
Yes, Brexit was DEFINITELY caused by the people who said "we need to prevent this, they're not going to give that money to the NHS" and DEFINITELY NOT caused by the people who said "hey we can give all this money to the NHS" and the patsies who believed them when they said it. DEFINITELY. I bet you don't know a single person who voted Leave so your views on why they did so are worthless. What you are saying is exactly equivalent to saying the Remain voters were so thick and gullible they believed Osborne & Darling's threat of an immediate post-vote recession and an immediate punishment budget with income tax rises for all. Trump lost the popular vote, Remain lost the popular vote, you can't argue different sides on those two outcomes. Hillary being elected on just the college system but not the popular vote would be acceptable to these people..
There's a reason the Electoral College system exists... It's to ensure the big metropolises do not end up speaking for the rest of the country and long may it continue.
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Post by vdcni on Jan 24, 2017 12:23:38 GMT
I bet you don't know a single person who voted Leave so your views on why they did so are worthless. What you are saying is exactly equivalent to saying the Remain voters were so thick and gullible they believed Osborne & Darling's threat of an immediate post-vote recession and an immediate punishment budget with income tax rises for all. Trump lost the popular vote, Remain lost the popular vote, you can't argue different sides on those two outcomes. Hillary being elected on just the college system but not the popular vote would be acceptable to these people..
There's a reason the Electoral College system exists... It's to ensure the big metropolises do not end up speaking for the rest of the country and long may it continue.
Nope it absolutely would not, clearly the best result would be for someone to win both. And if had happened the other way round the Republicans and Trump would be screaming their heads off about it. Hell Trump still can't accept he lost the popular vote as he keeps claiming it was due to illegal voters. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 12:37:38 GMT
Yes because making sure the government obey the law is the problem not people calling others parasites and traitors. No, people wasting the nation's money and creating wealth for lawyers and a wider profile for yourself is the problem...
The people voted leave, we are leaving whether I like it (and I voted remain) or you like it.
Parliament will have a symbolic vote but if you're happy with the waste of money....
Whether or not the people voted leave, Parliament are still the lawmakers and they are the only ones who can decide to actually leave. A referendum is a good political instrument to see what the people think. It is however not legally binding. The judges just did what they had to, they followed the law. What people seem to forget is that judges are not supposed to let their personal opinions guide them. Their sole purpose is make sure the law is respected. |
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 12:39:58 GMT
Hillary being elected on just the college system but not the popular vote would be acceptable to these people..
There's a reason the Electoral College system exists... It's to ensure the big metropolises do not end up speaking for the rest of the country and long may it continue.
Nope it absolutely would not, clearly the best result would be for someone to win both. And if had happened the other way round the Republicans and Trump would be screaming their heads off about it. Hell Trump still can't accept he lost the popular vote as he keeps claiming it was due to illegal voters. That's because he's an idiot. |
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Post by Steve on Jan 24, 2017 14:51:32 GMT
Gina Miller contested Theresa May's attempt to erode the right of Parliament to make laws. Miller did both Brexiters and Remainers a huge favour, and we should all be thankful to her, for preserving the principle of Parliamentary sovereignty. While it is true that many actions the Government takes stem from exercising the power of the Queen, changing the law of the land (which all sides conceded would be the result of triggering Article 50) is NOT one of the Queen's powers, and is reserved to Parliament. Thank you for standing up for this key principle, Gina Miller, in the face of tremendous personal abuse, and against an overwhelming tide of ignorance fueled by the Daily Mail! As has been pointed out, the choice to make the Referendum advisory was made by David Cameron's Government, it was a mistake, and it is his fault that public money has been wasted today, as well as Theresa May's fault for compounding his mistake, and not consulting Parliament about Article 50 in the first place. |
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 15:16:16 GMT
Gina Miller contested Theresa May's attempt to erode the right of Parliament to make laws. Miller did both Brexiters and Remainers a huge favour, and we should all be thankful to her, for preserving the principle of Parliamentary sovereignty. While it is true that many actions the Government takes stem from exercising the power of the Queen, changing the law of the land (which all sides conceded would be the result of triggering Article 50) is NOT one of the Queen's powers, and is reserved to Parliament. Thank you for standing up for this key principle, Gina Miller, in the face of tremendous personal abuse, and against an overwhelming tide of ignorance fueled by the Daily Mail! As has been pointed out, the choice to make the Referendum advisory was made by David Cameron's Government, it was a mistake, and it is his fault that public money has been wasted today, as well as Theresa May's fault for compounding his mistake, and not consulting Parliament about Article 50 in the first place. Or, alternatively, she is somebody who, as punishment to the British people and Nation for voting to Leave, has delayed the inevitable and wasted millions in the process.
She didn't stand up for any key principles but because she is bitter and can't accept the result and was trying to buy the Remain campaign some time to somehow turn the decision around. She failed.
Miller is obsessed with money, money, money and notoriety. She doesn't care about the "common man" but making money for herself and her cronies (most of whom live as tax exiles outside the UK btw), that's all.
Cameron should have made the referendum binding but he's another politician who wasn't listening to the nation. If he was, he wouldn't have been so confident in his faith that Remain would win and would have helped create a better campaign rather than attempting scaremongering....
