61 posts
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Post by TheatreTwittic on Apr 27, 2021 12:47:31 GMT
The conflicting messages in one statement is truly mind-boggling...
'Putting the new version of the original Phantom production back into its perfect home'.....'our new creative team to stage the Phantom afresh, as if it was a brand new production'
This is whole work at home, unless you can't work at home, but don't travel unless you must travel all over again 🙈🙈🙈
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2021 12:52:23 GMT
Is anyone in the cast over 35? By-and-large Band A recruits I see.
I suppose that's in keeping with the age of the characters back at the turn of that century.
Nothing wrong with it, but CMLs obsession with graduates is a little unhealthy.
There's alot to be said for seasoned professionals, but CML is intent on penny pinching so the juniors get the gig.
Hopefully they don't look as awkwardly made up, aged and stuffed as they do in Les Mis.
Would be interested to know the average age of the cast on Broadway vs London.
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5,868 posts
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Post by mrbarnaby on Apr 27, 2021 12:59:09 GMT
Is anyone in the cast over 35? By-and-large Band A recruits I see. I suppose that's in keeping with the age of the characters back at the turn of that century. Nothing wrong with it, but CMLs obsession with graduates is a little unhealthy. There's alot to be said for seasoned professionals, but CML is intent on penny pinching so the juniors get the gig. Hopefully they don't look as awkwardly made up, aged and stuffed as they do in Les Mis. Would be interested to know the average age of the cast on Broadway vs London. You can get away with paying younger people less.... that’s why loads of shows have people far too young playing older roles. Drives me crazy. |
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879 posts
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Post by daisy24601 on Apr 27, 2021 13:03:46 GMT
I was wondering what happened to Holly Anne Hull but I'm pleased to see she's alternate Christine.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2021 13:21:16 GMT
Is anyone in the cast over 35? By-and-large Band A recruits I see. I suppose that's in keeping with the age of the characters back at the turn of that century. Nothing wrong with it, but CMLs obsession with graduates is a little unhealthy. There's alot to be said for seasoned professionals, but CML is intent on penny pinching so the juniors get the gig. Hopefully they don't look as awkwardly made up, aged and stuffed as they do in Les Mis. Would be interested to know the average age of the cast on Broadway vs London. God forbid graduates get given opportunities to establish themselves in the industry... |
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Post by 141920grm on Apr 27, 2021 13:29:50 GMT
From what I gather, I don't think the old guard (at least cast-wise) really want to be back given what's happened to the show. And they’re completely justified, this whole transition has just been absolute shambles. Alienating a generation of performers who have loved and contributed so much to the original. But perhaps this is exactly what Cammack & co want, a clean break and a new cohort of people who have only ever known his tyrannical “creativity” as the norm.  |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2021 14:23:32 GMT
Is anyone in the cast over 35? By-and-large Band A recruits I see. I suppose that's in keeping with the age of the characters back at the turn of that century. Nothing wrong with it, but CMLs obsession with graduates is a little unhealthy. There's alot to be said for seasoned professionals, but CML is intent on penny pinching so the juniors get the gig. Hopefully they don't look as awkwardly made up, aged and stuffed as they do in Les Mis. Would be interested to know the average age of the cast on Broadway vs London. God forbid graduates get given opportunities to establish themselves in the industry... Don't get me wrong, I get that perspective, but there is a whole industry to get that experience in. I find it interesting CML seem to choose such young, sometimes inexperienced casts for their biggest, flagship, top tier shows. The whole chain of experience is demolished, veteran knowledge evaporates as there's no one to pass it down. It seems like the industry chews up alot of young people and spits them out so quickly, before they get a real chance to make a mark, because within 4yrs of graduating you've done the biggest shows in London. Where do you go once you've done Phantom, Les Mis, etc? Into the pile of fodder for another 22yr old to replace you. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2021 14:26:39 GMT
