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Post by parsley1 on Oct 21, 2024 20:25:30 GMT
I wonder if anyone else
Has ever seen a show
Which has BROAD and ABSTRACT political themes
And then at the end had actors give a little audience recce on their personal political views
I found it very uncomfortable at the end of the show at New Diorama
To be given a pro-Palestine lecture
Sometimes I think theatre oversteps its boundaries massively
And takes advantage with a breathtaking arrogance
It is an non essential detached art form
Should learn its place and actors and ADs and venues should act more mindfully
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Post by oxfordsimon on Oct 21, 2024 21:07:41 GMT
I go to the theatre to see the performance
Not to hear from the performers about their personal beliefs.
Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. But there is a time and place for sharing those thoughts.
Audiences give their consent to see the performance. They don't consent to hearing from the cast out of character.
If there is a Q&A that people can choose to attend, that is different.
But casts do not have the right to lecture the audience.
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 21, 2024 21:18:41 GMT
I go to the theatre to see the performance Not to hear from the performers about their personal beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. But there is a time and place for sharing those thoughts. Audiences give their consent to see the performance. They don't consent to hearing from the cast out of character. If there is a Q&A that people can choose to attend, that is different. But casts do not have the right to lecture the audience. Thanks for your view OS Appreciated I felt very uncomfortable and ambushed and it quite ruined the show I wonder if I should raise with the venue directly Then it made me think about Belarus Free Theatre Who are obviously an underground political theatre company Is it any different for them to speak out at the end of their show about the war in Ukraine? Or is the context different? Back to the “offending” venue in question The actor stated “this country and your government has supported the Israeli attacks against Palestine for 74 years” “Campaign, strike, boycott and speak out” Although one actor spoke, she indicated this was a united view from all 5 cast members and it was presented as a hostile unilateral statement A stance I mean imagine living in that same country and benefiting from it fully Moreover doing a job which is hardly going to save mankind Hypocrite |
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Post by oxfordsimon on Oct 21, 2024 22:19:14 GMT
Was it King Troll?
If so, they have plenty of overtly political events alongside the production to give the actors plenty of scope to share their thoughts.
But to do so at the end of a regular performance without prior notice is unacceptable.
Theatre is itself a great vehicle for political statements.
But it is for the writer to craft them.
And for the venue to incorporate into the marketing so that the audiences can make an informed choice as to whether to attend.
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 21, 2024 22:22:51 GMT
Was it King Troll? If so, they have plenty of overtly political events alongside the production to give the actors plenty of scope to share their thoughts. But to do so at the end of a regular performance without prior notice is unacceptable. Theatre is itself a great vehicle for political statements. But it is for the writer to craft them. And for the venue to incorporate into the marketing so that the audiences can make an informed choice as to whether to attend. Yes that is correct What pissed me off Is that it was tacked on and out of place and incongruous to what had been presented in the play Like staging a play about Queen Victoria And then giving an anti smoking speech after the bows |
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 21, 2024 22:26:21 GMT
Was it King Troll? If so, they have plenty of overtly political events alongside the production to give the actors plenty of scope to share their thoughts. But to do so at the end of a regular performance without prior notice is unacceptable. Theatre is itself a great vehicle for political statements. But it is for the writer to craft them. And for the venue to incorporate into the marketing so that the audiences can make an informed choice as to whether to attend. Including this event Which was scheduled for 19th October 2024 “Led by King Troll (The Fawn) playwright Sonali Bhattacharyya in collaboration with the Anti Raids Network, this introductory training will offer you accessible, hands-on information for resisting border enforcement in your communities. Topics covered will include how to spot a raid, tools to intervene, and how to build sustainable resistance in the long-term. All are welcome, and no previous knowledge is required – bring your questions!” “Resisting border enforcement” Mmmmh |
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Post by samuelwhiskers on Oct 21, 2024 23:34:49 GMT
From what I've heard the playwright wrote the piece intentionally as an, not an anti-Israel piece exactly, but an anti-something she thinks is bad which includes what she thinks Israel is doing. It's interesting to read that that's not coming across in the text. I don't think the extra political stuff is coming from the cast, but I'm sure they were quizzed about their beliefs on Israel before being cast.
I wasn't planning to see it as until I heard all the political fuss I assumed from the title that it must be a kids' show! There was a play in London a couple of years ago with a similar title about a young boy who discovers that his head teacher is secretly a troll. (The large green kind that Harry Potter once fought, not the kind you find on Twitter.) Much more entertaining!
