4,799 posts
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Brexit
May 27, 2019 18:56:23 GMT
Post by The Matthew on May 27, 2019 18:56:23 GMT
I wonder how many of the people who didn't vote for their usual party will actually stay away from them at the next general election. Usually loads of people are vocal about their dissatisfaction but then opt for the safety of the familiar when they get to the booth. But then usually the two main parties aren't so comprehensively put in their place.
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4,044 posts
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Brexit
May 27, 2019 20:12:40 GMT
via mobile
Post by kathryn on May 27, 2019 20:12:40 GMT
Usually the two main parties are not so conspicuously useless.
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2,706 posts
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Post by Cardinal Pirelli on May 28, 2019 1:58:42 GMT
In a number of countries the old party divisions are breaking down, France, Italy, even Germany now, with the Greens taking over as the second largest party. The labour and conservative parties need to reposition themselves as they are no longer a fit for the electorate; all the talk about their needing to keep ‘their’ voters misses the fact that they are unable to appeal to all elements of their previous support. Labour has to let go of the idea that they need to keep their leave voters and the conservatives their remain voters. Not because it is all about Brexit but because Brexit has shown up the new divide, nativists versus internationalists. The global economy, the interconnectedness of far flung nations, the mobility of populations and workforces, all need a rethought response.
If labour and conservative want to give themselves a better chance of survival they should quickly legislate for electoral reform as first past the post is becoming a real threat to their continued existence. Similar parties are clinging on elsewhere in the face of Le Pen, Macron, Salvini etc. because of proportional voting systems, the warning signs are there for them.
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4,596 posts
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jun 9, 2019 16:09:24 GMT
This old issue of Rainbow magazine is very pertinent
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4,799 posts
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Post by The Matthew on Jun 9, 2019 17:52:13 GMT
If only we had that as an option.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 18:06:23 GMT
Talking of pertinency..
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5,596 posts
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Post by lynette on Jun 10, 2019 11:30:44 GMT
In a number of countries the old party divisions are breaking down, France, Italy, even Germany now, with the Greens taking over as the second largest party. The labour and conservative parties need to reposition themselves as they are no longer a fit for the electorate; all the talk about their needing to keep ‘their’ voters misses the fact that they are unable to appeal to all elements of their previous support. Labour has to let go of the idea that they need to keep their leave voters and the conservatives their remain voters. Not because it is all about Brexit but because Brexit has shown up the new divide, nativists versus internationalists. The global economy, the interconnectedness of far flung nations, the mobility of populations and workforces, all need a rethought response. If labour and conservative want to give themselves a better chance of survival they should quickly legislate for electoral reform as first past the post is becoming a real threat to their continued existence. Similar parties are clinging on elsewhere in the face of Le Pen, Macron, Salvini etc. because of proportional voting systems, the warning signs are there for them. This is going to happen in UK obviously and funny how slow it has been here. But they /we need to change a few things. The elections rules for one. It must no longer be a thing to lose your deposit under a certain number of votes: the financial backing of the big parties needs to be curtailed and evened out with gov backing to legit political groups. So a complete change of mind set in fact. The country perhaps not divided up in quite the same way and we know how popular that will be. So a long way to go and many, many traps on that way. How I would love to read the chapter entitled Electoral Chaos of the Middle Century published in digital form in a work entitled Decline and Fall of the Western Empire round about 2070 but sadly I will leave that to others.
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5,596 posts
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Brexit
Jun 10, 2019 16:58:39 GMT
Post by lynette on Jun 10, 2019 16:58:39 GMT
If only we had that as an option. But if Boris can't keep the one on his trousers closed, what chance the one on his mouth? Did you catch that play at The Park theatre? Prescient and v funny.