Is anyone in the cast over 35? By-and-large Band A recruits I see. I suppose that's in keeping with the age of the characters back at the turn of that century. Nothing wrong with it, but CMLs obsession with graduates is a little unhealthy. There's alot to be said for seasoned professionals, but CML is intent on penny pinching so the juniors get the gig. Hopefully they don't look as awkwardly made up, aged and stuffed as they do in Les Mis. Would be interested to know the average age of the cast on Broadway vs London. You can get away with paying younger people less.... that’s why loads of shows have people far too young playing older roles. Drives me crazy. Exactly, it's rotten. Nothing artistic about those decisions, poor kids cast, expected to fend for themselves on some of the biggest shows going, thinking they've got their big break, but its just another producer driven choice to pay the minimum. |
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Post by 141920grm on Apr 27, 2021 14:53:08 GMT
Don't get me wrong, I get that perspective, but there is a whole industry to get that experience in. I find it interesting CML seem to choose such young, sometimes inexperienced casts for their biggest, flagship, top tier shows. The whole chain of experience is demolished, veteran knowledge evaporates as there's no one to pass it down. It seems like the industry chews up alot of young people and spits them out so quickly, before they get a real chance to make a mark, because within 4yrs of graduating you've done the biggest shows in London. Where do you go once you've done Phantom, Les Mis, etc? Into the pile of fodder for another 22yr old to replace you. Yes, all of this. Obviously I'm excited and happy for the graduates who get to make their professional debut on one the biggest WE shows (and have discovered many new favourite actors this way), but I also think Phantom and other "flagship, top tier" shows should cast older/more experienced, something to be "worked towards" in a career. There's no lack of talent in the higher age ranges, and I just really want some leads with gravitas... The way these shows are set up- people will always aspire to join them, no need to run in headfirst fresh out of school only to get spit out after a few years. I respect that some might genuinely want to work their way up, stay in a show for the long run, but Cameron's made it clear now that he scorns & will not make it easy for anyone who wishes to follow this kind of career path. |
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44 posts
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Post by theatremole on Apr 27, 2021 17:11:38 GMT
You know that age has nothing to do with pay...right?
Equity set the minimum depending on venue size. Leads then get more on top of that, as to understudies, featured ensemble, swing etc...it doesn't matter if the lead is 19 or 56.
Agents can and often do negotiate something extra on top for their clients but often it's just the Equity minimum for your position depending on venue size and perhaps a betterment clause.
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5,868 posts
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Post by mrbarnaby on Apr 27, 2021 17:13:13 GMT
You know that age has nothing to do with pay...right? Equity set the minimum depending on venue size. Leads then get more on top of that, as to understudies, featured ensemble, swing etc...it doesn't matter if the lead is 19 or 56. Agents can and often do negotiate something extra on top for their clients but often it's just the Equity minimum for your position depending on venue size and perhaps a betterment clause. Yes but older , more experienced actors aren’t quite as prepared to take a minimal wage. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2021 17:15:52 GMT
You know that age has nothing to do with pay...right? Equity set the minimum depending on venue size. Leads then get more on top of that, as to understudies, featured ensemble, swing etc...it doesn't matter if the lead is 19 or 56. Agents can and often do negotiate something extra on top for their clients but often it's just the Equity minimum for your position depending on venue size and perhaps a betterment clause. Yes but older , more experienced actors aren’t quite as prepared to take a minimal wage. Plus with experience comes an Agent with more negotiating power. |
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Post by danb on Apr 27, 2021 17:20:14 GMT
Unpopular opinion here, but how many peoples mortgages, car loans and food bills has he paid for by employing them for the past 30 years? We don’t have jobs for life anymore so why should he have to go on employing the same people ad infinitum just because? Neither I nor anyone else I know works without the risk of it being taken away. The company I work for recently shook up its management structure and we all had to reapply for our jobs, not necessarily in the same place, with many people being unsuccessful and having to take a demotion or redundancy. Consumerism has got to the point that manpower is the only cost left that can be reduced. Given that theatre is both an art form and a business, we cannot reasonably expect it not to be affected by market forces however much it bothers our sense of affection for the show or sense of fair play.