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 21, 2024 23:52:24 GMT
From what I've heard the playwright wrote the piece intentionally as an, not an anti-Israel piece exactly, but an anti-something she thinks is bad which includes what she thinks Israel is doing. It's interesting to read that that's not coming across in the text. I don't think the extra political stuff is coming from the cast, but I'm sure they were quizzed about their beliefs on Israel before being cast. I wasn't planning to see it as until I heard all the political fuss I assumed from the title that it must be a kids' show! There was a play in London a couple of years ago with a similar title about a young boy who discovers that his head teacher is secretly a troll. (The large green kind that Harry Potter once fought, not the kind you find on Twitter.) Much more entertaining! The playwright Should probably concentrate on her writing skills As she comes across as incredibly bitter She lacks the brainpower and experience and skill and restraint and dignity and self respect To write a truly provoking piece Hence they tack on this tirade at the end The play is entertainingly acted and funny but isn’t nuanced and is an “angry” response but unclear to what trigger other than the treatment of migrants in the broadest possible sense Although it only looks at one single aspect of migration The right to remain No other elements are even touched upon |
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Post by ceebee on Oct 22, 2024 6:44:05 GMT
I pay to see a play / show. I'm happy if the actors do a good job with the material they are given. I am not interested in the least when they abuse the stage to promote their personal views.
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Post by Jan on Oct 22, 2024 6:48:12 GMT
I wonder if anyone else Has ever seen a show Which has BROAD and ABSTRACT political themes And then at the end had actors give a little audience recce on their personal political views Yes I went to a play reading at the Globe and instead of just reading the play the cast treated us to a long personal commentary on it based on Critical Race Theory. I think one problem is that the political views that actors feel able to express in public are all the same and so are entirely predictable and boring. |
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Post by theglenbucklaird on Oct 22, 2024 8:22:28 GMT
I quite liked Michael Sheens pride in the NHS after the Nye Bevan National Theatre play. Slightly different but still a political statement
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 22, 2024 8:46:18 GMT
I quite liked Michael Sheens pride in the NHS after the Nye Bevan National Theatre play. Slightly different but still a political statement Probably more desperation than pride |
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Post by jake on Oct 22, 2024 9:28:02 GMT
It's unacceptable, irritating and, perhaps most strikingly, probably counter-effective. People who go to fringe theatre to broaden their perspective - or even to have their own views challenged - will stop going if they suspect the performance is going to turn into a political rally. So the partisans just end up preaching to the choir.
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 22, 2024 10:26:41 GMT
It's unacceptable, irritating and, perhaps most strikingly, probably counter-effective. People who go to fringe theatre to broaden their perspective - or even to have their own views challenged - will stop going if they suspect the performance is going to turn into a political rally. So the partisans just end up preaching to the choir. Absolutely you hit the nail on the head I won’t be going back to this venue again |
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 22, 2024 10:29:51 GMT
I wonder if anyone else Has ever seen a show Which has BROAD and ABSTRACT political themes And then at the end had actors give a little audience recce on their personal political views Yes I went to a play reading at the Globe and instead of just reading the play the cast treated us to a long personal commentary on it based on Critical Race Theory. I think one problem is that the political views that actors feel able to express in public are all the same and so are entirely predictable and boring. Absolutely Although they are often happy to open their gobs and ask the government for money support and handouts Same apparently awful government who takes a pro Israeli stance And take it happily all the same |
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Post by David J on Oct 22, 2024 17:43:16 GMT
From what I've heard the playwright wrote the piece intentionally as an, not an anti-Israel piece exactly, but an anti-something she thinks is bad which includes what she thinks Israel is doing. It's interesting to read that that's not coming across in the text. I don't think the extra political stuff is coming from the cast, but I'm sure they were quizzed about their beliefs on Israel before being cast. I wasn't planning to see it as until I heard all the political fuss I assumed from the title that it must be a kids' show! There was a play in London a couple of years ago with a similar title about a young boy who discovers that his head teacher is secretly a troll. (The large green kind that Harry Potter once fought, not the kind you find on Twitter.) Much more entertaining! The playwright Should probably concentrate on her writing skills As she comes across as incredibly bitter She lacks the brainpower and experience and skill and restraint and dignity and self respect To write a truly provoking piece Sounds like a lot of writers I hear about across different mediums. Especially prevalent when they're writing for established IPs, where all they want to do is disregard established lore and write their own world views/wish fulfilment/power fantasy/self-insertion fiction. If you're taking an established fantasy or sci-fi world for example, where escapism is what attracts fans to it, and ham-fist current day issues into it, it's very jarring, becomes dated, and plainly obvious what the writer is up to. |
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Post by theatregoer22 on Oct 22, 2024 17:52:49 GMT
I go to the theatre to see the performance Not to hear from the performers about their personal beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. But there is a time and place for sharing those thoughts. Audiences give their consent to see the performance. They don't consent to hearing from the cast out of character. If there is a Q&A that people can choose to attend, that is different. But casts do not have the right to lecture the audience. Thanks for your view OS Appreciated I felt very uncomfortable and ambushed and it quite ruined the show I wonder if I should raise with the venue directly Then it made me think about Belarus Free Theatre Who are obviously an underground political theatre company Is it any different for them to speak out at the end of their show about the war in Ukraine? Or is the context different? Back to the “offending” venue in question The actor stated “this country and your government has supported the Israeli attacks against Palestine for 74 years” “Campaign, strike, boycott and speak out” Although one actor spoke, she indicated this was a united view from all 5 cast members and it was presented as a hostile unilateral statement A stance I mean imagine living in that same country and benefiting from it fully Moreover doing a job which is hardly going to save mankind Hypocrite
As a Jewish person I'd feel very uncomfortable if that happened at a show I was at.