That's the truth no matter how many of the obvious people "like" your post...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:22:23 GMT
Gina Miller contested Theresa May's attempt to erode the right of Parliament to make laws. Miller did both Brexiters and Remainers a huge favour, and we should all be thankful to her, for preserving the principle of Parliamentary sovereignty. While it is true that many actions the Government takes stem from exercising the power of the Queen, changing the law of the land (which all sides conceded would be the result of triggering Article 50) is NOT one of the Queen's powers, and is reserved to Parliament. Thank you for standing up for this key principle, Gina Miller, in the face of tremendous personal abuse, and against an overwhelming tide of ignorance fueled by the Daily Mail! As has been pointed out, the choice to make the Referendum advisory was made by David Cameron's Government, it was a mistake, and it is his fault that public money has been wasted today, as well as Theresa May's fault for compounding his mistake, and not consulting Parliament about Article 50 in the first place. Or, alternatively, she is somebody who, as punishment to the British people and Nation for voting to Leave, has delayed the inevitable and wasted millions in the process.
She didn't stand up for any key principles but because she is bitter and can't accept the result and was trying to buy the Remain campaign some time to somehow turn the decision around. She failed.
Miller is obsessed with money, money, money and notoriety. She doesn't care about the "common man" but making money for herself and her cronies (most of whom live as tax exiles outside the UK btw), that's all.
Cameron should have made the referendum binding but he's another politician who wasn't listening to the nation. If he was, he wouldn't have been so confident in his faith that Remain would win and would have helped create a better campaign rather than attempting scaremongering....
That's the truth no matter how many of the obvious people "like" your post...
You call her bitter. I say she and the judges are making sure the law isn't being broken. They're also making sure the government doesn't exceed its powers. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:26:40 GMT
Ooh I'm an "obvious person" now. Is that a bit like when the kids call you "basic"
(I've lost all will to pretend this is a discussion now)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:27:39 GMT
And given the incorrect things being said by the likes of Iain Duncan Smith on the subject, there really is a genuine need for someone who knows what they're doing to ensure correct process is followed.
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 15:29:11 GMT
Or, alternatively, she is somebody who, as punishment to the British people and Nation for voting to Leave, has delayed the inevitable and wasted millions in the process.
She didn't stand up for any key principles but because she is bitter and can't accept the result and was trying to buy the Remain campaign some time to somehow turn the decision around. She failed.
Miller is obsessed with money, money, money and notoriety. She doesn't care about the "common man" but making money for herself and her cronies (most of whom live as tax exiles outside the UK btw), that's all.
Cameron should have made the referendum binding but he's another politician who wasn't listening to the nation. If he was, he wouldn't have been so confident in his faith that Remain would win and would have helped create a better campaign rather than attempting scaremongering....
That's the truth no matter how many of the obvious people "like" your post...
You call her bitter. I say she and the judges are making sure the law isn't being broken. They're also making sure the government doesn't exceed its powers. The Judges are doing their job and should be impartial but if you think Miller cares at all about this country and our Nation.... As soon as Brexit is completed she can go and live with her tax-exile friends, can't she? She will do too. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:31:26 GMT
The point being that Miller is ensuring the law is upheld, along with her colleagues, who (to my knowledge) fall on both sides of the Brexit fence. It's in the interests of both for and against to make sure it's legally binding, and I personally don't care which way she voted because she's ensuring that the politicians, May included at least follow the law.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:40:16 GMT
Exactly Monkey- the actions themselves, and the people involved are far from perfect, but in the world we live in I'm more in favour of the demonstration we still live in a country where that CAN happen. The freedom to do so is the comforting thing rather than the thing itself, or the people doing it.
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Post by lynette on Jan 24, 2017 15:44:12 GMT
Interesting what is being said about Miller by idm2016. I've noticed other people who are not born Brits or who live abroad shouting a lot.
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Post by ldm2016 on Jan 24, 2017 15:46:58 GMT
And to add, it is a badge of honour that in our society somebody can question the government in an impartial court. Personally, I wasn't keen on what she did, but I respect her right to have the freedom to be able to do so. We should be incredibly proud that we live in a country which offers people a chance to fight the government in courts. Very proud.
I also would defend her right to do so with my last breath.
However, as I have clearly outlined above. Even as a remain voter, I can not and will not defend her trying to delay the people's will not for altruistic reasons as she claims, but because she is bitter, worried about and her cronies post-EU finances and currently has the finance to go through the process.
She is a despicable woman who cares not a single thing about our democracy or democratic process but only herself and her non domicile millionaire friends. If Brexit fails (and every person with an once of intelligence clearly wants it to succeed regardless of how they voted) she will be able to use her remaining wealth, friends and contacts to ensure she is not hit hard.
She is despicable.
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Post by bellboard27 on Jan 24, 2017 15:53:54 GMT
^Not this
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2017 15:54:45 GMT
If Brexit fails (and every person with an once of intelligence clearly wants it to succeed regardless of how they voted) I want it to fail, in the sense that the UK should end up weaker and the EU should not be weakened. |
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