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2,206 posts
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Brexit
Jun 10, 2019 17:50:50 GMT
Post by theglenbucklaird on Jun 10, 2019 17:50:50 GMT
In a number of countries the old party divisions are breaking down, France, Italy, even Germany now, with the Greens taking over as the second largest party. The labour and conservative parties need to reposition themselves as they are no longer a fit for the electorate; all the talk about their needing to keep ‘their’ voters misses the fact that they are unable to appeal to all elements of their previous support. Labour has to let go of the idea that they need to keep their leave voters and the conservatives their remain voters. Not because it is all about Brexit but because Brexit has shown up the new divide, nativists versus internationalists. The global economy, the interconnectedness of far flung nations, the mobility of populations and workforces, all need a rethought response. If labour and conservative want to give themselves a better chance of survival they should quickly legislate for electoral reform as first past the post is becoming a real threat to their continued existence. Similar parties are clinging on elsewhere in the face of Le Pen, Macron, Salvini etc. because of proportional voting systems, the warning signs are there for them. This is going to happen in UK obviously and funny how slow it has been here. But they /we need to change a few things. The elections rules for one. It must no longer be a thing to lose your deposit under a certain number of votes: the financial backing of the big parties needs to be curtailed and evened out with gov backing to legit political groups. So a complete change of mind set in fact. The country perhaps not divided up in quite the same way and we know how popular that will be. So a long way to go and many, many traps on that way. How I would love to read the chapter entitled Electoral Chaos of the Middle Century published in digital form in a work entitled Decline and Fall of the Western Empire round about 2070 but sadly I will leave that to others. Frightening eh?
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Post by hulmeman on Jun 16, 2019 20:17:16 GMT
Just thought I'd share something that happened this very afternoon. Walking my dogs, I stop and talk to a lady I regularly see enroute. Says she, "we've just come back from the airport, he (her husband) likes to see the planes coming and going. but it was full of postboxes". What's that I ask. " You know, women in black with just their eyes showing" she says. I said you can't say that. And this is the bit that chills me to the bone - "why not, Boris does". The man who strives to the highest political office in our country legitimised her saying that.
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4,799 posts
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Brexit
Jun 16, 2019 20:50:59 GMT
sf likes this
Post by The Matthew on Jun 16, 2019 20:50:59 GMT
I've heard similar comments and approval of his attitude. I'm surprised that so many of the Tories are backing him for leader, because when someone's words and actions act as a magnet for racists and xenophobes in the way that his do it's a shrieking alarm warning you that this person is not one of the good guys.
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5,596 posts
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Brexit
Jun 16, 2019 20:55:42 GMT
Post by lynette on Jun 16, 2019 20:55:42 GMT
Just thought I'd share something that happened this very afternoon. Walking my dogs, I stop and talk to a lady I regularly see enroute. Says she, "we've just come back from the airport, he (her husband) likes to see the planes coming and going. but it was full of postboxes". What's that I ask. " You know, women in black with just their eyes showing" she says. I said you can't say that. And this is the bit that chills me to the bone - "why not, Boris does". The man who strives to the highest political office in our country legitimised her saying that. Any chance she was winding you up?
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721 posts
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Brexit
Jun 16, 2019 21:09:07 GMT
Post by hulmeman on Jun 16, 2019 21:09:07 GMT
Just thought I'd share something that happened this very afternoon. Walking my dogs, I stop and talk to a lady I regularly see enroute. Says she, "we've just come back from the airport, he (her husband) likes to see the planes coming and going. but it was full of postboxes". What's that I ask. " You know, women in black with just their eyes showing" she says. I said you can't say that. And this is the bit that chills me to the bone - "why not, Boris does". The man who strives to the highest political office in our country legitimised her saying that. Any chance she was winding you up? I'd like to think so Lynette, but she was trying to justify herself as I walked away.
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Brexit
Jun 17, 2019 10:44:38 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2019 10:44:38 GMT
It's only going to get worse
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5,596 posts
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Brexit
Jun 17, 2019 10:45:16 GMT
Post by lynette on Jun 17, 2019 10:45:16 GMT
Any chance she was winding you up? I'd like to think so Lynette, but she was trying to justify herself as I walked away. O dear
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4,044 posts
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Post by kathryn on Jun 17, 2019 11:18:41 GMT
It really has brought out the worst in people. What ever happened to live and let live?
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Post by Backdrifter on Jun 17, 2019 12:52:09 GMT
It really has brought out the worst in people. What ever happened to live and let live? Completely. It seems that instead of left or right, we are now either leave or remain, and events are now following various fault lines and fissures that radiate out from that.
