227 posts
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Post by ukpuppetboy on Jul 28, 2019 3:48:45 GMT
When I first saw the show back in 1986 I could have sworn there were two travelators at the back of the stage to make the ramps for the descent into the lair. Did I dream this? Or was one dropped? Hi Pitboy I’m fairly sure there was only ever one travelator, though admittedly I didn’t get to see the show until April’ 87 and there is very little in the way of photos or video of the title number from those early months (where I assume you think the two may have been present). For memory there maybe something from the 1987 Evening Standard Awards which I’ll try and dig out. The main reason I believe there was only ever the one would be for practical reasons in the staging and limited size of Her Majesty’s stage. The single travelator concept was already providing a solution for ALL configurations of walkways down into the lair (and later the raised platform for the cross in Wandering Child) as designed and therefore a second would have been unnecessary. ALSO, as there were initially plans for Christine to be riding down to the lair on horseback led by the Phantom this wouldn’t have been at all practical if they needed to switch walkways. It was mounted on a ‘skate’ that ran along tracks in the original travelator floor and was spun around 180º once inside the towers in order to continue with the descent once the walkway was on place. I can’t see how this would have ever worked with 2 separate travelators or 2 walkways using the same towers (without using multiples which would have removed the need for the horse to change direction). I maybe wrong but the only travelator difference from that time to now that I remember is that the original graveyard set didn’t have the Daae mausoleum beneath and as such the walkway was much closer to the stage. The Phantom emerged from behind the cross (instead of being concealed within it) and there was a pyramid of skulls in front in case you hadn’t had your fix from the auction scene.. www.playbill.com/article/exclusive-harold-prince-reveals-the-creation-of-the-phantom-of-the-opera-in-this-exclusive-excerpt-from-his-latest-memoirI recently came across this Playbill article from 2017 with very extensive excerpts from Hal Prince discussing the original staging of Phantom from his memoirs (which I now want to read). Pretty interesting for any big Phantom fan I hope you’ll agree. Seriously - what were they thinking with those doves and red-eyed rats?! |
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227 posts
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Post by ukpuppetboy on Jul 28, 2019 7:15:35 GMT
 The travelator design. For any fellow engineering/techie nerds... |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 8:45:47 GMT
The travelator design. For any fellow engineering/techie nerds... A beatuiful sight to wake up to! Not seen this before. Wow. Very appreciated here, thanks! PS. Where did you find this? |
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227 posts
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Post by ukpuppetboy on Jul 28, 2019 10:03:28 GMT
The travelator design. For any fellow engineering/techie nerds... A beatuiful sight to wake up to! Not seen this before. Wow. Very appreciated here, thanks! PS. Where did you find this? You’re welcome 😉 Glad it wasn’t just me that was interested in the mechanics. It was from “Operafantomet”’s quite extensive Tumblr archive (and credited to a German programme originally). operafantomet.tumblr.com/search/Travelator |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 10:33:24 GMT
I love technical diagrams like that. Thanks.
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227 posts
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Post by ukpuppetboy on Aug 5, 2019 10:46:15 GMT
I remember seeing him in Hairspray, and thought his voice wasn't that special (Piers Bate - his understudy - was much better), but I guess he's been working hard in the last few years to be considered good enough for the part. That said, I am happy they've gone for a younger Phantom, which is my preference. Really? How long ago was that because he sounds absolutely amazing in this Sydney concert in June. More operatic than Anthony Warlow and Michael Crawford combined. And more handsome than any Raoul. Sounds like it could be quite the event at Her Majesty’s next month. |
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573 posts
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Post by Dave25 on Aug 10, 2019 23:55:37 GMT
Today I was watching some older clips of this show and I noticed how beautiful and haunting the original cadenza of the title song was, without the electric guitar. The newly added guitar is quite distracting from the moment and makes it sound cheaper to me. I also don't understand the intention, was it to make it more modern? The original is more modern/timeless to me and the electric guitar makes it sound more passe and it gives an 80's bold and the beautiful vibe.
Here is an example of how it used to be:
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660 posts
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Post by Oleanna on Aug 11, 2019 0:44:28 GMT
Today I was watching some older clips of this show and I noticed how beautiful and haunting the original cadenza of the title song was, without the electric guitar. The newly added guitar is quite distracting from the moment and makes it sound cheaper to me. I also don't understand the intention, was it to make it more modern? The original is more modern/timeless to me and the electric guitar makes it sound more passe and it gives an 80's bold and the beautiful vibe. Here is an example of how it used to be: The electric guitar in the cadenza was how it was conceived in ALW/Mike Batt’s original arrangement (as heard on the original promo single with Steve Harley/Sarah Brightman, and is particularly prominent on the 12” Extended Mix), but was not present when the song transferred into the show (this is just my speculation, but it may have been considered a bit too much of a leap for an audience to hear a guitar knowing full well that there’s not one in the pit...nowadays, most shows let us hear instruments that aren’t actually there). So it’s fair to say that its presence in the cadenza was a reinstatement, rather than an addition. I quite like hearing it both ways. I do love the antiphony of the guitar and voice, but also miss hearing the interplay between the strings and reeds so clearly. One thing’s for sure, the presence of the acousitc guitar from the second verse onwards has never been welcome for me. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2019 8:24:29 GMT
What a song the title song. The progressive key changes are adrenaline inducing.