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 22, 2024 18:28:12 GMT
Thanks for your view OS Appreciated I felt very uncomfortable and ambushed and it quite ruined the show I wonder if I should raise with the venue directly Then it made me think about Belarus Free Theatre Who are obviously an underground political theatre company Is it any different for them to speak out at the end of their show about the war in Ukraine? Or is the context different? Back to the “offending” venue in question The actor stated “this country and your government has supported the Israeli attacks against Palestine for 74 years” “Campaign, strike, boycott and speak out” Although one actor spoke, she indicated this was a united view from all 5 cast members and it was presented as a hostile unilateral statement A stance I mean imagine living in that same country and benefiting from it fully Moreover doing a job which is hardly going to save mankind Hypocrite
As a Jewish person I'd feel very uncomfortable if that happened at a show I was at.
This is exactly was I was thinking I felt very uncomfortable myself indeed and the inappropriateness of it was shocking The way the actor spat her speech out in such a vindictive manner was quite horrible |
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Post by BurlyBeaR on Oct 22, 2024 18:41:17 GMT
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Post by oxfordsimon on Oct 22, 2024 22:15:51 GMT
There is a difference in this case as it was a postscript to the event if I understood Parsley correctly
Whereas the political elements were part of the production in Manchester
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Post by parsley1 on Oct 22, 2024 22:49:53 GMT
There is a difference in this case as it was a postscript to the event if I understood Parsley correctly Whereas the political elements were part of the production in Manchester It was definitely an outburst after the bows Including signposting to QR codes to make a donation in the cause |
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Post by jake on Oct 23, 2024 7:36:58 GMT
There is a difference in this case as it was a postscript to the event if I understood Parsley correctly Whereas the political elements were part of the production in Manchester It was definitely an outburst after the bows Including signposting to QR codes to make a donation in the cause Perhaps slightly less intrusive than in Manchester in that the audience weren't forced to participate or, alternatively, forfeit the right to see the rest of the play. But it's still not on. If a production has a political element I would expect to reflect on its message afterwards; or discuss it in the pub or online; or even discuss it with the cast/team in a post-show discussion. Being instructed by a cast member about how I should have interpreted the play's message would make me feel at best patronised, at worst offended. |
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Post by jaqs on Oct 23, 2024 8:46:13 GMT
I found the lecture from Benedict Cumberbatch about refugees/boats annoying after Hamlet, and that was nearly a decade ago. I always hate rich people asking the less rich for money.
I don’t think I could sit through a pro Palestine spiel at the moment. I generally avoid the news and pick my shows quite carefully to avoid anything too depressing.
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Post by theglenbucklaird on Oct 23, 2024 9:36:22 GMT
I quite like the collections they do at the Old Vic Christmas Carol.
A quick google search says we have raised over £1m for some great charities
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Post by christya on Oct 23, 2024 9:42:48 GMT
Did people actually sit through that? Because there's not a chance in hell that I'd be hanging around to be lectured after a play. It's one thing to hear the standard Acting for Others speech if you're around at that time of year, quite another to be expected to sit through a political lecture.
(That production of Dream would also have resulted in a walk-out, and the only shouting I'd be doing would be for a refund)
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