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4,596 posts
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Post by Someone in a tree on Jun 19, 2019 8:18:52 GMT
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Brexit
Jun 19, 2019 9:09:35 GMT
Post by londonpostie on Jun 19, 2019 9:09:35 GMT
Only just learned Rory Stewart's actual name is Rod (Roderick). Fantastic! I liked him better with the '70s feather cut.
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3,091 posts
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Brexit
Jun 19, 2019 11:27:26 GMT
Post by david on Jun 19, 2019 11:27:26 GMT
Watching the BBC debate last night, with all the contenders sat on stools, was it a really bad Westlife tribute act try out?
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2,706 posts
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Post by Cardinal Pirelli on Jun 19, 2019 18:07:40 GMT
Watching the BBC debate last night, with all the contenders sat on stools, was it a really bad Westlife tribute act try out? It looked and sounded like the ritual suicide of a political party, being beamed live into our homes.
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5,596 posts
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Brexit
Jun 20, 2019 12:43:47 GMT
Post by lynette on Jun 20, 2019 12:43:47 GMT
Two institutions down the tube together - BBC news and the Conservative Party. Nothing lasts for ever.
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1,512 posts
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Brexit
Jun 20, 2019 13:27:38 GMT
Post by anita on Jun 20, 2019 13:27:38 GMT
Go on, that's just Matt Lucas in the photo! I was just thinking that!
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2,206 posts
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Post by theglenbucklaird on Jun 22, 2019 15:20:57 GMT
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Brexit
Jun 22, 2019 19:39:51 GMT
Post by londonpostie on Jun 22, 2019 19:39:51 GMT
Decided it's not a huge deal really, so cancelled the license fee direct debit. I think it was three monthly, and probably about due. Just can't bear the nonsense any longer.
Checked to make sure and BBC radio is free so, for now, I'm happier getting my news in weekly recap form, or maybe the Westminster Hour on R4. It feels half the country has been driven three-quarters mad by hair-on-fire 24-hour news.
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3,091 posts
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2019 12:34:16 GMT
Post by david on Jul 23, 2019 12:34:16 GMT
Well it’s finally happened, Boris is now the new PM. With all his buffoonery is he really the guy who can unite both a divided Tory party and country and get Brexit finally over the line? With the current Westminster political arithmetic, it’s hard to see how he’s going to achieve it without changing the numbers which means going to the country with a general election (and probably risk political destruction of the Conservatives).
With Boris in London, Trump in the U.S., Putin in Russia and Kim Jong un in N. Korea, these are going to be interesting times indeed.
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4,044 posts
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2019 13:05:35 GMT
via mobile
Post by kathryn on Jul 23, 2019 13:05:35 GMT
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2019 13:27:37 GMT
via mobile
david likes this
Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2019 13:27:37 GMT
With Boris in London, Trump in the U.S., Putin in Russia and Kim Jong un in N. Korea, these are going to be interesting times indeed. We were talking about something in 2026 in work the other day and I found myself genuinely thinking “if we even get that far”... hope for the future seriously waining.
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Post by Backdrifter on Jul 23, 2019 13:29:56 GMT
Well it’s finally happened, Boris is now the new PM. With all his buffoonery is he really the guy who can unite both a divided Tory party and country and get Brexit finally over the line? With the current Westminster political arithmetic, it’s hard to see how he’s going to achieve it without changing the numbers which means going to the country with a general election (and probably risk political destruction of the Conservatives). With Boris in London, Trump in the U.S., Putin in Russia and Kim Jong un in N. Korea, these are going to be interesting times indeed. Two things I wish people would stop doing. Calling him chummily by his first name, and referring to him as a buffoon. He's so much worse than that. It's nightmarishly staggering that we've gone from his being unelectable because almost no one in the parliamentary party liked him, to his becoming PM. It's a grim indication of tory MPs' placing of party before country and self-respect. More of which we saw from Javid the other day, with his nauseatingly greasy sucking-up to Farage.
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999 posts
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Brexit
Jul 23, 2019 13:34:24 GMT
via mobile
Post by Backdrifter on Jul 23, 2019 13:34:24 GMT
We were talking about something in 2026 in work the other day and I found myself genuinely thinking “if we even get that far”... hope for the future seriously waining. The debacle with the US Ambassador was the latest in a series of very worrying events. We aren't just drifting into the arena of the unwell, we're sliding into the fetid pit of the toxic.
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