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Post by scarpia on Aug 11, 2019 12:02:05 GMT
Re the travelator, it's the same as it's always been. The design hasn't really changed since 1986.
The electric guitar was first reintroduced into the title song in 2006 with the Las Vegas production (this then made it into London after the sound upgrade two years later). Hal asked ALW to cut originally as he rightly thought it dated the show, but 20 years later, ALW decided he would overrule Hal. ALW seems to think adding in electric guitar to his shows makes him cool and up to date, when it often dates the shows. Much missed from the 1986 orchestration are the organ parts towards the end. I think the best orchestration for the title song was one that was used in the London production only between 2004 and 2008. It had some electric guitar in it, but not the wailing one that makes Christine's vocalisations inaudible. I think the percussion in that orchestration may have been live as well, but haven't got confirmation on that. |
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573 posts
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Post by Dave25 on Aug 11, 2019 12:54:13 GMT
Thanks for your reactions and insights!
"miss hearing the interplay between the strings and reeds so clearly"
I completely agree with this, that interplay is what gives me goosebumps in that scene.
"What a song the title song. The progressive key changes are adrenaline inducing."
Including the key changes, well said, thank you. Adrenaline inducing indeed.
"ALW seems to think adding in electric guitar to his shows makes him cool and up to date, when it often dates the shows"
It does indeed feel dated because of it, while the version I posted feels much more timeless.
It really is a shame, because aside from the dated feel, I think the scene is the climax of act one and this electric guitar distracts from the chords and makes the scene much more generic to me and I believe it takes audiences out of the right feel. The chords and key changes and intensity it takes away from are much more haunting.
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227 posts
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Post by ukpuppetboy on Sept 10, 2019 5:47:53 GMT
"ALW seems to think adding in electric guitar to his shows makes him cool and up to date, when it often dates the shows" It does indeed feel dated because of it, while the version I posted feels much more timeless. It really is a shame, because aside from the dated feel, I think the scene is the climax of act one and this electric guitar distracts from the chords and makes the scene much more generic to me and I believe it takes audiences out of the right feel. The chords and key changes and intensity it takes away from are much more haunting. The electric guitar riffs are also SO incongruous with the orchestrations for the entire rest of the show. Should have been ditched with Steve Harley. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2019 6:16:44 GMT
Wonder how the new Phantom got on last night..!
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349 posts
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Post by kimbahorel on Sept 10, 2019 10:42:11 GMT
Wonder how the new Phantom got on last night..! I was hoping others would post so I can if I share the same opinion, agree with them 😂 |
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349 posts
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Post by kimbahorel on Sept 10, 2019 10:49:07 GMT
He is a good actor but vocally its... ummm. Like he can hit all the notes just he was very over powered by Kelly and Danny. I hope obviously as he does it more the strengh will improve... I hope. Also he was very out of breath during MOTN and whispered the first part of the song.
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Post by stageyninja83 on Sept 10, 2019 13:27:00 GMT
He is a good actor but vocally its... ummm. Like he can hit all the notes just he was very over powered by Kelly and Danny. I hope obviously as he does it more the strengh will improve... I hope. Also he was very out of breath during MOTN and whispered the first part of the song. I think he has potential but I thought he was out of time/late quite a lot, especially in POTO and MOTN. He also seemed to over-emphasise the last letter of the last word of every line which I found very distracting. Very hard to judge from a first performance, I'm sure he'll settle but positives are that his voice seemed powerful and I liked his acting. |
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Post by ceebee on Sept 14, 2019 17:06:01 GMT
I saw Scott Davies this afternoon, and he was absolutely fantastic. Such a long running show felt very fresh at today's matinee. Kelly Mathieson was brilliant as Christine too. Ross Dawes was also very good as Firmin.
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1,562 posts
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Post by showtoones on Sept 15, 2019 5:39:24 GMT
What performances does Alternate Phantom and alternate Christine perform?
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1,057 posts
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Post by David J on Oct 1, 2019 8:59:03 GMT
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Post by xanady on Oct 1, 2019 9:13:53 GMT
Thanks,Sir for posting this...am going to order it...musicals meet comic books?...hmmm...how about a mash up of MT and characters from comics...Thoroughly Modern Minnie The Minx anyone?...
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716 posts
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Post by indis on Oct 9, 2019 19:41:28 GMT
was wondering today : is there a body size a Raoul actor has to be? was thinking Rob Houchen would have
a great voice for Raoul but he is not the tallest, so is there a guideline?
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19,675 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Nov 2, 2019 11:34:01 GMT
Bumped for our new 42ndBlvdTip for newer members: we appreciate you running a search before starting a new thread. We aim to have one thread per show unless there is more than one production running. The search function on the board is a bit random so a google search will often turn up better results. In this case google “TheatreBoard Phantom” and this thread is the top hit.
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2,245 posts
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Post by richey on Nov 6, 2019 19:01:27 GMT
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349 posts
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Post by kimbahorel on Nov 12, 2019 8:38:15 GMT
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4,786 posts
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Post by Mark on Nov 12, 2019 8:55:40 GMT
Love that! I hope the couple see this! |
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