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44 posts
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Post by theatremole on Apr 27, 2021 17:23:58 GMT
You're assuming that young actors aren't going to have a good agent. Drama schools are pretty hot on this these days. Also, Lucy St Louis has already been the lead in a big musical (she was Diana Ross in Motown), she's not a complete newbie.
On another note, I'd prefer to see a younger Phantom cast. It's always made me a little uncomfortable having a much older Phantom with a young Christine.
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19,742 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Apr 27, 2021 19:50:56 GMT
All posts made in the last couple of hours have been removed. Sorry if yours has been caught in the cross-fire but there is too much comment directed at other members rather than the show and the creatives.
The thread will remain locked for a while to allow people to chill out.
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19,742 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Apr 28, 2021 5:57:54 GMT
The thread is open. Please direct your comments at the production and not each other. Thank you.
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19,742 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Apr 28, 2021 6:40:14 GMT
Just saw a comment from someone on IG saying that they should have brought Ramin and Sierra back for the London opening 😆
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2,258 posts
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Post by richey on Apr 28, 2021 7:27:38 GMT
Got a spare $20,000 and want to own one of the original props?
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Post by ThereWillBeSun on Apr 28, 2021 8:58:13 GMT
Just saw a comment from someone on IG saying that they should have brought Ramin and Sierra back for the London opening 😆 NO. They're excellent of course. BUT COME ON. Let's give new talent a chance. On a random note - Lucy St Louis is an amazing name. |
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1,210 posts
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Post by musicalmarge on Apr 28, 2021 8:58:57 GMT
I don’t understand your “change is coming?” Have you seen Six? Lion King? Hamilton? Colour blind casting in Les Mis decades ago. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2021 10:02:29 GMT
Just saw a comment from someone on IG saying that they should have brought Ramin and Sierra back for the London opening 😆 Steve Harley is still bitter he never got chance to play the Phantom, maybe he could have a go? |
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19,742 posts
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Apr 28, 2021 10:27:47 GMT
Get Brightman back!
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5,868 posts
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Post by mrbarnaby on Apr 28, 2021 10:40:07 GMT
I’m Waiting for the next Cameron announcement saying that due to cost issues Madame Giry will also play Carlotta and Ballet Girl #4
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4,024 posts
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Post by Dawnstar on Apr 28, 2021 11:17:51 GMT
I don’t understand your “change is coming?” Have you seen Six? Lion King? Hamilton? Colour blind casting in Les Mis decades ago.
I find it a bit odd that there have been loads of comments on social media about a black actress playing Christine but I haven't seen any comments about an Asian actress playing Carlotta. Surely that is equally diverse? It sometimes seems as though people saying they want more diversity only care about more visibility of black people and not about any other ethnicities.
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1,210 posts
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Post by musicalmarge on Apr 28, 2021 11:26:56 GMT
I don’t understand your “change is coming?” Have you seen Six? Lion King? Hamilton? Colour blind casting in Les Mis decades ago.
I find it a bit odd that there have been loads of comments on social media about a black actress playing Christine but I haven't seen any comments about an Asian actress playing Carlotta. Surely that is equally diverse? It sometimes seems as though people saying they want more diversity only care about more visibility of black people and not about any other ethnicities.
THIS! Why are there no Polish people on TV or in adverts? I’m friends with dozens and I believe almost 2 million polish people now live in the UK. Also asian actors? When was the last time we saw one in a soap? Why can’t a white actor play an animal in the Lion king? It’s not real life. Positive discrimination can only happen it seems one way and black/African mixed race heritage to counter act social justice, BLM, centuries of systemic racism, mass murder and slavery it seems. Anyway I know Lucy personally so I’m very pleased for her, she’s beautiful and very talented. |
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